The consumer does not care......

[perfecho]

GF, I think your comment was to ProFarmer…..I am a big believer in local food initiatives and other models. We just held a breakfast through our Economic Development Authority focused on local food and farmer direct. It was well attended, well supported and a number of initiatives are coming out of our Local Food Group. I am actually quite excited about where this may go.
In saying that, it is a small portion of producers it will benefit. But, I have always maintained that success should not be the numbers of animals raised, but the net income of producers….and I think this is where we have been led down the garden path. When we read articles of Japan’s beef industry and how a farmer can make a living on 6-10 animals, albeit intense management, I would like to look at their model instead of the model we have that does not seem to work. Much of our dilemma has been a result of “bigger is better”. If you can’t make a living off of 100 animals, go to 200…….We see the results, and the consumer is (or many of them) skeptical of the produce. In my own business, Gelbvieh seedstock, I am finding the smaller we get, the more profitable and manageable we become.
There is a change in the wind, and I am optimistic about that, but it does mean restructuring our thinking and beating down the “winners” of our current system…..in food production. I think our “World is going to get a whole lot smaller” (Check out the book with that title.). I just hope the industry survives until that point.

[perfecho]

A comment I forgot to include.....My biggest fear for our local food imitative, is farmers won't get on board. Even if we can get a small packing plant.....based on local, not export, my biggest fear is not enough farmers are willing to finish animals. Even thought the system doesn't work, try changing the mindset of farmers. I hope I am wrong.
(Can of worms)
Side note...through some consultation, it appears that a plant of even 50-60 animals a day can be viable....time will tell.

[ado089]

I want to back this up to the start. If you've ever bought beef in the store $1,500/ side is a steal. They're not buying from you because the taste, well maybe, but it still boils down to the fact that they are getting their beef for 50-60% of what it cost to buy it at Safeway. They only difference is the lack of midle man which is fine with me.

[grassfarmer]

Sorry Perfecho, i was confusing my "P's"

On the cost issue - yes we are cheaper than retail by the cut sales - last year we were 75% of Canadian average retail. What's wrong with giving customers a deal? top quality product they want at less than store price and we can still bank $400 more than commodity price. Works for me while we are trying to grow market share.

[smcgrath76]

point taken GF, but that same producer
can also be out of cows in 30 seconds.
It may take longer to get out of the
beef.
Basically what I am saying is that there
are well established and easy to use
methods of trading cattle at ground
level. It is easy to enter/exit at will
as long as you have capital.
There are not so many easy means to
enter/exit the food business. I take
your point about custom kill, and if you
are doing that for family and friends
OK, but what about doing it with 100
family and friends, or 1000 or 10000 .
It is partly a market accessibility and
ease of entry/exit I am talking about.

[perfecho]

As I have commented before, we also feed and sell a few animals. It started with keeping back up 4-H projects. Our customer base is growing, even though we are not "pushing it" and it is growing because of taste, not economics. Actually I price it to discourage customers, but it has become lucrative enough I don't mind doing it. When you take in the efficiencies that we can't take advantage of, (processing)and still come out very much ahead of shipping a fat at current prices, it makes you wonder how much really is made between the farm gate and consumer plate. ( On another post, supposed beef share to producer was 24%?)
The question seems to be how many can you handle? The question should be "How many would it take to make my family a descent living and leave time for life?"

[grassfarmer]

"When you take in the efficiencies that we can't take advantage of, (processing)and still come out very much ahead of shipping a fat at current prices, it makes you wonder how much really is made between the farm gate and consumer plate. ( On another post, supposed beef share to producer was 24%?)"

Exactly my sentiments perfecho - it's once you are selling beef yourself you really see how much money is being made in the commodity system.
Your last figure of 24% being the producer share of the retail beef price is dated - that was in 1999. The figure has since dropped to 16%!!!!!!!!!
Lets all move a resolution at our ABP meetings to press for a Government inquiry into who is making money in the beef chain and how much each is taking. If the packers are making nothing as they claim it should be no problem for them to open their books this time around.

[grassfarmer]

"When you take in the efficiencies that we can't take advantage of, (processing)and still come out very much ahead of shipping a fat at current prices, it makes you wonder how much really is made between the farm gate and consumer plate. ( On another post, supposed beef share to producer was 24%?)"

Exactly my sentiments perfecho - it's once you are selling beef yourself you really see how much money is being made in the commodity system.
Your last figure of 24% being the producer share of the retail beef price is dated - that was in 1999. The figure has since dropped to 16%!!!!!!!!!
Lets all move a resolution at our ABP meetings to press for a Government inquiry into who is making money in the beef chain and how much each is taking. If the packers are making nothing as they claim it should be no problem for them to open their books this time around.

[ado089]

I have a question for you cattle guys. I sold the last of my cattle in the spring of 2003, luckly. But since I've been penciling if it would be worth my while getting back in and I always come back to the same conclusion. On average $100/head can be made, meaning 200 cows taking up my entire summer haying and fixing fence, and making a winter holiday out of the question is going to net me somewhere around $20,000. Even if I can sell 30 of them directly to the customer, barring the red tape and trying to find 60 families to buy my beef it still only just makes it worth my while and at the end of the day is pretty poor pay for having at least two jobs and no freedom. What keeps you in the buisness? At least with grain I have a chance of getting more than I expect, with calves you start with a certain number and start docking profit as things happen.

[vagabonddreamer]

profarmer...boy do i feel your pain...and though i know you were being bitterly facetious about your 1% of the consumer population comment...in actuality...1% works for me...our ranch is near a little community of 15,000 people...largely fruit/wine base agriculture...1% of the community population is 150 people...easily enough to give me a good income selling CWF meat...now...we are slowly building up to that point...i think we have around 30 permanent customers and it grows each year without advertising or marketing...but...this year we are holding back and feeding substantially more...demand seems to be growing...especially when we can invite customers to take their atv's out on range and see the cattle themselves during the summer when they are recreating...also..call me easily influenced...but when people eat the beef and take the time to phone me and extoll its virtues...its kinda cool...

like perfecho...our "feedlot" started because of 4-H...my two youngest kids did market beef/fed beef/hiefer and cow calf...that was feeding 6-8 animals every winter anyway...so whats 15 or 20 or 30 more??? other than capital cost of grain etc...(lol..kinda breezed by THAT part)...

like GF i beleive the number to be WAY in excess of 1%...but even at that..it can still work...i dont know if you saw a documentary called "Food Inc"...but that has CERTAINLY scared some more customers our way...many times i have thought of purchasing enough copies to send to everyone in my community..lol...

now to the REALLY important question that ado asked....why am i doing it???

lol...my oldest son just gave me a wink after reading your comment because he KNOWS what my answer will be...because when i am standing in the bar and a sweet little filly sashays my way and says
"hey cowboy how about a dance"...it makes it ALL worthwhile...i dont know if it would have the same effect telling her that i grow soy...lol...and besides..i know kato likes cowboys...vs