The auction market system

[cowman]

One thing that has always bothered me is the way calves are marketed here in western Canada. When the fall run is on we see huge numbers of young green calves selling every day.
These calves have probably never seen more than a few people in their lives. They are pulled off their mommas, loaded in a strange vehicle, hauled to town, sorted with a lot of yelling,beating, etc., left to bawl and walk the fence all night(often in pretty crumby weather). Go through more noise and beatings the next day, sold in a ring with lots of noise and people, loaded again on a truck, shipped for however long. Then they are unloaded, often run through a chute and processed, and put in strange pens with other strange calves. They have feed and water in front of them that they have never ate or drank before. Will they get sick? The question should be, how can they NOT get sick?
Now I don't have a solution but it just seems to me that the whole system is not quite right or terribly efficient. Should the S.P.C.A. be doing something? Is this really a humane system?

[pandiana]

Wow! I can of worms I think. I happen to agree with you that this is a terrible thing to do to calves in particular and is not particularly nice for animals in general. But this has been the system of choice for all time. I do see it changing however, through satellite and off the farm buyers, although this does not answer all needs.
Preconditioning of calves has yet to be paid for by the buyers. A couple of years ago I weaned some steers in late August, put six weeks of grain into them along with 5 vaccinations including boosters and reeived the lowest price ever for what I though were excellent steers. I detailed the preconditioning on the manifest. Go figure.

[Muttley]

I agree that many calves appear to be under alot of stress at auction marts. But one must remember it is up to us as producers to prepare these cattle for sale. This can be in the way of weaning prior to selling. I myself try to sell as many calves off the farm as possible, not only for the reasons discussed but because I tend to receive more dollars in my pocket.
In a little defence of the marts I do not remember the last time anybody ever phoned me complaining about any calves I sold,and I know for a fact that the buyers keep going back to these marts to buy and I'm sure they would quit if they were getting to high a number of sick cattle. As far as getting somone involved in investigating these places, one better make sure of what they are reporting. I beleive many stories are started by people that do not sell their stock for what they think it was worth and like to blame the auction marts instead of what their quality of cattle are.

[cowman]

I wasn't blaming the auction marts but the whole system. The auction marts are in business to make a buck just like everyone else.
A lot of these calves do get sick despite a heavy use of anti-biotics. And some of these anti-biotics are really good...micotil for example.
When I suggested the S.P.C.A should be involved I didn't mean for them to harass the marts,truckers,farmers, or feedlots but to work toward a system that doesn't allow these little green calves to be sold this way.
The satellite system looks like it could be good but has been restricted now because of user fees just to watch cattle sell. I guess they couldn't make it on a commission alone.
And I'm not saying this system doesn't work. It obviously does or it would have been changed. But like Pandiana said, there is no benefit for treating these cattle in a more humane way.

[Muttley]

What I am hearing after you explain it more makes a lot of sense. I agree with you. I have never sold calves off farm by satellite but the cattlemen that I do know that have, in general felt they really did not gain anything and the best of my knowledge I do not know of anybody that has done it for the last couple of years.
In terms of stress and sickness I bet that alot of it starts at the feedlots in calves that go straight to them from farm.
Maybe a little incentive from our governments to have us feed more cattle at home would make it worth our while. I'm sure everybody would agree with me healthy cattle make better beef. This would benefit the consumer and the producer concerned. On my farm I do not have to treat many calves for sickness and that is probably do to less stress and handling.

[pandiana]

I think that one significant reason that more calves are not preconditioned is that many cow/calf operators do not have good facilities for weaning calves. Its very convenient to round up pairs on pasture, separate them and load the calves on the truck. The benefits are obvious: you don't have to truck both cows and calves from remote pastures,or try to keep them apart at home, you don't take losses from sick or dead calves, and you only have to listen to half the bawling. Until such time as there is enough pressure from animal rights groups or buyers will compensate for preconditioning I see little reason for a major change for most cow/calf operators who do not feed their own calves.

[cowman]

Pandiana:From a strictly money point of view this is the most efficient way of selling calves...which is why it happens. But looking at it in terms of what is best for the cattle(and maybe our health!) it comes up short. When those calves hit the feedlot they are given anti-biotics right away. Not in every lot but definitely in the big ones. It just makes economic sense. Is this really a good thing? If this practice was not allowed you'd see a premium for pre-conditioned calves.

[pandiana]

'When those calves hit the feedlot they are given anti-biotics right away.'
'If this practice was not allowed you'd see a premium for pre-conditioned calves.'
This is an interesting point. But would government be able to make this kind of move? Is public opinion against prophalictic antibiotic use strong enough? I would like to see this happen as I feel we are playing a game of Russian roulette with our industry and health.

[cakadu]

I am reading your comments with great interest and always wondered just how many shots those calves are given etc. and how many they receive during the time they are in the feedlot. I, like many, have probably heard too many horror stories so I wonder just how much truth there is to them.

As far as consumers go, I don't think many of them know just what their beef goes through prior to ending up on the supermarket shelf. It's there and they just assume that the antibiotic use is kept to a minimum, no growth hormones etc. etc. How true do you think this is? Do many consumers have any idea at all what their meat goes through prior to hitting the frying pan?

[pandiana]

An interesting question, cakadu. I have always fed most of my own calves with the exception of a few steers or culls so my experience with feedlots is negligible. Based on my own experience feeding calves, if a good preconditioning program is used with care in getting them on feed and using a comprehensive vaccination program, I have had virtually no losses and very few treatments. We have a strict pen checking regime and treat early. I also count myself lucky as I have so far avoided any of the major shipping fever diseases which, once started, sweep through the herd. On the other hand, immunization programs are not cheap if done as perscribed. Nor is the cost of good calf feed.

However, if feedlots are using prophalictic antibiotics on all calves entering, I am sure they must have weighed this cost and compared it with what they would have to pay for preconditioned calves, wouldn't they?

As to consumers knowing the history of their steaks, I would think that a large proportion of them don't know and certainly don't want to be made aware that their steak was attached to a steer last week. The words 'beef' and 'cattle' have only an academic relationship.
There are some consumers, however, that are aware. I suspect that these are the same ones that look at environmental issues, food safety and the humane treatment of animals. Also, another group of consumers have a background in farming. It would be with these groups I guess that change would be initiated.

[cakadu]

Pandiana - I think you have hit on part of what is propelling the drive towards natural, organic and wanting to know where your food came from, how it was treated and how it was fed. Look at how the big burger joints like Burger King and McDonalds are stepping up how they buy their beef.

What concerns me is that at some point these huge ILO's are going to have to take a look at this growing trend out there and start to address it. A good deal of the questioning of where our food is coming from is rising out of the younger generation who are going to be or are the consumers of the future. They want questions answered and solutions to some of these things.

I am amazed at how many people I talk to who's kids have become vegetarian for whatever reason. That particular eating choice is growing and it has to be addressed. Not to say that all meat eating will end, there will always be plenty of people around who want to eat meat, but this should be sending up red flags.

[Muttley]

Everybody is concerned about whats in their meat. At our farm when we are finishing a beef for our own use we do not use any medication if it can be helped. I use the same principal in the rest of the herd. I use lots of antibiotics per year, but we don't give a shot everytime a calf coughs.

[cowman]

Practically every steer going through a large feedlot recieves a hormone implant and "medicated" feed. What is an ionophore but an anti-biotic? While you and I may raise a fairly drug and hormone free calf that all changes when he hits the feedlot. I certainly don't blame the feedlot. They are told by our best science that this stuff is safe and they are in the business of turning a profit.
If it's any consolation the chicken and pig business is just as bad or worse, they just don't get the bad press!
An excellent book on this subject is "Modern Meat" by Orville Schell from Random House publishing.
On the subject of vegitarianism, I agree that a lot of young people are choosing this life style...I have a grown daughter who is a vegitarian. She is perfectly healthy and my grandson is a very robust young lad who has never ate meat. And actually some of the vegitarian meat substitutes are pretty good.

[pandiana]

I picked up the Nov issue of Cattlemen last night and read the article 'The lungs tell a story of money lost to BRD' which I believe is very pertinent to this discussion.
The gist of the article is that the number of BRD-damaged lungs that were found in slaughtered calves in these studies, greatly exceeded the number of calves which had been diagnosed and/or treated for BRD. These subclinical cases of BRD nonetheless showed a significant effect of the disease in reduced performance (ADG) of about 40 lbs live or 25 to 30 lbs /carcass. The recommendations: "the results suggest we need to take a closer look at mass medicating more than just the high-risk cattle at feedlot arrival." and "Greater emphasis on prophylactics is needed to reduce both clinical and sub-clinical respiratory disease," Griffin concludes. "Earlier vaccination programs on the ranch, mass medication of calves and other steps...appear to be more successful in preventing or reducing lung lesions than attempting to identify sick calves and pulling and treating at the feedyard."
Wouldn't paying cow/calf operators to precondition calves on the farm solve this problem in a more 'responsible' way?

[cakadu]

It seems to me that this is where some of the social costs of ensuring safe food, protection of endangered species, caring for the environment etc. must be shared by more than just producers. There is some concern that all of these "minimal" costs keep coming back on one group without any thought of compensation.

What could be done to spread the costs of pre-conditioning these calves so that all come to the feedlot on a level playing field, or am I dreaming?