ABP report came in the mail!

[grassfarmer]

While I agree with much of your post f_s I can't let this part go unchallenged.

"The reality is those Bills are not going to survive the leadership campaign even if ABP did get some of the worst parts improved. Yes the Keith Wilson dog and pony show continues traveling to every small community that has a hall but those events are just about selling Wildrose tickets."

Falsely inflating the role of ABP while running down the guy who is actually responsible for almost the entire campaign against these Bills is disrespectful to say the least. And I think you are wrong in your assumption that urban vote won't be influenced by the property rights debate. They are all covered by the regional plans too, they mostly own property, many have marriage licenses and all can be equally affected by these pieces of legislation.

[Kathy]

Keith Wilson is a licensed lawyer. Do you think that he would risk his livelihood in a "dog and pony show" just to sell tickets for a political party??!!

FS you're wrong!

Keith will be speaking in Hanna this evening (Wednesday July 27 at 7pm at the Legion Hall on main street) Be there!

I have tried to use the channels of communication with my government, visa my MLA, the Premier's Office, the opposition (so called but really they are MLAs no different than my own, they just happen to belong to a group that doesn't have a majority in this scam)... Maybe pressure has changed some opinions, I don't know... but what I do know... is that when the pedal hits the metal... it WILL TAKE a law suit to alter the course of bad legislation. There may be hope to alter things with a NEW gang in the legislature...if we lose all hope for this, then what do we have...

Keith Wilson is a lawyer and he has been threatened by petty complaints to the board that licenses lawyers...complaints from his own kind who are also members of the leading gang here in Alberta...

Keith is a good man, and I'm sure he wouldn't risk his families future to "sell some tickets" for the Wildrose Party.

Hanna tonight! 7pm Legion Hall

[SADIE]

Kathy---I will re-enforce your comments at this time. I sit here a rancher/farmer in Saskatchewan who saw the whole CAEPLA movement unfold working first as CAPLA dealing with National Energy Board Regulated pipelines on our properties. Been involved in the huge win of organizing the landowners from Hardisty to Maryfield Saskatchewan under the Saskatchewan Association of Pipeline Landowners SAPL who along with Manitoba MPLA won a huge victory for pipeline landowners with the SAPL/MPLA Enbridge Negotiated Settlement. From there the "movement" followed into Alberta with APLA Alberta Pipeline Landowner Association with those landowners coming to negotiated settlement with TransCanada on the Keystone and Keystone XL Pipelines. CAPLA became CAEPLA in Dec 2008. On conference calls that followed Keith Wilson was one of the leading lawyers along with Daryl Carter (Peace River) who talked to CAEPLA group--meaning landowners from Ontario, Manitoba, Saskatchewan , B.C. and Alberta. CAEPLA is across Canada. THere is NO I repeat No Wild Rose Party outside the Province of ALberta so the interpretation that Keith WIlson is alligned with the Wild Rose (Alberta) is a backlash from a few within Alberta.

CAEPLA will scrutinize the work of any governement provincial or Federdal is the language appears unfair to the property rights of landowners.

Wish I could be at the meeting in Hanna Kathy.

[farmers_son]

Keith Wilson would not be the first lawyer to be aligned with a political party. All I can offer is my observation and that is what I see. Mr. Wilson is a good lawyer.

Credit goes to many for fighting the good fight re these property rights issues. The WSGA, the surface rights groups including the ASRG and the ASRF. And yes ABP too. And hundreds of individuals.

To summarize what I see as the reasoning behind these Bills. The present Alberta government has a vision of Alberta being a world leader in energy. Alberta is going out to the world, including China (not just China but China is a focus) and marketing Alberta as the place to invest. The Stelmach government is creating a regulatory environment that will ensure no impediments to investment in this province whether that investment is Chinese, American or otherwise. If, for instance, China were to invest $5 billion in Alberta and needs a transmission line they will get it. If China needs a dam they will get it. The same for a major pipeline, a major road or railway, whatever. Statutory consents, leases, permits even free hold land in the way?…if they are a problem for the major investor the PC government will ensure the problem disappears. I am not arguing for or against this and I may be wrong but that it how I see it.

And for those that think the Wildrose is any different check out their web site. The Wildrose has an energy policy, an education policy, health care policy but no ag policy so I think it is pretty clear how important ag really is there. The Wildrose does have a property rights policy (and again it is just my view) but I think they are worried about the energy sector’s property rights first and foremost. (I am trying to be non partisan here, not favouring or singling out any one party).

The other point I was trying to make is the days when agriculture called the shots in this Province are long gone. I have said in this thread there is only one issue and that is jobs. It is not property rights. It is not agriculture or even food. It is jobs. Again I may be wrong but consider CAPPs (Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers) ads on TV and the message there is energy equals jobs. Not property rights. CAPP gets it…farmers still have yet to figure it out.

If there is anything that might come out of my mouthing off here it hopefully is the beginning of some recognition that agriculture desperately needs to change its messaging with government and the public. I mean really. No question property rights are crucial to everyone not just farmers. Property rights are the cornerstone of our free enterprise/free market society. When our property rights are ignored everyone loses. That affects the economy and that affects jobs. That is the message that needs to be heard. I am not hearing Bill 36 or Bill 50 can cost you (the urban people) your job. And that needs to be heard. If you can’t find a way to make that connection between issues that are important to us and the city person’s job then do not be surprised if government does not listen no matter how many small town meetings are held.

Property rights equal a strong economy equals jobs. Farmers equal jobs. Local food equals local jobs. Ag equals jobs. The new bumper sticker needs to be Alberta beef equals jobs. More jobs, better paying jobs, jobs for you, jobs for me. Now you are communicating.

[per]

OK fs, I buy exactly what you are saying and completely agree. Notwithstanding inasmuch as we agree on this, the property rights "movement" needs to keep going. However, we; ABP, WSGA, ASRG, AGLA, CAEPLA could do well to cooperate on that message. "Agriculture Depends on Property and the Ability to do Business on said Property as does the Oil Sector and that translates into Providing Jobs inside and outside every Community." The campaign starts now....

[per]

If you eat you are involved in Agriculture. Agriculture provides processing, transportation, retail and warehouse jobs.

Good thing I have a tee off time to spare you from my thinking through the keyboard!

[ASRG]

The four land grab bills have one thing in common and that is this: Under these four bills the "rule of law" is wiped out and we will have "rule by cabinet"?
Without the "rule of law" in a parlimentary democracy....there is no real democracy....but rule by the MOB! When the individual loses his right to the "rule of law" he loses ALL his
rights. The rights to his life, his liberty and his property!
That is the message we should be trying to get across. If people are too dense to get that, maybe they deserve what they get? When people give up their freedoms and rights for security, they will soon have neither!
I'm not completely sold on the Wildrose...but they are the only party saying straight out they will REPEAL the four land grab bills and bring in a Property Protective Act? I personally don't have a problem if they want to protect an oil companies property rights, if it upholds the "rule of law"? The unilateral cancelling of the oil sands leases in the lower Athabasca, under the Land Stewardship Act, was wrong....despite whatever the compensation was? The thing to focus on here was this: The cancellation was done by the cabinet and denied the oil companies the right to challenge that cancellation in court? If they can do that to a large foreign corporation....why not you? Why not your house....your cattle....your bank account?
The fact is the land grab bills are the first step in denying you every right you thought you ever had!
This is why this government should be turfed. This is why we should be leery and suspicious of any group that acts as an "enabler" to this evil movement to steal our rights!

[Kathy]

I agree fs with what you're saying. This is a very difficult time for everyone. I don't agree with Keith Wilson on his stated beliefs for WHY all this is happening. His information on the law is second to none though. The WildRose Party has one problem... its a political party.... how can one ever agree with the collective actions of a group, when people like me... have such strong feelings about specific issues.. like nuclear power... totally against it... but Wildrose will go for it if SNC Lavalin can say it's all privately funded... (this direction is being implied by their purchase of the commercial division of Atomic Energy Canada. Creating an illusion that the government is no longer funding nuclear power).

Our politicians are puppets.... they go with the flow and cater to the ones with the most cash, influence, and at election time... they promise the moon to the taxpayers and then quickly forget their promises after they are elected.

The problems we face are based on our individual lack of conviction and courage, to do what we feel is right (not just for the province as a whole, but for ourselves as well) We settle, bargain, and concede all the time... we are weighed down by legislation, bills and too much work.

Why do we work so hard, so government can squander our tax dollars. I stayed at home with my kids and don't regret it for one minute..... We can get by on a lot less than we do already... and we are frugal to an extreme.... Our kids have grown up to be good people, they are working hard and have great friends. Had I worked off the farm for the extra dollars I don't think things would have worked out as well.

I give Keith credit for his hard work, but worry that even this noble cause might rob his family of their time together.... I gather a lot of hope from the comments made on this message board... everyone is passionate about their lives.... take your passion to the city and keep the faith. Nothing defeats evil more than shining a bright light upon it.

[farmers_son]

Some very thoughtful comments. I certainly agree the property rights movement needs to continue. I have spent my adult life involved with property rights and expect to be involved for the rest of my life.

I am somewhat uncomfortable if ag is jumping into bed with the energy sector when it comes to "property" rights. I for one never trust the energy companies and never feel they are our friend. They would use farmers if their purpose suits it and then turn on agriculture in an instant when it does not. Are our grazing leases the same as a speculative mineral permit? Maybe, maybe not. I would like to think that a grazing lease that has been in existence since the thirties or longer is more tangible than some of so called "property rights" the energy sector is up in arms about. Some of the rights the energy sector is wanting to be compensated millions for are pretty ephemeral, intangible and speculative.

Anyway it is a big issue. It seems to me that the PCs in Edmonton have a short time frame before the next provincial election to bring their vision of Alberta being a world leader in energy to fruition. In the meantime there is a lot of really questionable stuff going on especially with the transmission line issue and the Bill 50 lines.

Per may have a tee time but for me the weather forecast has finally straightened up and it is haying time. I have to end my comments here.

[rkaiser]

Well -- if ABP is going to go the direction of policy and politics, it seems they have a man for this job in our friend FS.

[per]

"Alberta Beef Producers (ABP) was established in 1969 for the purpose of initiating, supporting and conducting projects and programs to stimulate, increase or improve the production and marketing of beef cattle and beef cattle products."

While I agree that fs makes a pretty good policy hack, it doesn't seem to fit the stated mandate of the ABP. In his defence though Randy, he doesn't claim to represent the ABP here. Fs certainly knows the Land Use subject.

[per]

The golf game was good and I am back putting up hay as well, although it is usually to wet in the morning so I see another tee time coming up.