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At the risk of starting a big brawl.....

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    At the risk of starting a big brawl.....

    Just gotta toss out some thoughts here.

    Here's the setup.....We background calves. Have done so for thirty plus years. In the past few years, in general, the Angus influence has grown in the cattle population in general.

    That being said, I have the following observations to make.

    Under an identical management system, over the same past few years we are seeing a drop in weight gain on the average of about a quarter of a pound a day measured over a fairly large number of calves, not just a small batch. This has been consistent for the past four or five years. We always had a 2.4 to 2.5 pound gain on the exotics, while now it's closer to 1.9 to 2.1 on the more Angus groups. The feed consumption has not changed. They eat the same amount of feed, and we've got weigh scale tickets to prove that. We buy prepared pellets, so there's no fooling ourselves on the feed costs.

    We are also finding a larger spread in the gain on individual calves. We buy them in within 20 to 30 pounds in weight, and after 150 days, as of this morning when we weighed them, the spread was 300 pounds from the best to the poorest. Inconsistency is rampant.

    Toss in the crackpots who smashed their faces into gates on the way out of the scale, the one who actually climbed the side and jumped out over the top, and the ones who came back to attack, and I must say my liking for the Angus breed is not very high this afternoon.

    I just can't get why these cattle are so popular.

    At least they don't have horns.....

    #2
    If you need some easy doin Gelbvieh genetics, that cross well with..............;-)
    I have been saying it will catch up sooner or later, and I think later has come, although you have to give them highest honors for their marketing.

    Comment


      #3
      Like any other breed, there are animals from certain bloodlines that are feistier than others SO I HAVE BEEN TOLD. Some people like my Dad for example regarded the Angus cattle as fence crawling trouble-makers...others loved them.

      You will not get consensus on this forum about Angus or any other breed...there are just too many who are convinced that they are right and others are wrong.

      If these observations of yours are of concern, I would look into feed quality issues first and rule that out before looking at the other aspects of management.

      From my own observation...there are certainly variations in temperament among animals of the same breed. Maybe your getting some rogues...who knows, we are not privy to all of your statistics. Keep plugging away...maybe a clearer picture will evolve as time goes on or perhaps the next lot will surprise you and alter all of your conclusions.

      Comment


        #4
        I don't see the feed being an issue. We buy the same ration time and time again. It's made by the feed mill, and needs to meet quality standards. As well,I'm comparing this over probably close to 1600 head, so I'm pretty sure it's not one random batch. The only thing that's changed has been the breeding of the calves.

        We have friends who have gone to backgrounding exotic heifers rather than the high priced steers on the market now, and they're finding the performance to be as good and sometimes better than the steers.

        Comment


          #5
          In any breed there is huge variation.
          If you are buying calves in they could
          even be coming from very few herds with
          large differences in performance between
          sires, even within the same herd. I
          hear you on the feed thing. Selection
          for easy calving and nice looking (fat)
          genetics has made a difference over time
          I think. Also, with the need to reduce
          labour at the cow/calf level I think
          that selection for performance has eased
          off. Since most C/C folks don't feed
          their calves, they won't notice feed
          efficiency changing, and it is also darn
          hard to select for.
          Also, if they are known AN cattle that
          is different than known black cattle.
          And for a final blasphemy, I think a lot
          of folks who sell calves off the cow
          really don't give a rat's behind about
          anything past the end of their own
          loading chute.

          Comment


            #6
            Just to add my two cents, my dad always said that if your cattle operation was a survival of strong operation, then angus was the breed to have. Best dam mothers in the world. If you have a desire to be with your cattle lots, then angus cattle will eventually shorten your life span. Only you can make that decision. Sometimes money is not always top priority in what you do.

            Comment


              #7
              I wonder if the BIX program will ever get going to the point that cow calf producers actually get some feedback. I think there may be some eyes opened there.

              Comment


                #8
                I agree and disagree with you kato.
                I think if BIXS gets rolling we will see
                a lot of good cowherds damaged seeking
                traits that don't impact the bottom line
                for straight cow/calf guys.
                The system is adversarial between
                sectors. If you sell weaned calves in a
                pre-sort the best thing your cattle can
                be is the desirable weight of the day
                and the same frame score/color as
                everyone else's.
                I think it really only has opportunity
                for those looking to do something
                different than the status quo.

                Comment


                  #9
                  yes agree with kato the angus are not gainers like the crossbreds results in 4-Hcalves show charlay cross doing better on rate of gain .
                  feedlot show same result all over 3 lbs rate of gain on crossbreds,
                  the pure black angus breed stay behind in rate of performance,on pasture gain and getting fat to soon for there size
                  in the feedlot
                  we have some modern bred angus coming up so watch you buying of calves !!!!!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I'm not sure what damage would be done to a cow herd chasing traits that improve carcass results. Which traits are those?

                    Calving ease? Milking? ????

                    I think it's possible to have ease of calving, good weaning weights, and a good carcass result all in one herd. People who finish their own calves know it can be done, because they are very likely doing it now.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      that's exactly the word kato - chasing.
                      All things in balance, and a good
                      crossbreeding system overcomes a lot of
                      the issues. For example, genetics for
                      performance and lean yield come at a
                      cost to fertility (as does milk beyond
                      environmental capacity). On the other
                      hand genetics for ease of fleshing and
                      ease of calving (eg: birthweight) often
                      come at the expense of performance.
                      Selection for marbling will reduce yield
                      if not done in balance, etc.
                      Balance. Balance. Balance.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Crackpots? Good indication that there's some improvement to be made in your stockmanship, as in with everyone's including my own.

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