Does Democracy work at ABP? part 2

[loric]

As far as a forum on the ABP website, it certainly has been discussed. The new ABP website is nearly complete and should be live on January 2nd. At this stage there is not forum, just the bare bones of information. It was what we could do with our 2007 budget. However, with budgets in mind, we will be able to constantly improve the website on an ongoing basis - and a forum is one of the things that is being tossed around to use with the 2008 website budget.

[farmers_son]

Rkaiser: And here I thought I was picking on you LOL.

You have been given an opportunity to influence change within ABP. I hope you take that responsibility seriously. As coppertop pointed out ABP has a lot of clout and you can be part of that or you can sit on the side lines and offer criticism. It really is your choice. If you wish to gain a seat on the board of directors (as a renegade or not) you will need to gain the respect of at least the delegates within your zone or the voting delegates at the AGM. How you gain that respect is left up to you.

ABP is certainly is the most influential commodity lobby group in Alberta. As well as that influence extends nationally and internationally. Is ABP perfect? No. Is every checkoff dollar spent wisely? Probably not. And you and the other 70 or so delegates can work for improvement and change. Change will probably not happen as fast as you would like.

As the leading cattle organization in the province ABP will bear the brunt of producer criticism and thank yous for what is accomplished are always far and few between. As an ABP delegate you will find that out for yourself. Being a delegate is for sure the best way to find out all the ABP is about, all that it does and all the issues that are part of the cattle industry in the province. I would encourage others to consider running for a delegate spot as well. I realize that some prefer to work for change within other organizations like BIG C and NFU and I respect that. I would not be surprised if most of the ABP delegates had not been members of some other lobby or political action group before deciding to join the team as an ABP delegate and working as part of the most influential and dare I say it democratic commodity/lobby group in the Province of Alberta.

[rkaiser]

Wow - great speech batman - you'd think you were running for a seat on the board of CCA or something.

The number one lobby group --- questionable at this point in time. Irresponsible may be a better label.

As far as earning respect farmer-son, the situation is two sided. There are a few numb skulls sitting as delegates who are going to have to show some respect before I take another crack at the board.

Thanks for the update loric --- I know you can't resist this site. Fun isn't it.

[rkaiser]

Just thinking about the irony in your last little Butter job for ABP and the gang batman.

While pointing out the democratic dream that you hold dear for ABP, you also pointed out one of the many fundamental flaws in the governance of the organization.

You said that I would need to earn the respect of other board members. If this organization was as democratic as you dream and those other board members had been actually elected to their positions rather than mostly acclaimed, or maybe squeaked by over one other willing soul at a zone election, your suggestion would be founded. I am not saying that respect is not important, however I personally feel that as a democratically elected official, my respect must be to those who put me in the position I am in in the first place.

If you had been at my zone meetings batman, you would have realised that all three speeches I made concerned the value of BSE testing for export marketing purposes and very little more. Since the only other candidate running was an incumbent, I was quite sure when I was elected that it was my speech and not so much my respect and admiration of the status quo that that got me there.

Once at the AGM and I saw a resolution on the BSE testing issue that put me in the room come up with support from the three zones where it appeared, I was quite sure that democracy would prevail. Rather the opposite happened as a couple of so called experts came forward with their opinions and an obviously planned vote took place.

Sorry to go over the story again - and I would like to hear your informants version as well batman.

[farmers_son]

Or it could be that people do not appreciate being called numb skulls. You might have to polish your approach just a wee bit. You can take that advice or leave it. Just human nature I suppose but people are more likely to listen to you if you are willing to listen to them. It is one thing to be outspoken but do not blame ABP if the other delegates do not line up with you on your resolutions after you go out of your way to insult their intelligence or dismiss the years of hard work they have put into the organization when you had just been there for 3 days. My humble opinion. Example...a former ABP delegate, Tom Livingston, was often outspoken but he did it in a way that kept people on his side, usually with a joke. It is a skill that needs to be learned and I have no doubt you will learn as you go on.

And as far as I know every board member is elected, not sure about the 3 feeder people how they get on the board. On our county council most of the councillors were acclaimed so I do not know how the fact that there was an election in your zone gives you any special privileges.

[rkaiser]

Come now batman - your informant must have told you how respectful of the people and the rules I was at the AGM or anywhere else in public for that matter.

As far as calling someone a numb skull - I have that right here on agriville -- do I not. Just like you have the right to hide out. Don't you worry batman - I've been called more than a numb skull by many a delegate; even right at zone meetings.

I did not call anyone a numb skull at the AGM buddy, but likely should have. If I insulted their intelligence by pointing out a different opinion that I believe is the opinion of most primary producers --- oh well.

When I talk of elections farmer_son I mean at the zone level and you know it. As I have said before - the AGM is fairly close to democratic, it is the system that gets the folks in to the room that really has problems.

[per]

It is quite and eyeopener to actually witness how arrogant the ABP boosters have become. I would hesitate to call them numskulls, but maybe they are simply stuck in a paradigm. A place where eventhough some great work is being done, and credit goes to them for that, somehow visonary or even radical ideas keep being supressed. As if, not coming from them, it could not be benefical in any substantial way. BSE testing might have passed its shelf life, but it is still a tool that should be in the tool box. We have been told how the United States is the most lucrative market in the world. Does not lucrative denote profit? It has been anything but that for the past several years. A small market that has profit is lucrative, a large market with losses might be called ludicrous. Should the US be ignored, or given up on, or disregarded? Of course not. But we don't have to bequeath our soul to them either.

The response to this conversation is always that science will prevail. What happened to the customer is always right? When you order a new truck and you want heated seats, eventhough heated seats are not necessary for the function of the truck, they will comply with the request if you will pay. Then the question then becomes, who asked for BSE testing? It doesn't really matter because the tool isn't in our tool box so we couldn't turn one out of our factory anyway.

That is where the most powerful industry group ever would come in. It should be a walk in the park having the CFIA comply. Or is it that they are afraid that they don't have that much influence.

This cow-calf producer does pay dues to the ABP and does participate in the electoral process and that implies that in a democratic organization satisfactory answers, other than "why don't you run" or "it is just a volunteer position", should be forthcoming. Other organizations are supported by voluntary dues and if I am not happy with the management I can vote with my monitary support.