True costs?

[grassfarmer]

I'd sure be interested in hearing the name of the fund
that has averaged that over the last 15 years
Freewheat and what the management fees are. I'm not
saying there isn't money to be made in the
stockmarket just that since 2007 investment of any
kind has been more volatile and the returns
considerably lower than the decade before.

[freewheat]

The management fees are between .8 and 1.1
% generally.

The thing with funds, is you gotta stick
with them through thick and thin, and
dollar cost average them, so you are
buying more units when the price is lower
as well.

[grassfarmer]

If your mutual funds were all in Canadian based
companies you basically get the average of the TSX
less management fees no? The TSX topped 15,000
nearly 5 years ago and is now at 12,750 - what is the
game plan if it remains in the 12's or 13's for another
5 or 10 years? The good years pre-2008 will be
diluted by more poorer years so your 15 year average
will drop. Historically I would agree stockmarkets
have always risen and it pays to stay in but I think we
are in dramatically different territory at the moment.
An awful lot of people, in fact most i'd think, that
owned mutuals funds in 2008 will not have recovered
their capital lost back then.

I had one managed fund with a real successful track
record - from set up in mid 90s it's only single figure
year was 2000 when it did 9%, most years were 12-
15%. It dropped 30% in 2008 and the managers don't
have a clue how to recoup that. I started investing
directly for myself after that and am ahead of that
fund by quite a ways and don't have to pay a fund
manager.

[kato]

I wouldn't even think of selling land and trying to make money in stocks, or on the non existent interest rates of today unless I had already maxed out my farmland capital gains exemption. That is the game changer, IMHO.

The stock market is too risky to put all your hopes into. It's only to be played with using money you don't mind losing. This year seen lots of tax returns where the financial advisor made much more money than the investor. In fact, I haven't seen one where the advisor made less. That should tell us all something.

[grassfarmer]

There are ways to mitigate risk in stock-market
investing kato, its not a total crap shoot. Just as there
are ways to mitigate risk in agriculture.
I agree with you on the advisor thing though - lots of
advisors taking $10k a year off individual investors
with no responsibility when markets and their
customers accounts drop 30%. Funny thing was when
I started studying investing myself it became clear
how poor these advisors can be - buying too late,
selling too early - school-boy errors and they get
paid just the same.

[grassfarmer]

There are ways to mitigate risk in stock-market
investing kato, its not a total crap shoot. Just as there
are ways to mitigate risk in agriculture.
I agree with you on the advisor thing though - lots of
advisors taking $10k a year off individual investors
with no responsibility when markets and their
customers accounts drop 30%. Funny thing was when
I started studying investing myself it became clear
how poor these advisors can be - buying too late,
selling too early - school-boy errors and they get
paid just the same.