hot cow market

[forage]

Sadie , I have never had any problems approaching the ranches in my area, alot are very proud of their herds and more than honoured that I have choosen their breeding program. I am not talking buying large volumes as I stated only 5 or 6 from each ranch that has the breed I want. I am not afforded with the time to sit at auction sales with everybody with the same mind set of buying dispersal cattle. The cows are always bid way over the true value.
Of course the limiting factor is cash available at time, have only been able to buy a 10 or 12 a year so it has a been a slow process. I remember my Grandfather always saying if you cann't pay cash for a cow you shouldn't own it.

[forage]

Sorry the last thread was to GF not Sadie

[grassfarmer]

So are you talking purebred or commercial cows?

[forage]

GF Commerical cows Red Angus cross Semi. Trying to build on that cross. Slow process but I am backgrounding all my heifers every year and taking only best 25 or 30 for replacements. Most of my cow herd is now being replaced from my own program but I am always on the hunt for cows from other ranches with the same cross. There was a posting here about dispersal sales, just a side note a friend of mine from Rocky area has a neighbor who has a dispersal every two years at either Red Deer or Innisfail auction marts. Just a game but if you know of a old time ranch that is really getting all their herd maybe ,just maybe you can find good replacements but you have to stand in line with multiple buyers with their hand in the air. Paying a local ranch a few extra dollars to me elimenates the hassles at the auction and the exposure to any disease problems.

[grassfarmer]

forage, setting the purchase debate aside for a
moment I think you have a problem with your
breeding strategy. F1s can't replace themselves - they
make fantastic commercial cows but they can only
breed down, not up.

[forage]

Not trying to breed up to purebred status ie 1/2 to purebred . Commerical only, let the ones who have time to parade their animals from show to show and drink lots of whiskey.

[grassfarmer]

I'm not talking about breeding up to purebred status
either - I'm talking about maternal function and
efficiency. An F1 can't produce you a replacement
that will match her no matter what you breed her to.

[SCS]

We shipped pot load last week and 12 were for bred cow sale, useable cattle but didn't fit our Purebred herd. The market bought 400 of the 500 offered in bred sale!

In two week the Tax market will hit!

SCS

[SADIE]

gf---I appreciate your comment on purchasing F1s and not keepping them. I locked into that plan 12 years ago now and have strategically gone back to the same supplier and purchase 7-10 of his bred heifers every year. That is why I sell all females as opens going to grass select sale in April. I have switched from using RA bulls on my RA(sire) Sim Dams to now a Blaze Sim on these F1s. the first calves will come this spring.

My herd is uniform and relatively young.

The animals are predictable. Minimal calving problems and temperment is quiet. I need that for my herd. Sometimes pricey but now in the game so I will stay with it.

[ASRG]

I think if you switch back and forth on bulls you will get a relatively uniform cow herd. Some of the modern Sim bulls are those big old radical things anymore.....while some of those angus are getting pretty big!
In a commercial herd they don't have to all look like peas in a pod. They all sell good in a presort sale? For most people finding a quality source of F1 females at a reasonable price is difficult.
At the end of the day it all comes down to dollars and cents.

[ASRG]

sould be: Some of those Sim bulls are NOT....

[grassfarmer]

SADIE, If I understand your program correctly your
herd will be uniform. It's the next generation that
won't be - as mature adults the F2 generation will
exhibit the range of variation present in the
Simmental and Angus gene pool you use. I would
predict using an F1 bull will produce even more
variation than using an Angus back on Angus crosses.

ASRG, good job the Simmental breed has taken on the
Angus characteristics and the Angus breed taken on
the Simmental's characteristics to keep your switching
program working. The cattle types haven't changed
the breeders have just switched breeds yet continue
to register with the same Associations they always
did!
I think for a commercial producer owning a herd of
Simm/Angus F1s and crossing them with Charolais
would be a good choice. Done well the dollars and
cents this would generate would allow you to buy
some good replacement F1s.
I don't agree with you on the pre-sort sale being the
cure all. I think it's a stage worse than the poor
practice of weaning calves into the auction - weaning
them into the auction after deliberately mixing 15 or
20 sources of calves into one lot. Just asking for
health wrecks at the feedlot.
If we are to go forward on a more value added basis
in terms of the buyer rewarding cow/calf producers
for their genetics through the likes of BIXS data and
rearing calves than can more healthily transition from
their dams into a feedlot setting the presort will
become a thing of the past.







In a commercial herd they don't have to all look like
peas in a pod. They all sell good in a presort sale? For
most people finding a quality source of F1 females at
a reasonable price is difficult.
At the end of the day it all comes down to dollars and
cents.
IP: Logged
Edit?
ASRG posted Dec 3, 2012 11:15

[grassfarmer]

note to self - remember to delete pasted comments.

[ASRG]

grassfarmer: I will agree with you that the presort is a recipe for disaster on the healthside! In fact I would almost say it should be outlawed (as well as shipping green calves off the cows!). My personal belief is "how in the hell can they not get sick?"
However......that is the system the industry has chosen? They really don't pay anything for doing things right?
This is something that has bothered me for many years.....and maybe someday I will be called to account for what I have done...but it won't be in this world.