Ralph the bonehead!

[pandiana]

I understand that the expression, Triple S solution, originated in the states and pertained to the imported wolves that were supposedly bringing down their cattle. It has been in use since applied to owls and other protected species.

Now what farmer on either side of the border wants to be the next one to have a cow test positive for BSE?

The expression certainly speaks to the heart of our problem. I don't think there is much argument that this will be a common solution with no dead stock removal or at a cost of $50 to $75 was quoted in Alberta. I think most agree that downer cows should never be transported...so triple S. I am sure that Rcalf members having been doing this for years. How many BSE infected cows have already gone this way in US and Canada will never be known.

Unfortunately, even though Ralph's feux pas was a reflection of reality, it can and will be used in the worst possible way as ammunition to prolong the border closure by making it look as though we are deliberately circumventing BSE testing our cattle. This is really not the case as the spot checking (1:200 I think)that is done is not just downer cattle but all cattle going through the system, as I understand it.

[pandiana]

I have been reflecting for some time about whether we should be testing every animal to satisfy our export partners.

Some of the information available:

There is no scientific data to support an serious BSE outbreak in Canada or US.

Probabilties suggest if 1 is found there would probably have been at least another 6 in Canada and US, if it can been shown that prion infected feed was the source of the problem. (Apparently, a causal relationship has not yet been established) Of those 6 possible cases how many actually went into the feed chain? If so, if they were slaughtered at 14 months, prions would probably be below the level of detection.
If over 30 months, how many bought the Triple S solution? All in all, there shouldn't be that many around.

According to Wendy Holm, a journalist that specializes in public policy in agriculture, Canada has a good weapon its not using: the Free Trade Agreement. "closure is based on politics, not science, and that's not permitted under NAFTA...NAFTA has a whole chapter on agriculture. The right to restrict trade because of health concerns from diseases such as hoof and mouth, blue tongue and - yes - BSE falls squarely under the Sanitary and Phytosanitary sections of NAFTA. And the referee is SOUND SCIENCE, not protecting markets in Japan. NAFTA also guarantees investors rights of access and compensation when those rights are denied" http://www.cbc.ca/insite/COMMENTARY/2003/8/14.html

Cost is still a stumbling block for me. I am sort of leaning towards testing the estimated 650,000 to 750,000 cull cows (those waiting for disposal today). At the least cost scenario of $50.00 per test that would only be $32,000,000. The government of MB put in $20,000,000 to support their farmers, they could use this. If SK and AB would anti up, they could pay for the rest. Of course, this is ongoing, as their will that many more each year, maybe more if our herds grow to accomodate heifers retained due to lack of markets.

So with an aggressive testing in place, every old cow sold on the open market, would another case be found? Would that provide more ammunition to close our border for another 7 years?

If we tested every animal, would the US be pressured into doing likewise?

Is one case of BSE in our large cow herd and huge area equivalent to 120 cases in Italy or Japan? Should we be puting more pressure on re-writing the rule book?

[cowman]

Pandianna: the fact is perception is the whole ballgame. Now the Japanes insist we have everything tested. Which is how they operate. If we want to sell into their market...we test. And frankly if we want to sell into the American market we test????
And quite frankly what is the problem? We test we sell, we don't test we don't sell! Why is this a problem? Is it the $25-50? No problem here!
I just got an E-mail that there is a quicker, cheaper test out on the market. Will we go that way or will we risk pissing off the Americans who seem to have no interest in safe beef?

[carebear300]

I am for testing every slaughter animal and every other measure that is deamed necessary to get the beef moving across the border into the united states and the rest of the world. The only thing is that there had better not be any meat let into this country that is not tested or once again the canadian farmer will be put at an economic disadvantage to other producers in the world.

[dalek]

carebear I'll go you one more and add no beef should be let into this country from any country that doesn't have a traceback system. Ohhhh what country do we know that has NOOO way of tracing most animals back?

[rusty1]

Tere's one thing for sure - if we test every animal we will find another BSE. Lets get real - we'll test just as many as the rest of the world. If the USA test 205 we'll test 20%. If they test 75% AND report everything, we'll test 75%.

[ValueChainFX]

If we test 100% and have a true tested, verifiable trace back / trace forward system the supplier of that product will have another marketing tool!

This would be a good thing!!

[Bruce14]

Now I realize Ralph isn't perfect and agree that the SSS statement played well a couple of months ago but is getting old now. (Kind of like telling the same joke 3 times at the same party to the same people).

BUT if you Albertans want to send him one province east some of us would gladly take him. We'll send you the two leaders that are running to be our next Premier in a two for one deal. In my mind its pretty weak choices with McClaren and Hermanson.

Yes if we test every animal over 30 months we probably will find another case but as Valuechain states at least our customers would that the hamburger they are eating came from a negative animal. We need to have higher standards than the rest of the world now especially the US.

If I have to spend $60 to gain $600 it seems like a pretty good return on investment.

[cowman]

Valuechain is right on this one. We need to test every animal going for slaughter. Then we know every piece of beef we eat is 100% safe from BSE! At the same time do the test for Johnes and E coli.
They say there is a new test coming down the pipes that can be done on live animals. It's relatively cheap and fast. Now has our government been pumping any money into this research? If not they sure should be!
It would be imperative that any other country sending meat to Canada would need to have the test done. That rule is allowed under WTO I believe...food safety. The Americans, Australia, and South America would either have to play catch up or stay out of our markets. Maybe we could raise the whole level of food safety to another level, worldwide. And for the consumer that has to be a good thing?
If we had our own packing plant and tested everything how would that play out in our domestic market? If you went into Safeway and saw a steak that clearly stated "certified BSE free" would you pay the extra one cent on the price? Generic steak $5.98...certified steak $5.99? Based on a $50 test per animal and 500 lbs. of saleable meat? Why wouldn't this work?
I suspect the Americans wouldn't be too happy! This certified product would tend to show what hypocrits they are on this whole BSE deal! Their own people might realize that their packing plants and government don't really care at all about the consumers safety.

[cowman]

Well I guess my math isn't so good this morning. Should have been 10 cents not 1 cent!