Grain or cattle

[WiltonRanch]

I blame a lot of the decline in cows with BSE mess of 2003. Cows aren’t a get rich proposition. When cattle were the only thing making money it was only because everything else was losing money, land costs were depressed. Grazing was reasonable. We expanded our land base and numbers in the bse years. Even as it has improved from then everything else has gone up. We downsized our herd to what we can handle around home. Everyone is getting older and it’s hard to find help. I figure if we are at a number which best uses our rough ground and complements our grain side then that’s all I want. Seems like it’s an economy of scale. Certain herd sizes are too big but not big enough. 250 head used to be a good number but now I fear it’s probably 400. If you’re mixed it’s getting to where unless you’re a colony a 250 head herd and 2000 acres of crop requires so much labour at times you’re not doing a good job of neither and I wouldn’t put all my eggs in cattle. Get a bad drought and those cows still need to eat.

[grassfarmer]

You cow guys are squeezing the wrong end of the teat here. Demand more for your product and maybe we'll still grow you some feed.

And how's that working for you in the grain sector?

[Sheepwheat]

When I look at Google earth, or drive around the prairies, I often wonder how many cows or sheep or goats etc. could be integrated into most grain farms on non producing land for virtually no cost. Many quarters are easily half sloughs, and nothing has used them for decades. Obviously things aren't as bad as some grain farmers would have us believe, at least not bad enough to want to work that hard.

I do the same thing from the road ways! I find it incomprehensible the amount of land sitting there doing nothing, when it could be producing meat.

My take on the livestock issue, is mainly that the younger kids have not lived through rough times like the parents did. They simply do not have a real need for more money. Wife works, farming is play time for almost all my local neighbors. Farm does not even have to pay the power or phone bill, her paycheck does. I mean this in kindness, it is simply what I see all around me. A few other reasons I see:

1. It takes work and today, most are against that.

2. Why raise animals when you do not financially have to?

3. If I have a bad year, dad has a lot of equity and will bail me out.

4. I need that winter trip after all the hard work of sitting in machinery that drives itself, for a few hundred hours.

5. BSE

6. No money in cattle/sheep, whatever. Trouble is, some of us DO see money. It is like anything else, some make good money, others point at sask ag and food figures as though they are gospel, and a guarantee to lose money. It helps no one to have those "fact" sheets that invariably show losses. The key here is knowing your numbers, not theirs.

7. There is a lack of initiative to try new things. You do not have to farm livestock like it is 1954 any more, there are a lot more options open with feeds/grazing etc. Kids do not know that.

8. It takes time to build a flock/herd. Staying power is essential. Grain is easy, in 90 days, you grow a crop. It is an instant gratification world today. Tying oneself down to YEARS is not attractive to most.

9. There is little historical knowledge. When the older guys sold the cows, the up and comers were often in diapers, and have no clue about what it is even like to have animals. The dads do not encourage it, because they would have to build fences again, Buy balers, etc., and so the kids do not even know it is an option. The dads don't make it an option. Balers are expensive don'tcha know! They are like 60 000 new, son! While the cheap 600 000 dollar combines sit in the cheap 400 by 100 shed! lol

10. Get bigger, bigger bigger. Farming has always been about getting bigger land bases. Livestock, especially some types bucks this trend. It is engrained in us from a young age that unless you farm a certain way, or have a certain acreage, or have a semi or three and grain carts and auto steer and variable rate, and independent opener drills, farming is impossible. DO NOT EVEN TRY it! No one talks about the goat lady who sells goat kids for a killing, off of 80 acres, and makes her entire living off that land base. Or the guy growing garlic on 12 acres who makes more that most grain farmers do. About the alpaca farmer who on a quarter of land, does just fine, owns a store that sells their wares, and is adding 500% value to the raw product. No one talks about the very comfortable 700 acre grain farmer who runs 30 year old machinery, and is a millionaire. It is not sexy, it is not usual, so most kid farmers laugh at those types rather than ask questions and try marketing.

11. Grain farming is sexy, millions of dollars of equipment is sexy. Telling people you farm 23 000 acres is sexy. We all know the drill. When ppl find out you farm, they immediately ask you, how much, as if this is all that matters in the world. Saying 800 acres is not sexy.

[Hopalong]

All the years we had cattle, except toward end, used to think that grain farmers got a better deal from governments.
Crow freight rates, wheat board prices guaranteed, crop nsurance support and more.
More recently, Agristability is a disincentive to diversification.
Decision to get out of cattle was two fold, lack of profitability and trying to do justice to more than one enterprise
Do have a problem with some land not suited to grain farming. Do not want to sell it since it is surrounded by other land we farm. Cost and upkeep of fences, along with crop damage when cattle do get out, has been a problem, even when they were our own cattle.

[malleefarmer]

Livestock and mixed farming making huge comeback in australia over last 5 years. wools good lamb is good and beef whilst the heat has gone out of the market is still good.
Dairy industry is struggling