Consider this

[cowman]

The $80 or $56 or whatever it is will be paid on every calf born in 2003, it is just a question of who will get the money? For the guy who sold his calves into that "very strong fall market" that the feedlots like to go on about, it will mean the feedlot will get the money.
Now lets look at that "strong fall market"? First it was erratic as hell! Prices all over the board. Discounted anything that even looked at the auctioneer funny!
I suspect the bottom line is the feedlots put steers into their lots for an average of $1 or less and heifers 10 to 15 cents less than that? Now with the firming up of the fat market in the last few weeks I suspect some of those "outrageously high priced calves" are pencilling out very nicely? Also consider the lower grain costs?
So now on top of a handy profit...here comes a government check! Not too bad a deal for owning them for 4 months?
The cow/calf guy should have got this money, plain and simple, the feedlots/packers got the $400 million.

[rsomer]

Exactly so.

[grassfarmer]

The one week that sticks in my mind was in early November- Satelite sale when Douglas Lake sold several hundred calves and their char steers at 600 lbs hit $146. These cattle will lose money however things pan out surely? I heard Neil Janhke sold his calves in September and averaged higher than 2002 - so some were up, some were down.

[max]

Maybe if the c/c man wanted the $80/hd or even a share of the $400 million then they should of had the guts to retain ownership of their calves instead of being "taken advantaged of" by the big bad bully feedlot operators. Enough whining already, the feedlots took the risk to own these cattle in an uncertain market place. Consider this, think how screwed you will get if our feedlots go broke and are bought up by American money. Bam 25%less for calves. Instead of crying about not getting any money(by the way you are,$300mil transition payments) take this crisis as an oppurtunity to make changes, streamline your operations to become more profitable. Take your negative whining energy and put it to something useful

[max]

Everyone is so quick to use the words Whining and Crying. Every one of us is simply trying to survive. Why is it that the lower we are on the food chain the easier it is for the guy up one step to put you down. I can't believe how feedlot folks like johnnyboy and max have become so much smarter than the lowly cow calf guys.

[cakadu]

max - I will say that you are correct on one thing. When the cow/calf guy started selling to the feedlots some 50 years ago or whenever that was exactly, that is when the cow/calf guy gave up the value in his calves.

Yes, it would be great to "break" the system as it now stands and have it become more of an even playing field, with all players making a reasonable return. Please note that I said reasonable return. That is all any of us want to make for our products.

The feedlot owners got plenty of help for the uncertain markets that they were faced with. It seems to me that the feedlot owners also had a choice in that they didn't have to fill up those lots if there was that much uncertainty.

Personally, I do believe that there will be a silver lining in all of this and I hope that it works more in favor of the cow/calf person than for those further up the chain.

I also seem to recall several weeks ago that the big feedlot owners were doing their fair share of "whining" as well and if they didn't get help in 3 to 6 weeks, they would be finished. Well, it seems as though most are still around. (Kind of reminds me when Pat Roberts said if he didn't get $1 million in donations, he would go to heaven - well he's still here too.)

Part of the reason for these rooms is to provide people with a place to express their views, opinions and thoughts. It is very tough out there in agriculture right now - a little compassion on all sides will go a long way.

[grassfarmer]

johnboy,
maybe it's not just the cow calf guys that are ignorant? In your above figures you imply paying $1.30 -$1.50 for 5 weight calves last fall, well maybe if you bought very badly on the dearest week you could have paid that. In the implied 5 months you have fed them they have only gained 200lbs - I guess they weren't even very good the expensive calves you bought? Only gaining 1.3lbs a day? that's costing you 77c/lb of gain. Or maybe your figures are like most of your contributions here.

[johnboy555]

if you do your math on backgrounding your probably very close........bout 1.3 to 1.5........goin to grass.....

[CattleAnnie]

To some of us it wasn't an option whether or not to retain our calves.

Guts had nothing to do with it, Max, it was called drought and finances.

I needed to sell the calves last fall in order to purchase more feed due to the drought we're experiencing in our area, and the banks were pounding at the door looking for their payments.

Believe me when I say that it was not a choice to send my potential replacement heifers down the road last fall, but I've got a family to feed, as well as a herd of cattle to overwinter.

Thanks for the insulting statement though, I'm sure it will go a long way to bridge the angst between the cow/calf and the feedlot people.

Mind you, the majority of both would have more sense than to think that either side is a bunch of "whiners", they would understand that as an industry, everybody needs to stick together, not point fingers.

Have a nice day.

[surespendalot]

Just be glad some money is coming towards Agriculture. It may not always go exactly the place that some of you think it should, but at least it is more dollars in our economy than what we had, and it will filter down to the rest of us.

We need the feedlots to stay in business and to keep paying for our calves just like the feedlot needs us to keep raising calves . They also are dependant on the sileage growers to keep growing feed, and the grain farmer to keep growing barley. None of us can exist without the others, unless each one of us wants to go it alone and raise the calf from conception to finished beef. Each of us excel in some particular aspect of our industry, few of us are experts in all areas. We should each put our efforts into what we do best and enjoy doing the most. (They are probably one and the same).

Lets stop all the name calling and finger pointing and try and be a little more tollerant of the others in our profession. If I was a politican and read some of the articles written here I'm afraid that my thoughts might be " We try our best to help the Agriculture industry, but all the farmers want to do is bicker and complain that someone else is getting a bigger slice of the cake than they are. Sounds almost like a kindergarten class with a few candies"

Lets be thankful that at least some outside money has come into the industry and lets hope that the people in government are able to make some policies and deals and agreements so that each of us is able to continue doing what we are good at and what we enjoy.