Aging beef?

[cowman]

I think everyone can probably agree that aging beef makes it tender? But is it practical on a large scale?
Consider the amount of cooler space a modern plant would need to hold beef for fourteen days. I'm not sure on my numbers but if Cargill kills 3000 head a day they would need cooler space for over 40,000 head! Now you can just bet that would get the old power meter spinning!
On top of that cost I wonder what the shrink would be? Even 1% would be costly? And then how would the customer view this meat at the meat counter? And how much trim would be necessary and how would the shortened shelf life affect profitability?
And in the end would the average customer be willing to pay the extra costs?

[cakadu]

All of your questions are quite obvious. To support the export driven market that we Alberta ranchers have become used to, I guess the arrogant American packers can do whatever they please. Don't you feel even a bit shameful (I do) being involved in an industry with such dependence on muti billion dollar corporations that could care less if you or I survive? They have already gained a large share in the feedlot industry, and will take over the cow/calf sector as well, when the time is right. How on earth do we continue to live in a free enterprise system without resorting to bigger is always better, and to hell with the small farm? I don't like socialist politics, or the idea of government regulations, but out of control "monopoly power" is not the answer either.
Your arguement about hanging beef being costly is well taken, and I don't beleive that you are meaning that you support everything the packers do.

[nerves]

There are differnt was to age beef. Most common is dry ageing with this type where you will have alot of dehydration over 28 days up to 8% on the carcass.Another way is cryovac the carcass,(put in huge plastic bag and suck out the air) very little moisture loss which in turn will led to more tender meat. Most of the time you would take off the hamburger and trim and just seal up the roasts and steak cuts on the carcass.Also remember that stuff from the store has die added preservatives and hamberger will also have huge amounts of binder and the odd time they will throw in some ice to grind up with the meat to add moisture and weight to the cheap hamburger you buy. It is always good to talk to many processors before you jump into it. So you can find what suits the idea you are trying to sell if you want quality you must sell quality. Most processors are between 40 and 60 cents a pound to do a beef. The more processing they do the more expensive it becomes. ie sausage jerky pepperoni etc. We need to get the urban population to know that true quality comes from the farm gate and not the store. The more of us that get involved with this pasture to plate thing the easier it will be to compete with thease gaint companies.

[grassfarmer]

Nerves, You seem to know quite a lot about this slaughter business. I am in agreement with you and am planning to sell hormone antibiotic free grass fed halves of beef this fall. I have the cattle,the knowledge of grass fattening but don't know enough about the processing stage, where can I find out more. If you have done it before perhaps you could write down some average figures like starting live weight, cold weight, actual weight of beef to sell and the costs involved.

[nerves]

Ok grassfarmer I will my best. First off it takes two of us my wife has a lot to do with the operation and what goes on. We don"t think we are being treated fair by big business and it is time to do some marketing. As I said in another thread the carcass evaluation seminar is great place to start to learn about marbling and to understanding ultasound. You will go on a tour into XLs plant in Calgary and they will show you how they grade and do marbling.It is put on by the Calgary Stampede and last about 4 days. Seems to me that the cost is about 400 bucks and meals are supplied. The course runs in june or july and books up early. Here is phone number from 2 years ago hope it still works. 1-800-661-1260 or 403-261-0162 Next was a question about live weight to carcass weight usally runs 60% with 40% being waste. Now if you were to debone that to straight meat you would lose another 30% to bone. Talk to some processors they all have differnt prices to do the work and may cut you a deal if you have volume. I don"t know were you are from so here are the laws as I know them in Alberta. The processor plant must be provincaly inspected to sell your meat in Alberta. Outside of province then it needs to be federally inspected. A good way to sell meat is have the buyer pick the meat up at the plant. Otherwise if you start to do deliveries you will need to get permit from your health divison saying that you have a vechical certified to deliver meat.(that is another topic). A good clue as which processors are good is ask a buffalo or elk farmer were they take there meat. If they can make them tender think what they can do for beef. Hope this helps there is lots more but I don"t want to turn this into a novel. We are all in this together and through shared Knowledge maybe we can make a differnce.

[grassfarmer]

Thanks Nerves that's a good start. Earlier you said we need to "get the urban population to know that true quality comes from the farm gate and not the store." Maybe the time is right for this. I see another tremendous show of support by consumers attending the beef sale in Edmonton tonight - wanting to help out farmers versus packer/
retailers. We emailed around 16-20 (mainly city) friends last night with an offer to sell them beef this fall and we have already had three write back wanting to order. There is a lot of work ahead of us and lots to learn but I feel encouraged for the future.

[cowman]

Rpkaiser: I don't like how this industry has turned out but you know that's just how it is and I doubt it will change? Now I'm all for the guys out doing what they have to do to survive, but for your average Joe Farmer that just isn't going to happen? They just aren't interested, don't have the money or time to become a packer/marketer? Actually about three quarters of them are ready for the old folks home!
So in reality the packing industry, that we have today, is probably always going to process the majority of the cattle in Canada? And if the cow/calf sector basically packs it in I suspect they will step up to the plate and raise that calf? I imagine they would rather continue to steal them but if they have to they would probably also raise them?
Grassfarmer: I saw a poster advertizing a BSE seminar in Innisfail, Alta. on April 2. Two of the speakers are talking about their experiences of direct marketing beef...one especially is selling organic grass fed beef. You might find it interesting. Red Deer County is putting it on and it is a day long thing. I think the cost is $10 and you get a roast beef dinner.

[grassfarmer]

Nerves, I'm still trying to get a better grasp on the likely slaughter and processing costs associated with retailing beef from the farm. I read your figures for liveweight versus carcase wight versus actual meat weight to mean that a 1200lb fat animal would give a carcase weight of @ 720lbs but boned out this would produce around 500lbs of saleable meat?
I see widely differing prices quoted by various sellers - when guys quote $3.00/ lb per hanging weight that would refer to the 720lb carcase I assume. Other people quote a price per pound on a 150 lb box of cuts which is much higher.
So what does it cost to slaughter, hang, and cut up a carcase into two piles for two customers wanting a half each - on a per animal basis? I'm talking at a Provincially inspected slaughter plant - what are the advantages/ disadvantages of a mobile custom slaughterer?
Sorry to be asking basic questions but it is all new to me - just as well we won't be slaughtering before September !

[cakadu]

Cowman - not everyone has to become a marketer per se - just have a market or consumer oriented focus in what they are doing. You are actually better off working in a group and finding that one or two people that are good at marketing, rather than trying to have everyone doing it.

I'm not 100% convinced that you need to have an entire structure set up around marketing the beef - it can be something as simple as a bunch of producers agreeing to work together, finding a processor that they can work with and that fits their needs - either a provincial or federally inspected plant - do the marketing homework about what consumers want, are willing to pay and how much they need and then having a delivery mechanism in place to get it where it needs to go.

Grassfarmer is headed in the right direction because he is asking the questions that should be asked in terms of figuring out one's costs and what one needs to charge in order to turn a profit.

There really isn't a magic bullet to all of this - just a desire to work together and putting one's ducks in a row.

[cakadu]

cakadu. Yes we can work together without loosing our individuality. Ranching is a complex business and trying to know, and do everything is near imposible. We do need Vets from time to time, and I have personally found that a nutritionist is a valued part of our system.
You can't imagine the time and energy it takes our "marketer" to sell beef. Sure I have learned a lot about carcass yeilds, and cutout percentages, and it has had a major impact on the herd sires we choose, but I have a job. And even though most of society sees it as "simple" and peasant like, I am proud to say it is my job and I take it very seriously.
So yes find help, be part of a group, individual pride is still attainable with assistance.

[greybeard]

Can provincial plant accept animals that have been slaughtered at home? Can you sell this meat thru a restaurant?
When there are no flies , home slaughtered is much less stressful and more tender.

[nerves]

Ok grassfarmer Well see how good my memory is on your questions. You can set what ever price you want 3 bucks a pound for hanging weight is high. A processor will cost about .50 cents a pound to do a basic cut wrap freeze and to age the beef. the more processing that has to be done the more it cost ie sausaged jerkie hamburger patties etc. There is also a kill fee and disposal fee each processor is differnt ours is about 60 bucks. We base what we charge by the animal and its quality. If it is a middle age cow we want a buck a pound hanging weight. so that on top of basic cut and wrap is 1.50. We add on .25 cents a pound for delivery because we then have to get permits for the vehicle that we use. We thought about a reefeer van but the health officals didn"t like the idea of selling out of it due to the doors being open alot a changing the temperatures in side. The box beef starts to get higher because the bone and trim is removed. Box beef also has to labeled and weighed on a metric scale Your processor should also be able to do this but it cost more. Cryovac is also another option as compared to wrapping that way the customer can see the meat they are getting. The price is a little more to do this but is comparable. Mobile butchers can kill beef for yourself, and if you sell a live animal to a customer and they get him to do killing it is ok. But you cannot get him to kill the animal take to the facility and then sell it to your customer. We also price calves higher than cows it all works out to about 2.50 a pound less than the stores for steaks and roasts. The hamburger is comparable in price to the stores for the low end hamburger and extra lean we can beat the stores by a buck a pound. With this in mind our cows are bringing 900 to 1300 dollars to us and the calves are bringing at least 1200 dollars. Is this worth the time it is up to you. It is a lot of work but what isn"t? Remember these cows live weights are around 1600 pounds and the calves are 1000 pounds right now.

[cakadu]

Greybeard - in a word the answers to your questions is no.

Legally, you cannot sell anything killed and processed on your farm - it is for your immediate family's consumption only. A mobile butcher can be used as has been stated, but again, the animal can only be slaughtered for your own use, so the animal has to be sold to the party that is getting the mobile butcher to process it before hand.

The liability issues around selling uninspected meat, I suspect, would be too much for yourself and whatever restaurant you were thinking of selling to, to contemplate doing it.

Even with wild meat that is taken by hunters, it cannot legally be sold either and it is usually stamped by the processor that it is "uninspected meat -not for resale".

There are many that would likely agree with you that to have the beef (or whatever livestock) dropped on your farm and processed there is a lot less stressful for the animal and you end up with a much nicer product.

[cakadu]

Greybeard - in a word the answers to your questions is no.

Legally, you cannot sell anything killed and processed on your farm - it is for your immediate family's consumption only. A mobile butcher can be used as has been stated, but again, the animal can only be slaughtered for your own use, so the animal has to be sold to the party that is getting the mobile butcher to process it before hand.

The liability issues around selling uninspected meat, I suspect, would be too much for yourself and whatever restaurant you were thinking of selling to, to contemplate doing it.

Even with wild meat that is taken by hunters, it cannot legally be sold either and it is usually stamped by the processor that it is "uninspected meat -not for resale".

There are many that would likely agree with you that to have the beef (or whatever livestock) dropped on your farm and processed there is a lot less stressful for the animal and you end up with a much nicer product.

[farmboy1]

Grassfarmer,
Shop around. Freezer beef is more financially rewarding, but it is a lot of work. I'm selling steers that are raised mostly on high quality forage (silage) with a little bit of by-pass protein-mineral-vit. E sel supplement. Grading AA and dressing out over 60% (Holstein steers). Dressing around 600 lbs. and retailing for $2.30/lb. This is cut, wrapped, frozen, and delivered. It costs me 35 cents/lb. to have it done at a provicially inspected plant and the kill charge is paid for by the hide. This is in eastern Canada. The cattle are not implanted and receive no feed additives other than the fore-mentioned ones. I guess it qualifies as natural beef (a broad term) but I don't yet push the concept. Be prepared to fully guarantee the product and do some satisfaction follow-up. I guarantee that most of the people out there don't know how good fresh hamburger is. They are used to the grocery store's ground-up leftovers (yuck!) Or, you can avoid the hassle and sell your fats for $1.18/lb. dressed. $708 vs. $1380. However, developing a customer base is a slow process and not for everyone. I did some advertising in the newspaper and received 0 orders from it. It works better for me by word of mouth. If you know and trust the person, I'll take 6 post-dated cheques for a side of beef. Possibly VISA, as well. A side of beef @ $750 is a big hit for most people at one time. There are a lot of poor people out there. One figure I got from my brother-in-law (an inspected packer)is that by-the-side beef costs the customer a little over half the showcase price. You just have to figure out how to get it to them. If you have good beef, they WILL NOT be disappointed!