Now What?

[Horse]

Word is king Ralph is talking an election this fall I sure wonder what is coming our way now , mabey he gave away the last bit of sovenerty we had ,it probaly wont be pretty.
I sure hope what ever it is all albertans get to share and not just the ag sector this time .

[cowman]

Well I just hope he dosn't say something stupid again! He almost sank us the last time he opened his mouth!
I often wonder how long it would take to get the labs up and running if by some miracle Canada decides to test everything? I wonder if it would take as long as getting some sort of new packing plants up and going? Seems we aren't doing too well at getting any new packing plants built? Maybe it would take three or four years to get the labs built? I assume they would have to be public labs as I doubt Cargill or IBP would be keen on putting up the money...and I guess we all know how speedy the government is at getting anything done?

[cowman]

I hadn't heard this! I thought the plan was to go to the people after the Queen visits next summer?
But in reality this fall might work very well for Ralph and his bunch. Afterall there is no real opposition right now, even though the Tories have done a totally dismal job on almost everything they've touched.
I suspect a lot of people in Alberta would be very receptive to a new party that actually might represent and stand up for Albertans, instead of one that stands up for the International corporate sector...whether that is the international oil corporations or the American packing industry?...but that doesn't seem to be happening?
It really is amazing that the Alberta Tories have been able to hold on this long. I guess mega-oil bucks can make the most inefficient clod look like a genius?
Ralph Klein is no dummy! He is a master at manipulating people. He says these outrageous things that get the rednecks all fired up...but in fact that is all he does? And usually makes the rest of the country think we are all a bunch of clowns?

[cowman]

Almost sunk us?

How the hell can you sink when your foot is tied to a rock at the bottom of the lake. Kind of sounds like a bit of hope in you cowman. Who is it that you feel you can go to if it isn't Ralph?
Yes we should have started something ourselves a long time ago, but look how hard a grass roots group like BIG C has simply dealing with synicism from guys like you and rsomer.
New meeting set for Camrose, and probably Olds in the next week. Bring rsomer and all of your answers along.Or just continue to find the negative in everything everywhere.

[cowman]

Well rpkaiser, When you stand up and say the farmer should just shoot, shovel and shutup, I don't think that really sends out the message that we have a safe product and are trying to do everything in our power to ensure it is safe? Probably was really reassuring to the Japanese?
Perhaps I am being cynical regarding Big C. I hope they can convince the powers that be, to at least consider a test...who knows that might frighten the Americans enough that they get real about this border? Maybe then we wouldn't have to even consider the test?
I am not against testing. Never was. In fact I believe there should be a test on every animal...and not because I want to see the border open...but because I have a lot of problems with this whole BSE thing and I think we've been lied to and I don't believe one whit of the "science" of BSE! It's simple really...I don't know if our beef is safe? I would like to think I'm not killing people by feeding them a tainted deadly product! I don't want my children or grand children dying because some so-called "scientist" didn't get it right!
However, having said all that, I realize that a "test" for all cattle, probably isn't going to happen. The best we can hope for is that "voluntary" testing will be allowed. And consider, that statement, I just made? How far have slipped into a dictatorship when we aren't even allowed to test our own food for safetys sake?
Rsomer, argues one way because he obviously believes in the science! I argue my cynical way because I think I have a pretty good understanding of how the system works...and I'm tired of tilting at windmills! And maybe that isn't right, and maybe I'll answer for that one day...if so...Shame on me.

[CattleAnnie]

Yeah Cowman, it does make one wonder, doesn't it? The only problem I have with the gov't taking responsibility (hypothetically) for BSE testing on that scale is that I keep thinking of the fiasco they made with their stupid gun control legislation. What a colossal waste of money and effort.

Hey, an aside here, has anyone received any Federal cull cow money? Hate to be waiting for a gov't cheque, but the vet would really like his bill paid.

[whiteface]

Saying a test will never happen is like saying you'll never win the lottery. Absolutly correct if you never buy a ticket. If enough of us ask for testing and they still say no well, revolutions happen this way. BUT WE HAVE TO BOND TOGETHER AND DEMAND WHAT WE NEED TO SAVE OURSELVES! Whining about what simply cannot happen doesn't get anyone anywhere. It can and will happen if we work at it happening rather than laying down and dying. Same goes for packing plants that we also need, the two go hand in hand. Takes a little while to get things going but that is why we have to get moving NOW with our requests and demands. My father, who I love and hope is resting peacefully, would be proud to hear me preach one of his favourite sayings, " the best time to plant a tree was ten years ago, the next best time is right now." Lets get on that testing and plant building thing, RIGHT NOW, if we haven't already and be ready for looking after ourselves regardless of what the US plans to wing at us next. They're only stalling hope that they'll open the border with us because they absolutly KNOW we are in a better barganing position with Japan and they must get there first or lose that market perhaps forever. Why would the Japaneese go to the States when they could just come here? Lets run with that. By the way, Mexico says they will not relax imports of American meat until the US relaxes with Canada. Tit for tat. Other countries recognise that the States looks dumb for demanding that their meat be accepted when they refuse the same meat from Canada. "Calling Canada's meat unsafe is like calling your twin sister ugly" I think says it all. Hold the US accountable and don't let up. They're covering up like crazy down there and the one case they have only surfaced in a desperate attempt to keep Canadian meat out when we were on the verge of having it go south again. They don't deserve export markets, we do, let's get them.

[whiteface]

Sorry, Annie, I meant to make a specific comment on your post. I'm scared to death to that our government could waste a bunch of time and resources with BSE just like that bullony with the gun registery and I too, am expecting a cull cow cheque, only mine will be endorsed right over to my feed company, who has been paying for those cull cows all winter!

[whiteface]

I'm sorry you don't like Ralph, cowman. Face it, Alberta is in better shape than alot of places on the planet, and don't give me oil as the reason why. Lots of places have oil and many other resources that Alberta does not and are not faring quite so well. My best advice, if Ralph irritates you so much is move. I did, specifically to share the "Alberta advantage," I'm not originally form this province. Your land is worth a fortune and I bet anyone in Saskatchewan, Manitoba, P.E.I., shit anywhere, including me ( but I don't work for your situation since I live only a spit form you!) would be happy to have you come and buy them out and you'd still have a wad of cash left over! Hopefully that would bring you a little happiness! Good luck! :-)

[cowman]

Whiteface: I actually once vaguely considered moving to Saskatchewan. Actually went over and had a look in the Yorkton area. And while I loved the country and the people I decided I was too old to be that adventuresome!
Besides I like Alberta. When my great grandfather came here it was all the frontier. Now I am very close to a fairly large city. Good restaurants, a good hospital, Major A hockey, lots of machinery dealers...in the fastest growing area in North America.
Kind of hard to move out to the sticks after you've seen the bright lights? All my family and friends live here and my ancestors are buried here.
I actually have a very good life if it wasn't for my darned health! About thirty years ago I decided to chase the buck rather than a lifestyle and I've never regretted it! In fact it allowed me to chase the lifestyle too! Which is why I have my son home with me instead of having him far away working in some office. I don't think I made too many mistakes in my life to tell you the truth.

[CattleAnnie]

No problem, whiteface! I was chuckling over your response as it made me think of the much sung praises of that "trickle-effect" that the gov't subsidies were supposed to have for the cow/calf producers. Unfortunately by the time the trickle gets to us, it simply seeps right out into another service sector. Oh well, not complaining, (I'm sure not qualified to perform c-sections), just enjoying the irony of it all!
Take care (it's raining up here - second consecutive day with some precipitation-hooray hooray!!!).

[cswilson]

Ohhh Saskaychewan isn't all bad lol-we've muddled through it here for 87 years so far.

[cakadu]

Like it or not, the royalty money off of oil does play a huge part in what happens here in Alberta. Just how much of a surplus do you think we will have now that oil is in the stratosphere and so is gas?

No other province in Canada has oil like Alberta does - although they are discovering how much is actually in Saskatchewan.

If we didn't have the oil money, we wouldn't be sitting so pretty and it is what is driving most of what happens in this province. Despite the fact that agriculture accounts for 1 in 3 jobs in this province, where does ag sit in the grand scheme of things? If we lost all our ag production tomorrow, we would still have food and I daresay because we are of the "have" ilk, we can have whatever we want because we have the means to get it here from around the globe.

If we didn't have the oil revenues we wouldn't be paying down the debt as quickly as we are - it's just that simple.

There is an ever increasing gap between the have's and have not's in this province and that should be of concern to us all.

[whiteface]

I don't doubt at all that there are some perks to living in your neck of the woods, cswilson ( I'm thinking property taxes for sure off the top of my head) but yeah, cowman, I love a lot of things that being close to a major urban center offers as well, in fact, when I first told friends I was moving to Alberta (from just outside Vancouver, most people gasp just at that!) I was mocked about how unless I moved very close to a city, I would likely forget how to speak english, and would have to import my nail polish! You guys have all heard the jokes, are there any microwaves/answering machines/internet access, you name it. Turns out, I'm the one who wins with wonderful rural people, all the amenities one could ask (including nail polish) and not only do I remember english, some of these nice country folk speak in ways that I am so proud to have been able to learn! Like they actually like each other rather than want to kill one other in a drug-savaged, over taxed, over crowded environment. I'll never go back, which is why it's more important to me than ever to find a way for our industry to survive. Otherwise myself, and a lot of us will be "stuck" in a city working a 7-11 instead of the freedom to enjoy the city but a few (sometimes more) miles out.

[rsomer]

Kline was on a trade mission to China and South Korea from May 31 to June 9. Information on the trip can be found at http://www.gov.ab.ca/premier/missions.cfm and the text of Klines speech in China is at http://www.gov.ab.ca/premier/dsp_speech.cfm?content=129
Kline was focusing on resuming imports of breeding livestock genetics.

Rpkaiser: In one thread you call me an eternal optimist, in another a negative cynic. There is no easy route to resuming international trade once a country has had a case of BSE and there is no point pretending there is. The only countries I see buying our beef are the U.S. and Mexico. They are not requiring a test and if we could only slaughter more cattle they would take all our beef.

Cowman: I do not believe in the science of BSE. Obviously the science is interpreted by each government to suit their purpose. Bottom line I believe the science does not know what to make of BSE. I do believe in focusing our limited resources on doing things that have some hope of success however. Unfortunately lobbying in favour of 100% testing has little hope of success as our governments have clearly set out their policy on testing and producers contrary efforts could actually serve to delay the opening of our borders to live cattle going south and weaken consumer confidence in our product. Japan and U.S. will work out the rules for trade between North American and Japan and that will end up being the new science. It might involve testing and it might not. As grassfarmer pointed out Japan and Europe are taking different approaches to BSE and for that matter so is North America. We all need to remember the incidence of BSE in North America is very, very low when compared to Europe and even Japan. We can’t forget that. Given the truly minimal testing Australia is doing, I think it is fair to say our beef is every bit as safe as theirs. Safer because we are removing the SRMs on OTM cattle and Australia is shooting, shoveling and shutting up.

I prefer to focus my efforts on seeing packing plant capacity built. 100% testing offers no competitive advantage for a new packing plant, all plants will be testing the same. Right now in North American that means surveillance test.