Restoring Pastures

[cakadu]

I guess we're lucky with our sheep - they are hair sheep, so no wool to insulate them from the fence. Experience has shown us that once they get zapped, they tend to stay away from the fence.

We're also lucky in that they really like to eat the broad-leaf weeds and thistles. Even stinging nettle is no problem for them - they let it get to a certain stage and the next day there is only "3-inch sticks" left. Pig weed they will kill each other for - don't ask me why - they just do.

We need to go out and have a look at what is there. I'm actually going to a tame pasture school and thinking about a range management class as well, so we'll know what we should do soon.

Thanks for the pointers - we want to get into this sustainable grazing management and likely will look at putting in grass/forage species that the sheep like.

[rsmith]

Any suggestions on controlling and restoring pasture with areas of yellow foxtail? About 25% of our pasture is now contaminated by foxtail since the drought. It's concentrated in the low areas. Will it work to spray it out and reseed just those areas? Thanks for any help you folks can offer.

[nerves]

rsmith my question to you would be what other plants are there? do you rotate pastures? how rough is the land what type of soil is it? We used to have that in our pastures many years ago don"t see it anymore. The weeds we have a tough time with are buttercup and canada thistle.

[cswilson]

The best animal to clear up thistle with is horses-they love it. The oldtimers uised to cut heads off during a rain storm to control it. All i know is if you hobble a horse out in a meadow with thistles he'll hop over there and start grazing them. We cleared one bad patch also by just totally resting a pasture. It was droughty and we had no water there so were unable to graze it that year-this is a peatmoss pasture no less so guess how wet it usually is. I think alot of thistle troubles on our native pastures up north is grazing too early in spring we hardly ever go into them much before end of June-grass sometimes gets a bit rank but dry potatoes are better than no potatoes.

[cowman]

Rsmith: Foxtail usually indicates akali. I have found a very effective means of changing that around is bed your cows there! It is not a quick fix but it is fairly permanent! In other words get some real organic matter on it and your problem will be eventually solved!
Now I hope people don't jump all over me if I suggest a chemical solution...especially concerning Canada thistle?
Graze-On! Good stuff!
It isn't cheap! $21/acre, but it gives you three years of control and it kills the babies as well as the adults! Also excellent control of pasture sage and absinthe.new appreciation for "living better
If you ever try it, you'll get a whole chemically"! This is a very effective product.
Also Rsmith: MCPA is a very effective killer of tall buttercup...before it blooms. Afterwards it is sort of a waste...still will hurt it but won't go for the knock-out punch! Graze-On will smoke it, during flower, and then kill any seedlings the next couple of years, and there goes your buttercup problem!

[cowman]

Sorry cowman I'll have to jump all over you with those nasty words about chemical. Short term fix. What about our kids. Some better solutions suggested on this thread. I know we are in hard times but profit from short term chemical solutions don't cut it on our farm.

[nerves]

that is interesting cowman but I have also heard that it wipes out clover. Clover is one plant that grows and reseeds itself in our area extremly well. If grazed, to help with the plants growth I have seen it in old pastures without fertilizer as tall as 2 feet and rank. Clover also puts nitrogen back into the soil. So it is the backbone of our pastures fertility. We have also through rotational grazing got clover growing in swamp land were there was only sedge grass growing before. Most of our weeds are in areas were the bush meets the fields and in some spots have drifted it the trees. Cowman is there anything out there that will not kill clover or trees just thistle and buttercup? cswilson I like the horse idea we have about 12 running around here and they do eat thistles at certain stages. But we would need about 40 more to do the job I don"t think I have the patience for 50 the little herd of 12 tests me enough.

[cswilson]

nerves-a little bit of tape fencing and your 12 horses could do some good in a rainstorm.As for the chemicals haven't used any for 15 years-don't miss it. We never spray for hoppers amnd i bet we got 10,000 gulls on our pasture but I guess somebody's got to keep Dow Elanco going.

[cowman]

Well I will agree to a certain extent that we need to limit chemicals, but they can be an effective way of cleaning up a problem. And that is very true about killing the clover and the trees. No spray yet that will kill the thistles and buttercup and not get the clover.
However I have seen some really impressive results with a wick sprayer and roundup on thistles. Very cheap control, I believe about $4.50/acre. Didn't hurt the clover! I doubt it would work well with buttercup, but maybe.
I'm not advocating chemicals but they can remedy a problem and get a person in a position to do a better job of managing their grass. In the end it's all about dollars and cents. If you don't make the money you won't be around to manage the thing anyway.
I don't know how it works in Saskatchewan but in Alberta both tall buttercup and Canada thistle are noxious weeds and must be "controlled" under the Weed Control Act. A persistant problem will probably result in the weed inspector telling you what you need to do? And that very well might be chemicals? On oil leases the companies are often told they must spray(no other option) and often a specific chemical is named that they must use.

[cowman]

Oh, and incidently, in west central Alberta, tall buttercup is almost out of control! There is a major push coming to try to control it. The weed inspectors are starting to treat this weed as a very serious problem, and so they should.

[pandiana]

I am interested in the discussion on foxtail as well. We had very little of this 10 years ago but it is increasing steadily. We find in mostly in poorly grassed areas such as a low area in a bull pen and along road margins although I now see it encroaching on pastures. As I too am very reluctant to use chemicals I am looking for another means of control.

[pandiana]

The only really effective way of removing unwanted species in my experience is with chamomile. When we took possession of our home quarter, there were areas that were almost solid chamomile and it could be found in almost every area where the surface was broken indicating an unlimited supply of seed ready to sprout.
For ten years the entire family picked chamomile. We picked 20 large orange garbage bags from a 40 acre barley field and countless bags around the buildings and paddocks. Over the years we still find the odd plant but heaven help anyone that doesn't stop to pull it up. On the other hand, silaging crops has been a fairly effective way of reducing chamomile in many areas, provided of course it is done before it seeds.