cakadau - ua love the CCIA

[cowman]

Now I remember when they first starting proposing the mandatory ID tags, the CFIA stating that ALL info was confidential and would never be released to anyone! It was simply a traceback system for food safety. When some people brought up the question of packers getting names and using it for their own ends, we were assured this would never happen!
Grassfarmer: I don't think you have an option to not using the RFID tags? Come Jan. 1,2005 it becomes the law, doesn't it? And if you try to sell cattle without it you will be barred from selling and fined? I suppose if there was wide spread "civil disobedience" to this law they might have to change it, but you and I both know that isn't going to happen?

[cakadu]

Cowman has stated in other threads that the turnout on certain issues regarding the ABP has been in the neighborhood of 12%. What would happen if 80% of producers turned out and made their wishes known? Would it be possible to change the direction on some things and put people in place who are more amenable to carrying out producer wishes?

These BIG-C meetings seem to have rallied plenty of people together - what about rallying similar numbers to some existing events so that you don't have to go about re-inventing the wheel?

If in fact apathy has brought you to this point, then wouldn't action help to turn things around? Seems to me you have some momentum going here - try and build on it.

[jensend]

cakadau i'm not advocating apathy but it may not be that clear. it becomes apparent over time that abp is more influenced by the alberta government than big-c so who will the govt. want to talk to? put in a renegade board of directors at abp and the packers and feedlot operators will put together another group or organization formally or otherwise and will continue to have the ear of govt. as far as alberta is concerned abp is the cattle org. and the feds listen to cca. i was at the big-c meeting last night in moose jaw and walked out angry because the wrong guys have the right ideas as far as govt. is concerned so it's better to go with the right guys. the two conservative mp's who were there were a waste of time. cfia is owned and operated by washington. big-c has some good concepts and given time and goodwill they would be a big part of the solution to the whole structure of the cattle industry but they will have a tough time getting in to see the people who can make things happen. hopefully the momentum will build.

[kato]

wd40...Hostage Syndrome? I beg your pardon, but you sure sound American to me.

They don't want to pay to report back to us, that's all there is to it. It has nothing to do with some plot to keep cattle producers in the dark.

It has everything to do with money, with those guys it always has and it always will. Not some conspiracy, just money.

Understanding how they think is not the same as approving of it.

[kato]

Has anyone spoken to someone in the CFIA about changing the mandate for these tags?

I wouldn't be surprised to find that it's just a rumour.

Maybe we should find out before we get all bent out of shape over it.

[cswilson]

Am I missing something here-I sell my cattle on a carcass grid-where I get full carcass data back on my animals-whats the problem-if my animals grade and yield I get paid a premium(we average around $80 a head). Do i want to go back to selling fat cattle live-not on your life. The industry is finally evolving in my opinion.

[grassfarmer]

The one factor that maybe isn't obvious in this thread cswilson is that primary producers that don't retain ownership of their calves won't get carcase data back. The guys that will only ever sell calves in the fall don't have a chance to get the information.

[15444]

cswilson:

I agree, the industry is slowly starting to turn in the direction that is needed. Gone are the days when the average Joe can just take his entire spring (or fall) calf crop to the auction mart and expect to receive around the rolling average for price per cwt. Those that think this way will be the ones who don't survive this BSE mess?

I can easily see the day when:

The RFID tags are in full swing.

The producers that do survive BSE put their calves into their own feedlot or a custom one and cut out the middleman totally in order to stay afloat.

The packers have a general idea of what type of cattle (based on carcass data) each producer raises because they have demanded all of the producer info from CCIA or else?

It will all mean that a whole lot of producers will need to get out of the mix and with that a few million less cows? I doubt we can take about half the beef producers out of the industry and still keep the cow numbers up? I can't see anyone wanting to make that much work for themselves? especially the younger generation?

In the end, the Canadian cattle industry will get leaner, meaner and be led by those that lived through this and want to teach the world a lesson on how protectionist a country can be?

[cakadu]

With all that is invested in the ABP by both producers and the government, I'm not so sure that it would be that easy for the packers and the feedlot owners to start up their own group.

Remember that under the Ag Policy Framework, the ABP received monies from the Beef Industry Development Fund - if I'm reading it correctly - in a rollover for the implementation of the APF.

Re-inventing the wheel is not too likely an option from anyone's standpoint.

How will you know if it will work or not if you don't at least try?

[grassfarmer]

15444, I agree with your idea that the industry is evolving rapidly due to the current crisis and a lot of things will be done differently in the future.
When you say "The producers that do survive BSE put their calves into their own feedlot or a custom one and cut out the middleman totally in order to stay afloat." I must say I see things rather differently as such a scenario is in no way cutting out the middlemen that are taking the huge part of our income - the Packers. It is my future plan to cut out these thieves as well as retailers to make a sustainable return for my business.

[15444]

Grassfarmer:

Yes, it would be nice to cut out the packers totally, but I am thinking realistically on a national level and not on an individual basis.

[pmckenna]

I as I recall, The Alberta Beef Council (ABC)would have provided an excellent structure for the overall industry to implement data sharing, CCIA-style. The packers were definitely supportive, as were feedlots, auction marts, order buyers, and WSA. Not many in the the ACC understood it, but I have a feeling that will change over time, as membership of ABP (not just ABC) realize the consequences we now face as a result failure to support a forward-looking and objective organization.