Aid program details out

[grassfarmer]

I see Alberta Agriculture website has rules and forms available on their website "www1.agric.gov.ab.ca"
Don't get too excited though - forms are out now and you can't send them in until the animals are tagged. Catch is ags won't be available until October1st.
Other Highlights:
The 40% figure is a percentage of the cows you calved in 2004 including calves born dead.
End of October is when payments will start.
No mention of heifer or bull replacements being eligable or inelligable
In the Q A section it asks "what happens if the border opens after payment is made but before the year is up?" Answer: "calves will be released" .. interesting!
Looking at the form is giving me flashbacks to Europe - you need to hand write the numbers on the tags onto the form and there are 13# spaces per animal! Soon I'll be spending an hour a day on mindless paperwork again!

[cowman]

Well grassfarmer, I would think the smart thing to do would be to get the darned calves tagged early and get an application in? In fact tag the whole works! Who knows where this program might take us? Grab the money quick?
Call it a hunch, but I have a feeling the border will open sometime in the new year. The US seems to have pretty well whipped Japan into taking their beef and they'll be needing those good Canadian calves to fill the orders!
It is starting to look like Bush has got a good lead by wrapping himself in the flag? And Bush is buddies with the money men and they know that trade is the way to riches and success? He wins and we are in like Flinn?
The meat council thing also leads me to suspect R-Calf won't have a free ride in court the next time?
I see a lot of positives in the whole situation...the best since last fall?

[rookie]

I could'nt see anything about heifer replacements either. I would assume then if your going to keep them anyway, sign 'em up and get a few bucks... or am I reading this thing wrong somehow?

[InAHurry]

I would think replacements would have to be included for the mear fact that a person does not know if he will be keeping those (or part of) those females for his own replacements or not. The financial situation of each producer, when the time comes, dictates whether he keeps or sells. They are only considered replacements to one person, the guy that raised them - to most everyone else they are looked at as potential slaughter cattle...hope that made sense. The same I expect could be said for young breeding bulls, the seller is marketing them as bulls, but if they don't sell into that market, they become slaughter?

[grassfarmer]

It doesn't bother me either way the heifer deal because I am intending to claim my full entitlement anyway. It just seems really strange to me that all through the wording it talks about delaying slaughter of the 2004 calf crop until this new slaughter capacity comes on line - and then they would pay out on things that will become herd cows for 10 years from now? doesn't make sense to me.
How many producers didn't pull bulls last fall because culls were worth so little and have now got a few summer/fall calvers? These will be good calves to claim under this scheme.

[grassfarmer]

Cowman, you are sounding very upbeat - does that mean you no longer want to consign the Canadian herd to a big pit before the snow flies?

[grassfarmer]

Way to go grassfarmer. Leave that sleepy old dog lay.

[cowman]

Well Randy I hope you aren't referring to me as that sleepy old dog!...but whatever...I have a pretty tough hide!
Actually grassfarmer I would still advocate killing a good part of the whole lot...was actually advocating that the year before BSE, during the drought!
As far as I am concerned we shouldn't be raising one animal more than we can consume domestically.

[cowman]

Sorry cowman, I couldn't resist. Still think this old dog would like to meet you some day.

[pandiana]

What I find interesting is that apparently you must tag 40 %. According to the Alberta Ag Q&A if you have 100 cows and you aleady sold 70 calves you must buy 10 calves to make up the 40 to enter the program.

[cowman]

I will agree that I am feeling upbeat about the situation. I do believe this thing will be resolved in the not too distant future as long as we don't get another wreck? The fundamentals of the cattle business are actually not looking too bad. A lot of the speculators and fly by nighters are gone and the people who have hung in there are "survivors"! Feed is cheap and abundant!
I'm still holding my darned yearlings but my trigger finger is getting pretty itchy...probably move some this week! The boy wants to take over the cows so I guess I'll give them to him. I don't know if that is a good thing or not...? Gave him 480 acres a couple of years ago.
I told him I thought the darned cows weren't worth the effort but he's young and likes lots of work, so maybe he'll do okay.

[WoolyBear]

I've read the information and I don't see anywhere the mention of the OTHER Ruminants.......... the other innocent victims of BSE, the Bison, the sheep and the goats........ whats going to happen for them this time?

[pandiana]

Good question, WoolyBear. Posted a similar question on fur and sheep but apparently nobody reads this topic. I suspect there won't be too many sheep or other ruminants in this country when the dust settles. Prices seem to have settled at about 60 cents on the dollar in our area for the past 2 years. Hope too many people aren't trying to feed a family on sheep, let alone other woolies.

[grassfarmer]

Pandiana, I think the point about tagging 40% is just poor wording. In the case you highlight if you have sold 70 out of 100 you would need to but 10 more - if you wanted to get the full subsidy entitlement.
Someone was saying to me yesterday it could cause a two price dairy calf market - with coloured calves ex dairy being worth a lot more than black and whites.
I see a few cows about that are obviously beef x dairy so if you have used a beef bull on a dairy cow why shouldn't it qualify? There would be more logic in accepting them than accepting replacement heifers - in a scheme that is designed to compensate for delayed slaughter of beef animals from the 2004 calf crop.