Quebec cows?

[Bez]

Cowman - if the grain farmers in the prairies had TRULY supported the fellows who went to jail for their small grain transaction - TRULY - then you can be sure they would not have been arrested. However, there are not many who would be willing to dumpt 500 tons of wheat in major intersections to get their point across. Not enough people were ready to shut down Calgary, Saskatoon, Regina and Winnipeg. They had the power and did not use it.

There are too few who are really ready to fight for their rights to a fair treatment. Far easier to sit on their asses and watch some other poor sap take it on the chin.

In fact the cattle guy in the west is not ready to put up or shut up - most of them are hoping they can negotiate a small piece if the pie. In fact they actually have the power to make happen WHATEVER they want to make happen. It just takes gonads. The damned producer in teh west OWNS the pie and begs for a small piece. Typical.

Can't run a business without product. Either withold the product, or make it impossible to move the product. Not for one day, but for two months. You would be surprized at the reactions. Suddenly it would be the processors that started to squeal from pain.

Never happen in your part of the world - not enough people that have that type of courage.

As a speaker freom the UPA said at a local meeting some few months back - to us in Ontario.

"You are not ready yet. You are not hurting enough. Only when you really start to hurt will you act. We were. We acted and we won".

Bez

[cowman]

Unfortunately Bez, what you say is true...

[Bez]

Grassfarmer - your comments are quite well taken I assure you - but:

Quote:

I am always appalled that the Prairie farmer seems to be totally apathetic about the plight of agriculture but at the same time I for one have no desire to live in a chicken**** republic where mob rule is the order of the day. Canada should be able to do a lot better than that. Yes Prairie farmers are suffering but resorting to the "rough them up" attitude to officialdom is not progress in my book.

End Quote

I really like your comments about "Canada should be able to do better than that". I could not agree more. Unfortunately it WILL NOT - because it does not have to. And in the end, it is not CANADA that has to do better. It is the people who make Canada the country it is today.

It is the people who supply the product who have to MAKE Canada do better. The minimum is always the standard until the bar is raised. If you are happy with the minimum - then do nothing. If you want the bar raised - then do something. That is really the answer to almost all of the questions and problems.

In the end if good men do nothing, then nothing will happen.

Bez

[Bez]

Never underestimate the power of one or two people to make a difference. In our municipalitiy one fiesty little 70 year old ladyled the charge against the local council,and got a few other people riled up which literally forced a provincial directed review of the conduct of the council. The result, three members of council got the boot in the October election. Never say never when it comes to the power of the people, even when dealing with provincial governments.

[pandiana]

Thanks Bez for reiterating my sentiments so eloquently.

Every day that goes by I can't help but wonder why farmers are willing to wait to see if just maybe they will be the last one standing when things 'turn around'. Its like sheep waiting for slaughter.

Reality is, things will not get better, or at least good enough to survive unless we make some dramatic changes in the way agriculture works in this country and North America for that matter. As long as we remain price takers at the bottom of the food-chain, we will remain without any leverage to negotiate for our industry.

Let's face it...life style can account for only so much!

[cakadu]

Do you think it comes down to a reluctance to change? Change is always difficult no matter who has to do the changing or why the change has come about.

Agriculture isn't immune to the changes that are happening out there - many of them so fast that it boggles the mind some days. The timelines for change are shrinking as well. When you look at a continuum, in 30 years, we saw more changes than in the past 300 years; now we see more changes in 3 years than we did at any previous time.

Emrald, your point is a good one. It takes one person to start it, but once others get involved, it gains momentum and that is how things happen.

For varied reasons, there is great reluctance to change in agriculture - we've seen it coming for years, yet we appear to want to keep it the way it was. We went from a grazing management type of scenario to the feedlot one of today. There are a growing number who are moving back to the grazing management way of doing things with positive results, less costs and more coming back to them. Swath grazing, rotational grazing, having the cows move to the feed versus taking the feed to them are all part of lowering costs.

Pandiana is right - way of life does factor into it for so many people, but that is not what pays the bills and puts food on the table. It seems that the more food production is becoming a business, the less we are capable of embracing that reality. We should be rewarding those that are willing to take risks - be it in a producer owned plant, direct marketing or what have you - because they are taking risks, often times with great rewards attached to them. Even if they don't work out as planned, at least the attempt is there.

[cakadu]

I think that the vast majority of people will talk about what is wrong, want to see changes but when it comes to taking the bull by the horns they are reluctant to do so for varying reasons. I do think that many of our younger farmers are more apt to speak out and suggest alternative ways of doing things.

[grassfarmer]

Before we all jump on the bandwagon and become revolting peasants I think we need to clear up a few points in this debate.
#1 Are you prepared to resort to strong-arm tactics against consumers for not paying enough for their food or is it only to bully more welfare payments from the Government?
#2 How would this affect trade with other countries - will you go down the road of hijacking and burning products coming in from the US for example? If so what are the implications of such action?
#3 Does the UPA or any proposed Western group with the same agenda pose a threat to transnational corporations the size and power of Cargill, Tyson or is it a case of UPA being the big fish in a small tank?
Don't get me wrong agriculture needs to change in Canada but I just don't think changing it by violence and civil disorder is the way ahead in the 21st Century.

[Bez]

Grassfarmer - your comments are to a certain extent - valid.

However, if you want a better price for your animal - then demand it. Make it happen. Block the doors to Tyson and Cargill. Watch what happens. There will be heck to pay - but, if you do nothing but talk with them - well, they will simply talk back. And the game will continue and they will win. This is exactly what THEY hope you will do.

If you do not hit them in the only place they will understand - their bank account - then you are the loser - NOT them. This scares them, because shareholders demand profits from their companies.

It is a matter of pure economics - nothing more and nothing less.

It is fine to sit down and say civil disobedience is a bad thing - but by not doing anything - it allows them to pay you what THEY want to pay.

If you have a better idea, I am all ears - but do not pull out the "negotiate with them" card. And do not pull out the "it'll get better" card. That along with the governments help will keep us in our place.

I simply use the example of the UPA. Why not write the prez and talk to him? They are far better off than any ag operator in trhe remainder of Canada.

In the end, most all of you folks will keep on with the status quo because you do not think like someone who is ready to "go down swinging". Yet.

So here is my last comment - have to go wean the babies - If you managed to block the doors for a month - do you think the other side would come to the table with the same attitude they approached the federal inquiry - or the way they treat you now - or would they come "seriously" looking to solve the problem?

You OWN the pie. Unfortunately an outside influence controls whether or not you actually get to eat it.

Bez

[Horse]

Bez I surly do congratulate you on your posts I have been saying the same thing for years but I think getting farmers together is a lot harder than hearding cats
A good example of the apathy in this country is the atatude of just wait till the border opens, since Bushs visit the coffe room talk is all the border will open in 3-5 mo and things will be just fine , all the talk of more packing plants will go away and we are back to being screwed.
Mabey I shouldnt care as I have pretty well got out of the cattle business but I still have land to do something with and after 40 yr I hate to think it was all for nothing.

I dont want ot point fingers but thier are a lot of farmers out there that make thier living out in the oil patch and use farming as a tax dodge and to build up a nice operation for thier retirement and as long as we have those people speaking for us things wont change but who has enough time to get involved besides those with the big pay cheque.