Plenty money around?

[grassfarmer]

I see the Soderglen success story rolls on - Today's bull sale prices shown on TEAM indicate their customers have plenty money to spend on bulls.
Red Angus sold to $15,000 and $11,000
Red Max and red Simmental bulls to $6000
Black Angus to $6,900
Black Max to $7,600
Charolais to $5400
and their new terminal line of Char x Angus bulls $4100.
Very strong averages throughout, lots of $4000 and $5000 bulls with not that many under $3000.
Lot's of confidence, lots of money?

[SASH]

I would say that's a good indicator that the producers are feeling pretty optimistic this year. Could also be alot of demand for good bulls. Not too many have been buying in the last couple of years. I guess I should've bought my bull last year. LOL.

[blackjack]

...just over at the TEAM website myself...obviously these guys buying the bulls must not be worried about the spread between the new bull and the slaughter price...

[grassfarmer]

It's certainly surprised me how strong people are bidding this spring for bulls. I really noticed that at a bull sale I attended last week - last year the top was $3000 and only a few people were prepared to go that far, yet this year the average was $3200. $3000 was no kind of barrier - bulls jumped past that pretty quick yet what has changed in a year? Most producers have sold a calf crop at the worst price in how long in relative terms? 20 years?
So the money being spent now is speculative money not earned money in many cases. I suppose at the end of the day if we weren't eternal optimists we wouldn't be ag producers.

[15444]

Reading the livestock report on the last page of the financial section of the Winnipeg Free Press today. All steers @ Winnipeg Livestock under 700 lbs going for over a $1/lb. Wonder how many of those steers are getting a CAN brand as soon as they get home?

Definately a lot of optimism in all the sectors. Interesting to see how the prices at the Calgary Bull Sale react to the March 7 opening. Due to the Calgary sale being so close to the critical March 2nd and 7th dates, it could be nuts or a complete flop...depending on the success of R-CALF?

Have to agree though, cull bull and cow prices don't warrant any kind of high prices for new bulls or cows. But, basing on what we are seeing in the feeder steer department (and with an open border to UTM), I don't find it hard to believe that we could see nearly full recovery of steer prices by autumn? But on the same note...I see prices hardly changing in every other area (i.e. culls and heifers).

[greybeard]

Last year at this time there was little to be optimistic about. I know guys who didn't want to sell calves but had to. They took a licking. At that time it looked like the right thing to do.
I think it may have been the darkest days of the BSE crisis.
I'm trying to look at BSE like a childhood nightmare that becomes a fading memory over time. I hope it isn't like a cancer that you think you have beat and it comes back and kills you.
If we weren’t optimists we would be taking this as an opportunity to get out.

[cowman]

Not trying to tell anyone how to spend their money here...just pointing out what breeding costs might be?
You buy a yearling bull for $3000?Say he weighs 1350 lbs. You use him for say three years and sell him at 2100 lbs. for about 20 cents or$420 less whatever costs come with that? So for three years(75 calves) he has cost you $2600? Add on his maitenance at $1/day for two winters and three summers and you add another $900? For a total cost of $3500 divided by 75 calves or $46.67/calf?
Now if he actually added some weight to your calves then he very well may have been profitable.
Consider this: That fancy yearling may be very good...or maybe not! If you look at AI you can get a top proven bull for a pretty decent price(around $20). I have found the ABS bulls pretty well do what they say they will. Of course AI can be a pain for sure, and if you have to hire a technician the costs go up quite a bit. Still you can really improve your cowherd by using the right bulls. I remember several years ago we had 17 replacement heifers,from a cow herd of 150, and 15 were from AI bulls and 12 of their mommas were AI sired!
A proper program and a good quiet technician should have around an 80% success rate on one cycle and a decent cleanup bull or two will catch everything else. I'm not overly keen on synchronizing them but it can be effective.

[whiteface]

It may sound like a sales pitch and if it scares anyone, sorry, but that's my job to promote the best quality bulls I can offer for sale...and I have some of the best whitefaces in the entire country...I'll even give references right here if need be...
Anyway,
DEFINATLY! Buy a good young bull that will add a little performance and give you some heifers you can keep, then repeat the entire process over again, breeding those good replacements to a performance herdsire. Good quality, good looking calves absolutly command a premium (even/frequently in my case, ESPECIALLY if they have a WHITE head - this is the ONLY time you KNOW FOR SURE what you're getting as far as breeds go.)
The flip side of course is too keep using the old model bull or worse, a cheap piece of sh** that does nothing to improve your prices or herd and I promise will end up costing a fortune in lost revenue and problems later. Buy a good bull and don't be afraid to put out a little cash for him, on the contrary, be very afraid NOT TO buy a good bull!!
Incidentally cowman, I haven't seen ABS' catalogue yet but have noticed in our regular Polled Hereford "Bible" that semen prices are up quite a bit across the board. I'll be interested to see if commercial bulls have gone up in price as well. How about you, Northern Rancher? Are technition fees going up this year?
I agree, we all should have bought our bulls last year but consider this: how much will they go up again by this time next year??
Have a good day all!

[cswilson]

Raise tech fees-hmm I never thought of that lol. I price my projects by the job-depends on alot of things-semen cost,numbers,facilities, number of slobbering blue heelers hanging around to 'help'. Do you know anybody interested in some Walpole Cheque semen.

[Muttley]

As a purebred Angus breeder myself I see the bull as the most important purchase a breeder will make. Not only in selling calves but also in the replacements kept. You can figure on keeping a bull for 3 or 4 years or more. Calves sold as one thing, don't forget the daughters kept in the herd or sold as high end heifers.
A purchase of a good bull can be seen in a herd for years as progency.
A few years ago I purchased a $7000.00 Angus bull in Medicine Hat. My wife I think has finally forgiven me as she nows see's the whole picture as his great great grand daughters are now calving.

[whiteface]

Actually cs, I am, this year. I recall your mentioning that you had some at this time last year and the timing wasn't quite right for me but I think it just may be this year. I'm interested in knowing how many straws you have, I'd likely take all of them, how much you think you might want per straw or the lot and when you might be travelling to or past or nearest to Olds, AB (or Edmonton as I frequent there quite a bit as well) and we'll see if we can't meet up and make a sale. I have a darling 2 year old that needs to be flushed this year to "something different" as the Polled Hereford industry is just fed up to it's hatband with Remitall genetics. Cheque was good and would provide a genetic option for me. Get back to me when you can either here or email me if you still have my address. Thanks!

[cowman]

Well I don't want to ruin your enthusiasm for the purebred herford business whiteface, but the fact is if you raise commercial hereford cattle you are facing the kiss of death! Well at least at the marts I go to.
I too have not seen the ABS catalog this year but I doubt commercial prices are up? (Purebred prices don't reflect the real world in my opinion!) I mean look what our dollar has been doing against the US buck?
The point I was trying to make is this: Why use an expensive "maybe" bull when for less money you can use an AI bull that has proven progeny on the ground? I realize that it won't work for everybody and if not they should go out and buy whatever works for them. But I also believe AI can take you down the road faster and cheaper than hoping you guessed right and got a winner, instead of a dog!
I will also note if you aren't crossbreeding you are leaving a lot of money on the table. Or as my old AI instructor said it " If you inherited the farm or have so many oil wells on it that you can hardly get around, you don't need to crossbreed! If there is one thing that you can do to increase profits with your cattle...it is crossbreeding!"

[whiteface]

Anytime, cowman, I'm right here, less than 20 minute drive from your place to mine...
You haven't seen herefords like the ones I have...ever
And incidentally, I do sell at the auction mart that you frequent, and incidentally been near the top on more than one occasion.
Can you teach an old dog new tricks? Only if you can get him out of the doghouse...
Git yer butt down here if you have any doubt what I'm doing...
No fear here!
Have yourself a grand day and I still enjoy your posts!
Northern Rancher, where the HE double toothpicks are ya!

[cswilson]

Cowman you come to the Meadow Lake yearling sale and you'll see straight hereford cattle sell as high as any cattle in western canada. When the community pastures gather the yearling fields there are some awesome bunches of yearlings come to town.

[cowman]

Well whiteface, I think I've always said we have to do what works best for ourselves. So if it works for you, good.
Because I no longer own any cows I don't have to worry about it, but the boy is bound and determined on Chars, which incidently I basically agree with. He intends to breed some cows AI to red angus, a select few to Char and the rest to white bulls. He picked up one big stout four year old last week from a herd dispersal.
Our Char calves consistently outweighed everything else last year and also outsold them per pound! All a matter of dollars at the end of the day?