How do you see yourself?

[cowman]

kpb: What you say is exactly true! The value of our land, in reality, is where we make our money. Now having said that...how do I ever leave this place? My great grandfather died here and so did my Dad. My children were raised here, just like I was, just like my father was, just like my grandfather was.
My Dad told me when he was in the ugliest battles in Italy that all he could think of was coming home to this farm.
I love this piece of dirt more than life itself, but I also realize the day will come when the suburbanite will make an offer that can't be refused!
I tell my son "Don't be an idiot. When the price is right sell it...just don't do it while I'm still alive".

[kpb]

cowman, you are so right about the land--it does get in your blood and it's hard to feature selling it. Same with the cows. It's just too hard to imagine getting rid of either.

But the reality is that the land prices are unreal. Sooner or later my land is going to be subdivided and taken over by the acreage crowd. Now this can be for my benefit or the benefit of those coming after me. But this is not a matter of if but rather when--the plain fact is that land in my area is not ever going to be viable again for ranching--it's just too expensive.

There are many farmers in my area now who have just a quarter section, 30 cows and a great life. They have sold their land, have no debt, lots of cash in the bank, take long holidays, drive nice cars and trucks and spend lots of money on their families.

Then there are a few guys in our area like me left, not many but a few, with a decent land base, some or lots of debt, lots of depreciating machinery or depreciating cows and who can't afford a holiday, have no time for anything other than farming and think hard about spending money on a used truck or big purchases for the family because most of their net worth is in the land and their cash flow from farming is terrible.

Which lifestyle makes more sense to you? I honestly don't know but I think we should all think about our choices and not just keep plugging away.


kpb

[kpb]

When I look at people paying $250,000 for dinky boxes of houses in my home town,and $400,00 for the same house on a few acres of land, it makes a lot of sense to me to stay where I am. I have a farm, 1800 sq.ft. home, all the support buildings that I need and peace and quiet to boot....so until they pack me off, I intend to stay, cows or no cows !!!

[cowman]

kpb: If I was to answer you on this question from a purely "business" perspective, I would say sell!
However as Sean says, there is a lot more than meets the eye here!
Yep, your darned land is worth too much. But in the "really big picture" does it really matter? What is the purpose of your life? Is it really to make X number of dollars?
You know, I believe, if at the end of your days, you can say " I did the right thing, I did what I was meant to do, I did it in an honest manner, and I never screwed anyone doing it....then you had a good life?"
Believe me, many times I have wondered why in the hell do I keep this place and continue to do this little "thing" instead of doing something else? I still don't have the bloody answer!
However I do believe to be free, you need to have a place you can call your own? Not a place you bought or even inherited but a place where you "invested" your life? That is home.

[grassfarmer]

One option for you guys sitting on land near cities or towns where the urban sprawl is encroaching is to relocate. I did it - from somewhere I couldn't expand to somewhere land was half the price. Surprisingly having done it the attachment to the actual land wasn't hard to break. I made the best job I could of managing my previous property and then sold it well. Now I'm trying my best to manage this place - the bond to the land is transferable! Selling up and getting a top price for a well managed property gives you the same buzz as selling a top pen of calves it's not the tough, heart wrenching business I expected it to be.
There are plenty of good cattle places for sale on the prairies at half the price of the highway 2 corridor. I'm always vaguely interested in the Peace country - if I didn't mind living further away from things I would move there in a shot ( wife wouldn't though as it's too far from Edmonton)
Saw a place advertised there recently - 1600 acres deeded a large grazing lease, would carry 3-400 cows listed at $950,000. The price of 3 quarters where you are kbp?

[grassfarmer]

grassfarmer the Peace Country does look attractive and the land is productive, the only drawback is the lack of water. Domestic water sources are usually dugouts, which is a far cry from that good water well you rely on at home.

[grassfarmer]

OK Emrald fair point, but people are living there now so it can't be impossible. I was used to an unlimited supply of free, gravity fed spring water in Scotland. Here we have to pay for power to pump hard water from 60-90 feet down. Different areas always have different problems most of which can be overcome if the overall move will work out. I was only using the Peace country as an example - i've never actually travelled up there yet but I will someday.

[kpb]

grassfarmer, you're right, three quarters of land here would buy a good ranch in northern Alberta. We started buying land up near Lac La Biche ten years or so ago and we've kept adding to it for summer grazing. I love it up there--it's wild and great cattle country with lots of water and the land is still cheap. Beautiful country. But the plain fact is that my kids and wife like having a town close by for hockey and such and a city close by for the same things. Not me but it would be hard to convince them to live somewhere else so I guess you just can't have everything. But if I was a young guy just starting out I'd sure head for northern Alberta.


kpb

[kpb]

The Peace is a beautiful area. The Peace River Valley is awesome in the fall. Dunvegan bridge scares the hell out of me in the winter but the view is awesome.
Many of the communites are fairly remote and the rural area is sparsly settled. Lots of landowners with large tracts of land, some due to the influx of homesteaders forty years ago.

Places like Worsley for example don't have many services but there are some fairly large farms in the area, including livestock operations.

grassfarmer you would really enjoy a visit to that part of the province. I drive a different way each time.

[grassfarmer]

How like - fast, slow, backwards?
Oh a different route I see!