Killing the cow plant

[pandiana]

I am not sure if we have had a change in the climate or what, but 3 times in the last 3 days I have heard a cattle feeder say that their actions, although necessary for their survival, ultimately result in 'killing the cow plant' or puting the primary producer out of business. What's different?

[farmers_son]

I am not sure what you mean. When you say their actions, do you mean the cattle feeders? What actions are you thinking about.

[pandiana]

It will be interesting to see how this program is to be implemented. Anyone owning cows other than ones born on their farm may have a difficult time knowing their birth date, unless they were purchased privately.

[pandiana]

Sorry! I re-read this post and realize it is a little obtuse. Rick Pascal, Pat McCarthy and Jack Daines were on CBC radio yesterday at noon.

One of the things that came up in their conversation was that the primary producers was taking the brunt of the BSE crises because cattle feeders/buyers were forced to source their calves at the lowest possible price in order to make their margins. He realized that the effect of this was that the primary producers are in trouble and many would eventually fail. He used the expression 'killing the cow plant'. Coincidentally, I heard this phrase at another meeting from two other cattle feeders/buyers. Previous to this, it seems to me, there had been little rationalization on how these low prices would affect primary producers. One person commented that cattle feeders were getting quite worried that there would be a collapse of the cow/calf operations which of course would affect their operations.

I

[JD4ME]

Thats a valid question but the one then that should be asked is will producers be allowed access to the data to check ages of cattle as well or will it be only processor/enduser accessible.

[JD4ME]

Thats a valid question but the one then that should be asked is will producers be allowed access to the data to check ages of cattle as well or will it be only processor/enduser accessible.

[campbellc]

The feeders are beginning to realize that the cow calf sector which traditionally is said to realize approximately 15% to 20% of its total gross revenue from the sale of cull cows is being squeezed to death by the combination of low income and high inpur costs. The feedlot sector here in Alberta has enjoyed low calf prices (comparatively to US prices) for years due to a variety of factors. Those factors are/will be eroding, in large part due to the exit/future exit from the cow calf business by older producers and financial need. The "cow plant" in Western Canada may well not be large enough to provide them with sufficient numbers in the near future. Which station was this bit aried on? It would be interesting to obtain a transcript.

[campbellc]

My, how times change ...... do any of you remmeber the organization called CBI - Canada Beef Improvement. Back in the mid 90's, this organization under the umbrella of CCA had a mandate to identify animals individually, track and report data on the animal to the individual to purchased the tag. The concept of the unique animal identification which is now CCIA took over 10 years plus to become a working reality and it never would have save for BSE.

With so many positives for the sector engendered within the concept of unique animal identification, why has it taken a crisis which has the industry at its knees to achieve this end? Are we as an industry so shortsighted that we can not see beyond the present crisis?

[pandiana]

This conversation aired on CBC Alberta Wild Rose, I think it is called, either at noon or 1:00 o'clock. This was a feature marking the 2nd anniversary of BSE in Canada.

I am not sure if they would have transcripts, but it would be interesting as in my usual fashion, the discussion was well under way before I started listening.

[grassfarmer]

It seems an inevitable move - it's being done in other parts of the world too. Individual IDs to verify date of birth but more to the point any treatments with antibiotics or hormones that the animal may have had are meant to reassure consumers of the health of their beef. Actually any customers of mine from an urban background want to come and see my calves skipping around in the grass and they want to buy my beef but they tell me they do not want to connect the two or know what goes on on the farm.
Regardless it's the way of the future and it would benefit the industry to get carcase feedback to benchmark what they are producing. Although if you sell small weaned calves who should get the information - the breeder or the feeder who actually fed out the animal and was probably as much responsible for the grades as the breeder was? I understand at the moment the packers are dead against returning this information - affects their ability to steal cattle I guess.

Emrald1 age verifying cows isn't a big deal - it is phased in as each new crop of calves gets eids put on them the database builds up. The older bulls and cows already on farm can be given an arbitary age and issued with ids if producers don't know the ages. It isn't critical to age these cattle as they are all OTM anyway and will be treated as such. There isn't really much prospect of a date based export scheme for cattle born before the feed ban so it's no big deal.

[grassfarmer]

A comment I heard on the TV today in the little 2 year anniversary blurb was that despite the hardships predicted 2 years ago only 120 producers out of 120,000 have quit as a result of BSE. If these figures are true maybe we aren't in such a huge crisis - sure times are tough but maybe not the disaster that was predicted?

[grassfarmer]

grassfarmer, I think that many producers are looking to off farm income as a way to keep things together. I wonder how the machinery dealers,livestock handling equipment folks etc. are doing .
In our local community the feed store sells several lines of livestock handling equipment and hasn't sold anything but gates for nearly a year.
On the other hand the fellow that builds custim corral panels is going flat out, sales haven't dropped one bit.

[Horse]

A bunch of su were sitting at the table the other night and trying to see how many Just Farmers there are around us and in app a township there are only 3 farmers that are just farming of the 25 or so others they all have off farm income or are like me and just playing around and dont want to sell the land just yet.
O by the way they all are making a lot more money than farming ever did,

[kpb]

It may well be that there will be less cow-calf producers in the medium to long term but, for sure, there are going to be a lot more calves coming to market this fall and next fall and for the foreseeable future. Our cow herd is huge and there's going to be no getting around that for some time to come no matter what happens. I think calf prices this fall will be lower than in the previous couple of years unless the border is open which seems unlikely.

One more thing, ccampbell, it's easy to say that the feeders have been making money because they've been buying cheap calves in Canada but it is the feeders who had a huge loss in equity when BSE was discovered. And it is also the feeders who have thousands of head of cattle on feed that could lose .10 or more per head based on border closing rumours at any time (and that has happened). That is big time risk and I don't know too many cow-calf guys that would want to assume it.

kpb

[cowman]

grassfarmer: I believe those 120 producers were forced into declaring bankruptcy? Probably a lot more have just quit? Mostly the older producers who could afford to get out?
I also believe a whole lot of people are working jobs or have other businesses to support their "farming addiction"!
How many producers are just hanging in there for the tax breaks while their land values continue to climb?
In the big picture who will survive? I always said the guys with the deepest pockets and a committment to the life, will be the ones who come out the other end.
The Canadian cow herd continues to grow and produce more calves every year...sooner or later that has to cause some problems?