Openbeefborders.com

[farmers_son]

The American Meat Institute (AMI)has a new website dedicated to opening the border to Canadian live cattle. The AMI represents companies such as Cargill and Conagra.

The message on the site is that the ban on live cattle is forcing Canada to build up its own slaughter capacity. At least some of the new capacity is owned by AMI member companines.

While the AMI is an important ally in seeing normal trade resume with the U.S., I am not sure you could call them the farmers friend.

In my more cyncial moments I would question if Cargill and companies like them really care if the border opens to live cattle as they continue to realize outrageous profits at the expense of the Canadian producer. However I notice a undertone in the website of a concern that a continued ban on Canadian live cattle will undermine American consumer confidence in their beef.

If that is indeed the AMIs concern than I would take their efforts to see the border open to live cattle as genuine.

[rkaiser]

The one and only reason the AMI is talking consumer confidence is the threat of BSE testing. No packer in Canada or the USA wants BSE testing.
Simply put, it will cost them some money. Granted, they will pass those costs to the producer in the long run, but some of the cost will have to be realised by them. This may include some consumer demand in North America.

BSE testing has always been a card in this game. A card that Canada has had and will have the oportunity to use. Expoting beef to Japan and Korea is not as easy, and not as cheap as turning insane profits right here at home. The packers know that, and like you say farmer_son, are happy with the statis quo. These multinationals have no dedication to workers in the USA. The only US conection is to the owners pocketbooks, which happen to reside in the USA. Profit will be made where profit can be made, and to hell with producers, or employees in either Canada or their own US of A.

Our industry groups are finally pushing the envelope on testing, to the dismay of the packers, and packer connected feeders who sit on their boards of directors.

A closed border to boxed beef would be hard on the packers in Canada, but not as hard as it would be on the producers once again. Slowing the line would result in layoffs, and simply a break from the day in and day out profit taking the packers have been used to since Sept. of 2003. Not loss of money, just a break from major profit. Mexico has already assured CBEF that they would increase Canadian imports at the US expense, and other countries have expressed interest in the same. A closed "Boxed beef to the US" border would simply put this supply demand dysfunctional market back to the forfront, and give the packers another reason to drop price once again.

I implore every one of you to push your industry leaders to push the envelope on testing TODAY. It is our only trump card. I don't belive for a moment that testing is necessary for health, but do believe as Ted Haey said two days ago the Canada must approach the Japanaese with a new concept. "What would you like us to do to access your markets?" Would testing for BSE do that? I beleive it would.

[rkaiser]

As always, I apologize for the spelling folks,,,,,,,,, Damn that grade three education.

[farmers_son]

Rkaiser: You are not alone in your desire to see more testing. R-Calf, in its Memorandum in Support of R-Calf's Motion for Summary Judgement filed in Montana Court May 9, 2005 is making the argument to Judge Cebull that Canadian beef imports to the U.S. should be tested for BSE. (Page 30) Still not enough, R-Calf goes beyond this on page 36 in conclusion to ask that all Canadian beef imports be stopped, tested or not.

Of course, it goes without saying that while this would be happening the U.S. would be exporting their beef to Canada and globally without testing because, as we all know, the U.S. doesn't have BSE.

http://www.r-calfusa.com/BSE/R-CALF%20USA%20SJ%20Brief.pdf

Whenever we ignore science we do so at our peril since it leaves us, as an industry and a nation, open to capricous protectionism from one and all.

[grassfarmer]

farmers_son, I'm not sure I'm following you - are you using the statement "Whenever we ignore science we do so at our peril since it leaves us, as an industry and a nation, open to capricous protectionism from one and all." to justify not testing OTM Canadian beef even if this action would open markets up to us?
Surely it should be clear to all by now that by following "sound science" we are as an industry and a nation are already being subjected to capricous protectionism from one and all.

[cowman]

I always said test the damned things...not because of any health concerns but because it is a marketing tool! If a $20 test gets me another $400 for a cull cow....this isn't rocket science?
I find it ironic that our CCA and ABP choose to fight a trade war by a stratedgy of licking the boots of our opponent? Test the cattle and spend a few bucks advertizing that fact! Take out full page ads in every American paper stating that all Canadian beef is tested BSE free, then smear the hell out of US beef! In a war you got to get down and dirty?

[farmers_son]

Grassfarmer: First a little reality check. Canada imports more non NAFTA beef than it exports beef to non NAFTA countries, making us a net importer of beef beyond NAFTA’s borders. Within NAFTA, access to our free market is being denied by the Americans even though science as outlined in the USDA rule published in January of 2005 would have allowed OTM beef into the U.S. That rule was changed due to political pressure, partly resulting from the two Canadian BSE positives in 2005, even though the science would say that the risk had not changed.

Given that NAFTA is our only real export market, do you think Canadian producers should test our OTM beef to gain access to the U.S. market like R-Calf wants. After all the consumer is always right, aren’t they. Or does that overlook the fact that the U.S. has a similar risk of BSE as Canada.

Most people when they talk OTM testing are thinking it will open access to foreign markets for cow beef. Canada exports beef right now without BSE testing to Cuba and Macau and through Macau to China. It appears likely that sometime this year Japan will accept beef from young Canadian cattle without test. We need to consider very carefully how bad we want to send cow beef to Japan, if they would even accept our cow beef with test. Is it worth it to send offal to Taiwan? Or liver at 20 some cents per pound. Testing is not without its consequences.

There is some saber rattling going on right now about what Canada will do if we loose boxed beef. Well, in that situation I guess we would have nothing to loose and all bets are off. We probably would be doing anything and everything possible to find an international market for what would suddenly be some very cheap beef. But unless that happens, and that is a big if, our primary export market remains NAFTA. If we want to loose that market all we have to do is keep finding more BSE positives. Any arguments about BSE testing providing consumer confidence have to be made in the context of not finding any positives. The message is clear, find any more positives like we did in January and we will loose access to our export markets, like we did in March.

[farmers_son]

we will never win the war with the US, the only way we are going to get live cattle across the border and keep the boxed beef going south is the US going to battle for us. Keeping people employed and packing plants open in the US is our main hope in getting the border open, and will have a lot more clout than ABP's expensive US lawyers I am sure.

[rkaiser]

Well farmer_son, I am not going to argue with you over a bunch of "what if's" about BSE testing. And I will say that some of the notions that Rcalf has are somewhat similar to my own. But like everything in life, disagreement, and even strong disagreement is also necessary. I strongly disagree with Rcalf using BSE as a tool in the mainly protectionist agnda. But I do see a need for a grassroots producer organisation that can see beyond the needs of mutinational packers.

The only way we will ever know if Japan will take our BSE tested OTM beef is to ask, is it not? By the sounds of it, we have people from our government prepared to ask this question in the coming weeks. What could be wrong with this? I think we could have asked this question, at a government, level over one year ago.
Testing, in my mind, is the ultimate way to prove to consumers that you are competely transparent, and do not feel that testing would reduce domestic or foreign consumer confidence. Yes we will find more cases of BSE, as every country that tests does. But what other choice do we have.

As you have said, we can send a few tons of cheap low end cuts to Cuba (could not even compete on trim), and depend on some of the other POOR NAFTA trading partners for more. But BSE testing could very well reach the Asian market which sees a domestic price higher than our own, and pays that price to countries like Australia and New Zealand who they have outright explained cannot produce the quality of product Canada does.

Japan will not buy trim from South American countries due to FMD leaving us a price compeptitive market to at least explore with an offer to test for BSE.

[grassfarmer]

farmers_son, The fact that we are currently a net importer of beef beyond NAFTA’s borders needn't mean that position can't change. I thought you were all about expanding our domestic slaughter capacity? - why not combine that with seeking new markets outwith NAFTA for a possibly more lucrative and secure future?
For someone who backs the "sound science" approach how can you argue that if we find more cases we will lose the right to export? We are doing all the right things by world standards and the US does not have a leg to stand on by banning imports of UTM meat. It is simply not the case that if you test to ensure consumer confidence and find positives that this testing has been counter productive. It has been shown in Europe that testing and finding positives does ensure consumer confidence.

[kpb]

I think that farmers_son is exactly right in all his arguments. The only real issue at the moment is if we can access our biggest customer--the U.S. It's fine to say that we may be able to get into more international markets by testing but that is a big unknown.

The fact remains, as farmers_son put it that we need the U.S. market if we want to continue exporting huge quantities of beef. If we find another case of BSE in Canada I believe we will lose our boxed beef trade to the U.S. I think we have to realize that decisions that are made in the U.S. are not, and do not have to be, made on the basis of sound science or even what we think is reasonable or fair. The decisions are made based on what is in the perceived best interest of U.S. citizens. Period. End of story. So all our hand wringing and moaning about R-Calf's tactics or being dealt with unfairly are a complete waste of time. The U.S. will do what is in it's best interests. Always.

As I have said before, as long as all you guys want to export tons of beef we are always going to be at the beck and call of the country that is taking the beef, no matter if that country is the U.S. or Mongolia. And that means being vulnerable to local politics that we have no understanding or control over.

Another case of BSE in Canada will, no matter if found through our system of present-day testing or through an expanded testing program, give ammunition to those factions in the U.S. that want to seal the border up tight. To all beef. And for a long time.

kpb

[rkaiser]

You are right kpb, but the chances of finding another BSE case under our current survailance program are quite good. Especially with the $250.00 program that found the last two.

If we don't start to explore the possiblity of exporting BSE tested beef now, we will really be screwed when that next case is found.

Ask farmer_son to tell you what the numbers are currently for exports? I hear it from CBEF and feel quite exicited about possibilities for dropping our exports to the USA. In fact Haney says they are aiming for less than 50% of total exports of beef to the USA in the next 10 years or less.

If we are ever to become a viable industry we need to lessen our dependence on the US. Either by your way,kpb, or by my way.

Damn the torpedo's and sell to the Japanese. Or the Koreans, or the Chinese, or the Russians, or the European Union. It's a global economy kpb, and we have a product that is very much usable, and in fact sought after. Clean up this BSE BS with testing, and away we go.

[farmers_son]

The countries that are testing all OTM or, in the case of Japan, OTM and UTM beef may have successfully regained their domestic consumers confidence but I believe I would be correct in saying that all of these countries have lost a significant portion of their previous export markets if any indeed exports ever existed.

It is not coincidence that the major beef exporters go to great lengths to make sure a BSE positive is never found in their country. Those lengths include looking the other way, losing tests, banning downer cows so that they are never tested, testing only a token amount of animals or not testing at all, directing what testing is done to low risk animals. There is simply no precedence for countries that test significant numbers of high risk animals to say that export markets will open for them. It has never happened. The reality is that every BSE positive we find reduces our opportunities for exports, not increases them, no matter what the science says the risk may be.

Canada is playing loose and fast with its beef export markets by aggressively testing many more animals than the science dictates. Our program of directly testing 4D cows on farm is certainly unique among beef exporting nations. The global scientific community may be impressed by that program however it is politically very risky. We need to play ball with those politicians in the U.S. who do want to see live cattle trade resume with Canada, even if it is for purely selfish reasons on the part of the U.S. And by playing ball I mean that we need to harmonize our BSE testing protocols with the U.S. even if the U.S. testing is not, how do you say, on the up and up.

There is a reverse correlation between the amount of BSE testing done within a country and the amount of beef exported. Not the other way around. Canada’s on-farm 4D testing program needs to be revisited, and quickly before it is too late. Let’s face it, those 300,000 plus cows tested in the U.S were not high risk cows, there is something for Canada to learn from that. I am not saying don’t test, just don’t be stupid about it.

[grassfarmer]

I think that is a chicken and egg situation farmers_son. If we harmonise our testing standards for OTMs with the US (ie cheat by not looking/ covering up cases) we risk a real consumer backlash they way they got in Europe and Japan when politicians are found out covering up BSE.
After the resulting complete confidence and market crash we will be back in the position that those who are now testing big numbers were in years ago. Not only will we lose our exports but we might shrink our domestic market 30% overnight - then we will be wondering if we should test to recover markets.
Why can't we learn from others mistakes? - cheating and covering up BSE is not the bright choice. With the high testing numbers we now have coupled with an impression in the worlds eyes that we are honest we are in a good position regarding BSE - if only we would have the courage to go out and find other markets instead of waiting for the old familier, easiest market to open up when they decide it suits them to allow some of our beef in.

[ALLFARMER]

I have to agree with cowman again, test every animal and add it to the bill! You can always sell quality. A BSE tested product is a value added... premium product. In addition the USDA will not allow American plants to test every cow. Once the USDA can't hide their BSE anymore Canadian packers will be simply the supplier of choice.