NMA Appeal-July 13

[kato]

The procedure I described was for slaughter cattle. For feeders, yes it is worse.

[farmers_son]

I was thinking of feeders when I suggested a form of rationing would take place to protect Canadian feedlots.

[kato]

Perhaps with the feeders, they'll feed them here and ship them south to slaughter. The path of least resistance. That wouldn't be all bad.

Not great if you're a Canadian feedlot competing to buy the calves, but not bad if you are into custom feeding. I think over the past two years we've developed an ability to adapt pretty quickly to whatever comes up.

This BSE thing has turned us into a real tough bunch of survivors eh? Kind of like our parents and grandparents who lived through the Depression. Once you've been to the bottom, you can deal with just about anything. We'll deal with whatever happens next. No matter how the various court cases turn out.

[cowman]

I believe this whole BSE thing, while very frustrating, is just part of a bigger picture? Americans are pretty paranoid right now about everything?
Look at all the drivel that happens at the border, proposed passports and about Canadian airlines flying over American airspace?
We need to realize in this country that our federal government needs to get with the American program or we will continue to lose trade and commerce? If America is freaked about how we let just about every low life into this country, then we need to address that? Can anyone really blame them for wanting to keep out known terrorists and criminals...while Canada welcomes them with open arms?
While I personally feel America blundered in a big way by starting an illegal war in Iraq, did we have to spit in their face and rub it in? Bush has screwed up royally and has a tiger by the tail and doesn't know how to let go, but it is not the time to say "I told you so!" In the end the American people will realize they are in another Vietnam?
The ideal situation, for both our countries, would be a harmonized system where there basically is no border, a common dollar, a common tax system, a common subsidy program? A defacto union?

[farmers_son]

Isn't that like saying if you see a bully beating up someone smaller, then you should just walk on by and say/do nothing?

Canada is not a third world banana republic even if the U.S. wants to treat us like one. We are a member of the G8, not to mention NAFTA. We are a proud supporter of the United Nations and Canadians should never forget the proud role we play in International Peace Keeping.

In fact, UN peacekeeping forces are very much the product of a Canadian initiative taken by Lester B. Pearson, then Canada’s Minister for External Affairs, during the Suez Canal crisis of 1956.

Canadians have a responsibility to speak up when we see any nation being the aggressor and attacking another country without cause. That is not rubbing their nose in it, as you say.

[silverback]

Not a third world banana republic??

Tell me how many civilized, democratic countries would allow their gov't to funnel money back to itself to stay in power? We have an electorate that has been convinced by a slackjawed media and the gov't that it is worse to vote for someone that would let them make their own decisions than someone that will do immoral things with their own money.

Break out the bananas !!

[jensend]

silverback: Tell me how many civilized, democratic countries would allow their gov't to funnel money back to itself to stay in power? We have an electorate that has been convinced by a slackjawed media and the gov't that it is worse to vote for someone that would let them make their own decisions than someone that will do immoral things with their own money

darn near every one. no excuse but we're no better and probably no worse than most of the so-called first world countries. we have a corrupt government kept in power by ontario because ontarians are afraid to let any other region have any influence and the liberals have taken advantage of the paranoia. look at what a show the conservatives are putting on. where did they dig up grewal? i agree with farmers_son's point that we shouldn't participate in immoral and illegal wars just because the americans are next door and our largest trading partner. that would be just as corrupt.

[silverback]

What part of the grewal tape makes the conservatives evil?? I am certainly under the impression that offering incentives to an MP in order to secure a vote is illegal. Correct? Are they not offering incentives? It really does not matter who contacted who, the issue is whether or not there are things being offered.

I realize that the American gov't does things that many feel could be done by simply talking it over, but until we lose 3000 people in a terrorist attack, I would suggest we have no idea what they feel is best for their country.

[jensend]

silverback - What part of the grewal tape makes the conservatives evil??

never said anything about evil. just looking like a bunch of buffoons with doctored tapes - they haven't denied it and him trying to break transport laws in vancouver. the conservatives do more to make themselves look bad than anybody else. if they would get their act together they could look like an alternative and i have always voted to the right. every time the conservatives come up with an issue they either push it too hard to fast or screw it up with somebody like grewal. they could let the liberals hang themselves with an effective strategy; instead they put the noose around their own necks and pull hard.

[silverback]

Ok, evil is probably too strong a word. My point was that somehow we are debating what is missing from the tapes instead of what has always been on them. The fact is that the PM's right hand man offered some goodies to someone so they would switch parties.

That is wrong.

To me it is too easy to spend time and energy finding reasons not to support the conservatives than it is to get rid of the crooks.

I do agree that many on this site could do a much better job of getting rid of the Liberals than some of the conservatives that are down there right now.

[cowman]

farmers son: I guess Australia and the UK are helping the bully beat the hell out of the weak kid too? along with a few other countries? Personally I think they are wrong, but then who am I?
Americans are freaked right now and probably with a lot of justification? The terrorists have it in for them in a big way, and who can blame them for not wanting to be attacked?
The point I was trying to make is this: Why don't we co-operate with their desire to have security for their homeland? How would you like to live beside a neighbor who invites all the Hells Angels over for a party everynight? Especially when the Hells Angels hate your guts and have vowed to kill you? Do you think it might make sense to ask your neighbor to not ask them over? Or build a chain link fence to keep them out?
Canada, in effect, allows in a whole bunch of pretty undesirable people? People who are not true immigrants in the tradiitional sense, but malcontents who want to continue their fights in this country? Who needs them?

[farmers_son]

I agree. I would add that most immigrants to this country are very good people, but there are a few exceptions and I believe steps are being taken to weed them out.

Americans are freaked right now, that is for sure. I think they are going a little overboard, after all in hindsight all that it would have taken to stop 9/11 was to bar access to the pilots cabin.

One countries terrorists are another countries freedom fighters. The U.S. can be terrorists too.

Relating this back to the NMA appeal and beef, the new U.S. ambassador has linked trade with Canada to security. Although when I watched 9/11 on TV I knew the world was going to be different as a result, I never forsaw that trade in beef was going to be part of what was different.

Also thinking back to 9/11, Canada was helping big time that day, more than anyone else, UK was turning U.S. planes away, Australia was out of the picture altogether. We do not deserve the treatment we have been getting from the Americans.

[silverback]

That sounds like a speech from Paul Martin. Finding a home for some airplanes and their passengers is perhaps the last time this country did anything neighborly for the U.S.. Start adding up the treatment since that time and the result is obvious. If you are calling the U.S. terrorists , I guess Canada is too. We sent troops to Afganistan and Iraq as you know. (Even though they weren't acknowledged)

[15444]

I think America needs to do some internal policy changes. Realize that if they are going to allow immigrants in, they have to quit with the 'Americanization' of them. It would tick me off too if I had to change myself in order to fit into another country. Interesting how terrorists like the Y2K bomber, Rassam, skipped Canada entirely and went to bomb the States? In Canada, you never hear about major foiled bomb plots...but the States always have sirens going off and are quick to flip the pretty colour chart to orange or red?....the only reason I can think of is that it might be the way America treats it's immigrants beliefs and values?