Test is Positive

[kpb]

I think everyone on this thread better cool their jets. Anyone in Canada who thinks this is good news is simply living in their own little dream world. There is no way, absolutely no way, that this is anything but bad news for Canada.

Do any of you really believe that this will speed up the opening of the border? What do you see that makes you think the U.S., now wounded and with its pride pricked, is going to be more flexible and open about opening the border to Canada? This will make it more difficult, not less, to get our border open. The Americans always react to their difficulties by becoming more closed, more restrictive and more protectionist, not less.

I would kind of hope we'd take a broader view of what our Canadian industry needs to survive, rather than gloating because the U.S.--our largest customer by the way in case all of you have forgotten--has its own BSE. Or does it make sense to all of you to spit in the face of our biggest customer and then wonder why they won't do what we want? You guys must all vote Liberal.


kpb

[kpb]

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF... I have never voted Liberal in my life ! The one we could hope that the US learns from this is that both countries need to work together and keep the industry integrated vs the protectionism that has taken place.
I haven't heard any quotes from our industry groups but I would hope that they are still trying to get a plan B in place vs thinking the border will open any sooner.

[rkaiser]

Or how about a theory from a guy who feels this whole BSE issue (Bull Shit Economics) is about money. And in fact has a notion that the mutinational packers call the shots.

Cebull's decision could very well have meant the end of the gravy train line for Cargil and Tyson, and in fact could have cost them dearly to start BSE testing to get rid of product. Lots of talk from lots of Canadian fronts about BSE testing lately.

Anywhoo, Cargil and Tyson decide that the end is likely for the salmon run, and tell our friend George to find someone like Ms. Fong to find a cow toot sweet.

This American born cow now makes Rlaugh's arguement about quarantineing their country a lost cause.

The border opens in July, no losses for Cargill and Tyson, and the damage caused to packers just south of the line leaves our hero's the best choice for slaughter for a good long time.

Somebody had to say it, didn't they?

[silverback]

Take it easy man. This may not be good news, but time will tell.

I think a lot of people that read this site have been getting sand kicked in our face from the U.S. beef industry for so long now that we can be excused for a little "I knew it" song and dance for a few minutes.

We have earned at least that much for enduring this hell ride for over 2 years.

[grassfarmer]

Thats a bit harsh kpb, I reckon half the posts on this thread share your caution over any potential upside of this news. If there are one or two gloating a bit can you blame them ? - it's a little stress reliever from battle weary producers sick of being on the receiving end of R-Calf and US protectionist BS.
I agree with you entirely that any border opening will not bring instant prosperity to our industry - even if it were to happen any time soon, of which there is no guarantee.

[kpb]

well grassfarmer I think a lot of Canadian cattle producers have this idea that the U.S. somehow owes us or that we are partners in the cattle industry. We are NOT partners with the U.S. any more than you are a partner with McDonalds when you buy a Big Mac.

A partnership only exists when both parties are working towards the same end. Our relationship with the U.S. in cattle and most other things is that we are the seller and they are the buyer. Its pretty basic that that is not a partnership.

This whole business about how the U.S. is mistreating us, how they are unfair to not open the border and, now, how we can gloat at their misfortune just makes me sick. So if I'm a little harsh I guess that's how I feel. We need them, they don't need us. Can you not get it into your heads that we are the suppliers and they are the customers?

Let's put it this way--if you're trying to sell anything to anyone do you start by insulting them (like Carolyn Parrish, the Liberal MP who called them an obscene name), or maybe do you tell them over and over that something they think is important is wrong (say Iraq) or maybe make gestures and yell at their leader when he visits? Do you do these things to your customer, the one that you want to buy something from you and then gloat when something goes wrong for that customer? And then do you have the nerve to be mad when they don't want to buy what you want? Grassfarmer that's not harsh, that's just the Canadian reality.

People in this country somehow think it's ok to insult and abuse the U.S. at every turn, then get all angry when they don't want to buy our things. Geez, who can blame them? They are our customers, not our partners, not our brothers, not our soul-mates--we need them, they don't need us.

kpb

[Willowcreek]

kpb- I have to agree with your analysis-- this will not do any good for Canada or the US in reopening exports... All this does is cast a bigger shadow over USDA's credibility, the quality of all testing thats been done so far in both countries, and make USDA's and OIE's "sound science" or "best science available" or "best science known to man" or whatever term you want to use look like a joke. Remember this was an OIE approved testing procedure that failed-- What else has OIE proclaimed as gospel that is not true???? Is OIE's SRM removal guidelines accurate or adequate? I think USDA will have to go back and relook at and answer a lot of questions before either the court or the world open up borders without testing. Either way right now USDA is too busy stumbling all over itself trying to cover up the bumbles they created by years of hiring former meat industry and NCBA employees that were packer yes men... Johanns attack of OIG pretty much shows that he didn't have an idea what was going on ...

[farmers_son]

kpb: The U.S. does need us. We are their largest trading partner, repeat partner, a billion dollars of trade every day. Believe it or not, if trade with Canada suddenly and completely stopped overnight the U.S. economy would collapse. So would ours as the two economies are so closely linked but the bigger they are the harder they fall and the U.S. would fall big time.

They need our oil and gas and they need our beef. U.S. packing plants are shutting down or reducing staff and hours. Doesn't that suggest they need us? U.S. demand for beef is dropping due to high retail prices and consumers are switching to alternate meats. Doesn't that suggest they need us? Yes, the U.S. producer is realizing high prices now but it is not sustainable in the long term. The winners of the BSE border closure will be the hog and chicken producers, not American beef producers. How long can the U.S. packers keep loosing money? They can only shore up their bottom line with profits from their Canadian and Australian operations for so long. The U.S. packing industry is genuinely threatened by the continued closure of the U.S./Canada border to live cattle.

We do not need to approach the Americans on bended knee. The U.S. is not our customer, they are our trading partner, note that partner word again. NAFTA is not a seller/customer relationship. It is a multilateral trade relationship between sovereign nations.

Most Americans do not support the war in Iraq either. Bush barely got elected and not everyone who voted Republican was in favour of the war, just not impressed with Kerry.

Canada does have a role to play in world affairs, very few Canadians would want us to shrink and hide from important world issues. This proud Canadian agrees with the stand Canada has taken to preserve the United Nations and basic fundamental freedoms and rights of peoples all over the world, not just in Iraq, to self determination. If that stand has cost me the sale of a few cull cows that is a price I will pay.

Throughout the BSE crisis, Canadian beef producers have been resolute and determined to see this through to the end. We certainly do not need to go sniveling like a beaten dog to the Americans now that they have found their own BSE positive. Maybe the border will open now they are forced to admit they have BSE, maybe it won’t. Bottom line, I still have my head above water, I am tougher than I thought. Our entire family has pulled together to see our farm come through the BSE crisis and no one here is in any mood to kiss American butt now.

[farmers_son]

well said farmers_son. !!!

[farmers_son]

well said farmers_son. !!!