What should our groups have done?

[cowman]

The CCA and ABP were pretty ineffective at getting much done...but then in reality who was? The Canadian government, with their vast resources and clout, couldn't do much either? When ever you are dealing with some one who holds all the cards, you are basically screwed?
Unfortunately in this day and age you need some type of organization to lobby government and what we have is ABP and the CCA. I truly believe the delegates of the ABP are trying their best and are not in it for personal glory or something!
If you take three farmers and ask them about a solution to anything, you'll probably get three different answers! I might really like BIG C's solution but obviously a lot of people didn't...otherwise the ABP would be all BIG C members?
I wonder when people start talking about "serious" producers and catering to their needs? If that is the case then I would suggest the "unserious" producers should no longer be subject to the mandatory checkoff? Not much sense paying a checkoff that works against your interests but goes to promote the "serious" producers agenda?
In reality we already have that? The ABP promotes a lot of ideas that benifit a small chosen few? A clear example would be allowing in blue tongue cattle so the feedlots can have a cheap source of US calves(normal times), or the continued protection of the grazing leases?
Both these programs are pushed to protect the chosen few over the majority?

[PureCountry]

Cowman, when you are dealing with someone who's holding all the cards, you get up and go to another table. If you're real smart, you'll find one where YOU can hold them all.

P.S. - you do not - under any circumstances - sit there and take the 'screwing' like our industry did over the last 26 months.

[farmers_son]

While the Americans were the ones who closed the border and it really fell to them to “open” the border such as it is we should not overlook the important fact that our beef organizations played a crucial role in maintaining consumer confidence in Canadian beef at home. Our domestic consumer is still our number one market and in spite of some very negative comments being made about Canadian beef we are today in a position where we focus on normalizing trade with the U.S. instead of rebuilding at home.

Second our beef organizations and representatives did a lot of work to keep producer confidence from collapsing through the crisis. The Canadian cow herd grew since 2003 in a time when a major sell off of cattle would have caused a wreck. If it had been up to our beef organizations to open the border the border would have been open mid summer 2003 but producers should not overlook what was accomplished.

Assuming the “serious producer” comment was made in an email to smcgrath76 by someone who could have posted those comments here but did not I do not think the remark deserves the time of day.

Perhaps now that we have live cattle crossing the border the ABP/CCA can pay more attention to the problem of unfair pricing of live cattle in North America, not just Canada. Part of that solution could well be a producer owned packing plant. I do not think the ABP or CCA is against producer packing plants in any way shape or form but the view is producers are coming together now to build those plants and that is the best way to go. I personally believe it is necessary for our beef organizations to get more hands on if we are serious about increasing packing capacity and restoring a measure of competition on the Canadian side of the border but not everyone shares that opinion.

I am serious when I say North American producers need to work together instead of viewing each other as competition to be overcome. It is not just the American producers who are pursuing an American first policy, I hear Canadian producers talking about Canada gaining an advantage in this market and that market when in fact the markets are all controlled by packing plants that are international and global in scope. It is something we really need to consider if we ever hope to improve the situation of producers in Canada, U.S. and Mexico. By the way, lets not forget the Mexicans were our big time friends throughout the BSE crisis.

[smcgrath76]

Interesting comments. Some provincial groups such as MCPA do have a refundable checkoff. Others such as SSGA have an optional membership.
Based on comments I have heard regarding participation (for example in ABP), I think I must live in one of the most active zones here in the NE. We will generally get a pretty full house at zone meetings in the fall.
I agree that most of these delegates do this out of the goodness of their heart for the interest of the industry. Often I think that their service on ABP or other like organizations is their first introduction to the entire production chain from farmgate to plate.
I agree with F_S on a couple of things. The US is the largest consumer market in the world and it happens to be not only next door, but also part of a NAFTA agreement. While we may be pissed at the US as producers, we should ignore this market at our peril.
I also agree with searching out further markets, particularly in the rapidly developing Asian Rim.
More domestically owned and controlled capacity AND FURTHER PROCESSING you bet. This is all tied in with expanding markets, and obtaining control of our destiny and better prices.
I am not sure how industry groups really fit into these developments in terms of being "hands on" without benefiting a select group of producers who choose to participate in these types of ventures with their own capital.
As far as the serious/not serious comment, my two cents are that there is no real way to figure this out based on herd size/economic indicator or otherwise. I do know that there are producers who care about what they are doing and how it gets done and unfortunately there are some who don't. My comments were in no way intended to offend, but I do think that it is an important point in the discussion of direction, as I see a lot of organizations focusing on "bigger" producers, rather than all or serious producers. In my opinion this is due largely to the current commodity nature of our business.

[cakadu]

I believe domestic consumers were doing more to support their local producers because it was the producers getting out there with product i.e. more direct marketers. As a result more consumers had a better idea of where their beef came from and how it got to them. Producers themselves were more in the public eye in a lot of respects than the organizations were.

The other thing that was a big help was when the news broke that the packers got the lions share of the bailout money. This was one time when consumers saw a direct cause and effect and to me, this caused them to throw their support behind beef.

We have a food safety system in this country that consumers have come to rely on and the fact that the science told them it was safe was a significant factor in the confidence, that and the fact that the condemned animal that started all of this never hit the food chain.

From what I read in these posts over the past 2 years and learned from talking with people, I would say that many folks felt that we would have been much better off had we focused on producer owned plants and finding new markets instead of continually arguing that the border should have been open.

I'm not entirely convinced that integrated our markets even further is the way to go, nor am I convinced that relying on the market to the south of us is the best either.

The single best thing we can do for ourselves is to stop selling live cattle across the border and keep the value here with producers and in Canada.

I wonder now how we will progress with accomplishing that.

[cakadu]

I think that Agricultural Societies across the province did a super job of raising community awareness of the crisis in the beef industry and many of them initiated beef on a bun events, as did many municipalities.
The support the industry received from Albertans was second to none and much of it as you say Linda was community driven. I would venture to say that ABP can't really take much credit for the outpouring of support for the industry. They certainly did their part but community organizations were the driving force behind the ongoing support. Many producers did start their own beef sales and truckload sales are common sights across the province.

[cakadu]

I believe domestic consumers were doing more to support their local producers because it was the producers getting out there with product i.e. more direct marketers. As a result more consumers had a better idea of where their beef came from and how it got to them. Producers themselves were more in the public eye in a lot of respects than the organizations were.

The other thing that was a big help was when the news broke that the packers got the lions share of the bailout money. This was one time when consumers saw a direct cause and effect and to me, this caused them to throw their support behind beef.

We have a food safety system in this country that consumers have come to rely on and the fact that the science told them it was safe was a significant factor in the confidence, that and the fact that the condemned animal that started all of this never hit the food chain.

From what I read in these posts over the past 2 years and learned from talking with people, I would say that many folks felt that we would have been much better off had we focused on producer owned plants and finding new markets instead of continually arguing that the border should have been open.

I'm not entirely convinced that integrated our markets even further is the way to go, nor am I convinced that relying on the market to the south of us is the best either.

The single best thing we can do for ourselves is to stop selling live cattle across the border and keep the value here with producers and in Canada.

I wonder now how we will progress with accomplishing that.

[cakadu]

I believe domestic consumers were doing more to support their local producers because it was the producers getting out there with product i.e. more direct marketers. As a result more consumers had a better idea of where their beef came from and how it got to them. Producers themselves were more in the public eye in a lot of respects than the organizations were.

The other thing that was a big help was when the news broke that the packers got the lions share of the bailout money. This was one time when consumers saw a direct cause and effect and to me, this caused them to throw their support behind beef.

We have a food safety system in this country that consumers have come to rely on and the fact that the science told them it was safe was a significant factor in the confidence, that and the fact that the condemned animal that started all of this never hit the food chain.

From what I read in these posts over the past 2 years and learned from talking with people, I would say that many folks felt that we would have been much better off had we focused on producer owned plants and finding new markets instead of continually arguing that the border should have been open.

I'm not entirely convinced that integrated our markets even further is the way to go, nor am I convinced that relying on the market to the south of us is the best either.

The single best thing we can do for ourselves is to stop selling live cattle across the border and keep the value here with producers and in Canada.

I wonder now how we will progress with accomplishing that.

[ALICIA]

I haven't been on for a while, but I still keep in touch with the coments being posted.
The live cattle will stay in Canada as long as the Canadian Buyers out bid the American Buyers.
Will this happen?

[ALICIA]

In all fairness to ABP and CCA, I think their mandate was originally set by producers. If that mandate has changed or is no longer applicable, producers need to take the lead in making sugggestions for change. As cowman says, producers likely aren't all on the same page when it comes to what they expect their industry organizations to do for them.
Hopefully the zone meetings this fall will be well attended and positive suggestions will come forward vs the inane complaining. I have't heard what our zone reps have done since they were elected.