NAFTA Ruling on Softwood Lumber

[dferguson]

You seem to be paying them quite well so you must need them. I would venture to say that you get as many who have less education and who are also "go-getters" as you say,who will do well in your booming economy.

[dferguson]

What do you mean by "well brainwashed sheeple"?

[dferguson]

cowman the smart kids now are taking a trade vs spending four years in University and hoping to find a job when they graduate. A friend of mine was dismayed to learn that her nephew was going to become an power engineer in a gas plant. She thought it was not nearly as elite a position as if he had a degree from U of A or UBC or some other hoity toity place !!!

I said, look the kid up in a few years, he is getting paid big bucks to learn on the job. Nothing against the students that attend university but there are many out in the oil patch and in forestry occupations at this time that are getting ahead fast !!!

Cowman we do need educated professionals, no where near enough medical doctors in this country and we all know that there won't be any large animal vets pretty soon if we don't encourage more young people to go that route vs doctoring cats and dogs, so education is necessary. Lord knows we need accountants to fill out our CAIS forms !!!

[dferguson]

Cowman; since you decline to elaborate on your terminology as I requested I can only assume you were drunk or otherwise incapacitated when you wrote it. That's OK. Happens to everyone now and again. If you think you would be better off as an american, that's easily accomplished, as I am sure you are aware. Just slide on south. I'm sure they will welcome you with open arms. You're their kind of people!

[dferguson]

But I forgot!! In another post you refer to Montana as "the dogpatch of the united states." Then go on to say that Montana and Alberta have a lot in common. Where you going with this?

[cowman]

dferguson: Sorry to disappoint you but I am a tea totaller and can't drink alcohol.
Sheeple? Sheep-people? People who are followers and can't think for themselves? Need the government and CBC to do their thinking for them?
Why in the world would I want to leave my home and move to the USA? I have roots here on both sides of my family that predate this province. My people were the pioneers who built this country. Bought and paid for this land in blood sweat and tears!
Somehow I seem to have offended you by my opinion of how the government spends my money? Sorry if I don't fit into your version of what a good little Canadian should be.

[dferguson]

Cowman; thanks for the definition. What makes you think that people in Nova Scotia can't think for themselves? Please note that we have a Conservative government here as you do. As for CBC I am of the opinion that their programming has improved tremendously since they have all gone on strike. I guess what I would really like to hear from you is the reason for your animosity toward the Atlantic Provinces, which you seem to throw in with central Canada.

[dferguson]

now cowman, don't you tick off the maritimers because I am going down there next year on a vacation and I want to be welcome !!! I don't care what cowman says I think that the maritimers are the salt of the earth and so I should, my mother was from NS !!

[cowman]

Well where did I ever rip the Maritimes? In fact where did I ever rip farmers anywhere?
In one thread you tell me to look beyond Toronto/Montreal/Ottawa...I hate to tell you this but they are the problem?
In 2004 Alberta collected $8.4 billion dollars in royalties on oil and gas. In 2004 they sent Ottawa $9.3 billion in "transfer payments"! In other words all our oil and gas revenues plus another $900,000 went to Ottawa!
The golden triangle rules Canada but they can't do it without the compliance of the rest of the country. The Maritimes are on the gravy train just like Quebec. I don't blame them for voting the way they do, they are just taking care of their best interests? However as an Albertan I believe the people of Alberta should get a share of their own assetts instead of giving it away?
There are a lot of people working in the oil patch from the Maritimes...a lot of young people. It is amazing the way they change when they get out here and realize they can make something of themselves without relying on the government. Very few of them will ever go back.

[madcow]

cowman,I've got relatives and friends in Ft. McMurray.My uncle went out there when syncrude was just a gopher hole,he transferred there from the Gulf Oil refinery in Point Tupper ,Cape Breton,he was a mechanical engineer,educated at Mount Allison N.B. and NSIT, N.S..He was senior vice president at Syncrude when he retired and his son has followed the exact same steps as his father with the exception of not working for gulf in Point Tupper.My Uncle is retired back here now, along with a lot of the crew that went out there at that time. My cousin intends to retire back here as well.They don't all become sheeple Albertan's.
Emerald 1 ,your welcome in the Maritimes and I know for a fact that dferguson and I would both be glad to set and chat over a cup of tea.What part of N.S. are you headed for ?I can post an email address to get in touch directly. cowman you come along too,a good drink of maritime rum might loosen ya up a bit,remember ,,,we're all in this together.....

[madcow]

madcow, thanks for the invite for tea. Would prefer it to rum, thanks !! I will be spending time in NS and PEI. My mother was from Gays River near Truro so will spend some time in that area.

Cowman does make good points about folks from the maritimes being able to come to AB and get employment. Many of them have chosen to stay because they came here at a young age and put down roots here, but that doesn't mean that they will ever renounce the fact that they are maritimers at heart !!!

Trouble is that we in Alberta see the unfairness of continually sending money to Ottawa and having to fight tooth and nail for anything in return, sadly we tend to blame the people who continually vote for the Liberal government . Central Canada certainly does get the lions share of the pie, and that is a proven fact.

[dferguson]

Cowman; You say "the Maritimes are on the gravey train just like quebec" I hate to have to tell you but the gravey is getting pretty watery by the time it gets this far east. As it happens, the Maritime provinces all have Conservative governments at the moment And although there are some Liberal MP's I think that's true across the country. Don't blame us for putting them in perpetual power. Don' think that we profit by it. Regarding your pioneering ancestors, I dare say that my family has been in Nova Scotia twice as long as your family has been in Alberta. Not to belittle their trials and tribulations but being delivered by train to the treeless, fertile grassland where all they had to do to start a crop was drop their plow in the ground, Looks like a bit of a treat compared to being shoved onto the shore from a leaky timber boat and then clear the spruce trees off a piece of rocky hilltop. My father was the first generation to leave the hills in my family. I don't think any of the early settlers of this country had an easy time of it. None of them cornered the market on "blood, sweat and tears".

[madcow]

cowman, my favorite color is blue, and the Maritimes are all conservatively blue !! The riding I live in is federally and provincially blue,and has been for years.
I am three miles from the piece of land originally settled by my first Nova Scotian ancestor.It was granted to him when he was discharged from the British navy in Halifax N.S., after the defeat of Napoleon.They too hacked their living from a rocky tree covered hill top.Their gravy was thin then and mine is today,mine partly due to the cost of fuel,,,,which in some twisted way may be connected to the thickness of yours. I wonder if my ancestors grumbled about financing the cost and carrying the burden of building a railroad to that empty treeless plain,with no clue of the oil under the soil.I doubt it ,we're not like that.To them it was nation building,suffer and sweat a little ( and bleed) to accomplish something great. And they did !! With out it YOU might have been a maritimer . And because of it you're Canadian , EH !
Point of interest,country by color ; Central Canada(the red)pie grabber is not the blue (far east)nearly pieless, and we're not in dogpatch,we (NFLD & NS) are working on getting our fair share of the natural gas $,hope your Alberta attitude (not implying many out there have it ,I know most don't ) doesn't come with it.

[cowman]

Some how or other I come out of this as attacking the Maritimes? That is totally not my intention!
In the big picture you got screwed just as much as the west, maybe more.
What I am saying is this country Canada is not working? It isn't working for Alberta and there is a seperatist movement that is gaining strength out here! Right now it is a small voice but I believe it is finally becoming credible? No longer just the radical rednecks but some pretty solid people?
Will it ever come to anything? Who knows? Our present provincial government is fairly solid federalists? I suspect though that all we need is a "messiah" to start the ball rolling as there is a general discontent with the status quoe in Alberta?
The fact is we don't have a lot in common with a good portion of the rest of Canada? The laws and bills that the rest of Canada embraces are often very unpopular in Alberta? The NEP was very popular in most of Canada but truly hated in Alberta.
The government of Canada has decided that Quebec has a right to go if it wants to...that has to apply equally to every province I would think? Albertans will decide where that takes us?
I think you will find Albertans support the Maritimes getting their fair share of natural resources? I believe Ralph Klein stood up for them in a big way against the feds?
Here is a question: If Quebec leaves where does that leave the Maritimes? If Quebec leaves and then the west, what happens then? Would you consider setting up your own country or stay with Ontario?

[madcow]

cowman,I didn't take you as much anti-maritime as anti-Canadian,and no it's not working perfectly.I just think it's better to keep tinkering with it ,rather than junk it. I've been having trouble with a front tire on my tractor ,it's a new tire but its got a thorn in it somewhere and goes flat about every second week.I can't seem to find the thorn,and I certainly can't afford to throw it away.So I fix it ,and make a little progress, and maybe fix it again !But taking the tire off ,throwing it away and continuing with out it is not an option,is it ?. If you look back at Canadian history ,we have all been the regional flat tire at times. We patch it and move on,it's nice to think about getting out when things are rosy,,but the time 'might' come when you need the rest of us.Remember ,we're all in this together,one big pool ,so don't"pee" in your end and I'll hold it in this end.,,,,,,,,,,,.