Expansion?

[PureCountry]

Land rental rates are always connected to land values, and for sure in your area, cowman, $80/acre pales in comparison to the cost per acre to buy the damn stuff. But still, I don't understand how anyone's making much of a profit margin on $80/acre. Your overhead can only go so high because we only get paid so much for our product.

I don't know. If they're making money paying those rates, good on 'em.

[cswilson]

Recreational farming makes it hard on young guys trying to start up. We have to bid against 'sun downers' here who are ranching for tax breaks. One was just here other day moaning that his CAIS never paid out-I'm thinking you made a 100 grand off farm there buddy lol. We'd see a major change in ranching and farming if a few tax laws changed at least in our area. I'm glad I got a million other things I'd rather do then rent land at $80/acre to drive a tractor around lol. If I spend more than 10 hours a year in one I break out in a rash. Too many years of spending 500/month in them when I was younger.

[grassfarmer]

Max, that's a great comment about surrounding yourself with positive people. I recently was at a Grey Wooded Forage Association event and took along a friend that had never been before - he was amazed at the crowd as they were so different from any ag gathering he had ever attended in Western Canada. The age profile is the first difference - younger crowd with many producers in their 20s and 30s. Many females in evidence too, again some in their twenties. Overall the mood was one of optimism, how much could be achieved in future with better practises and management. Nowhere did we hear the usual coffee shop doom and gloom. Very much a glass half full crowd - and you do come back from such events feeling rejuvinated.

[cowman]

Well I hope all these optomists have some money so they can get out there and buy out all the pessimists!
There are a lot of older guys just chomping at the bit to quit and retire, so hope some of these young guys are willing to step up to the plate and buy?
Hopefully we'll see a good bred cow market this fall. I suspect if cows can get back into that $1200 range you'll see all kinds of movement?
In my opinion that is a good thing? Quite often when you go to a auction mart sale it is like visiting the old folks home!
I wonder if these young producers will have the finances to buy out the older generation or will good old Dad have to give it to them? Maybe we need to import a few more ornery rich Scots? LOL
The boy has intentions of holding back more heifers and feeding them for next years bred market. He thinks there is a pentup demand for young breeding stock as there haven't been a lot of heifers retained the last couple of years? I think it really depends if this darned cull cow market gets going? There are a lot of old cows around that should have gone to MacDonalds a while ago.

[grassfarmer]

The biggest opportunity I see coming is for some of the older producers to rent their land out to the youngsters starting out. That makes so much more sense - very often the older folks are fed up farming but don't want to sell up and retire to town. They would be happy to stay in their own house, surrounded by the countryside and all their friends and neighbours. It's a matter of working out rental rates and the youngsters maybe being prepared to live in a trailer or travel to the farm every day.

[Cattleman]

The problem with that grassfarmer is that youngsters still can't get started as they can't afford the crazy rental rates. Especailly if they have to upgrade equipment etc. To many people out there with deep pockets and everything paid for who just pick up a few more quarters to justify all the iron they run.

[grassfarmer]

The future I see for these new entrants doesn't involve metal so they shouldn't be hampered by having to upgrade equipment or bid against plow jockeys wanting to "justify" their latest toy by renting more acres.
It's about beef and it's about grass, period. If a young guy rented an existing cattle farm, set it up to summer graze using a few electric fences and piped water and ran custom yearlings or cow/calf pairs for the grazing season he should be able to under bid anyone farming metal to run cows - and make money. Do that in the summer and work on rigs in winter if necessary - bypass all the high costs of ownership and maintaining cattle through our northern winter.
I think there are opportunities for this type of deal in my area.

[cowman]

I doubt many established farmers would want to rent their land out for something like this. Too chancy you'd ever get paid! At the end of the day who is going to pay to get the grass broke up? Some very serious costs involved there?
Rents are, in reality, too high for the farmer actually trying to make a decent profit? And yet the landlord needs something too or why would he want to hold the assett?
I wonder why anyone who is serious about farming(whether grass or crops) would really want to pay $80/acre when they could go to Sask. or Man. or even northern AB, and buy land for two or three years rent?
Farming for young people really doesn't make any sense unless you marry it or inherit it! I believe a young person could make a lot more doing just about anything else?

[grassfarmer]

Ha Ha Cowman - you are too funny!
Coming the same old, old story that grass is a waste of land and no-one should do it. Of course grass growing is totally wrong and it would have to be seeded back to a monoculture of high input, non profitable, cereals once the crazy grass farmer had gone bust.
You've been talking down the beef sector, wanting to cull the national herd, backing the US and backing the packers ever since I found Agriville several years ago - and at the same time expanding your family operation to include more cows and even grass management. It's a very old Scottish trick - talk the industry down and try and get others to leave so you can pick up their land. We are a shrewd people!

[cowman]

grassfarmer: Quit telling all my secrets LOL!
But seriously...I do believe growing grain on the better land is the way to go. I still believe that you can mix the two(grass and grain) in a profitable venture...despite poor grain prices!
Straw and after math grazing can add so much to the bottom line...in my humble opinion?
Yes, grain is a dog! Mainly because our useless government decided they were too cheap to support the Canadian grain farmer and fight the grain wars!
I'm still learning some things about grass. I still believe you need to break up these heavy clay/loam soils every once in awhile and replant?
Hey, I'll be the first to admit I don't have all the answers! I do know I enjoy seeing a very well grown crop of barley or canola! I really enjoy just walking through a good crop and checking for things like moisture or disease or how well it is filling...and I don't grow any grain!
I even like to run the combine or grain truck for my cousin and I especially enjoy a bit of field work...well at least for a day or so!
My old Dad was 100% farmer! Said he was just in heaven out cultivating or seeding or harvesting! He told me that was as about as close to God as he would ever get in this world! Well whatever!
I wonder...did you grow any crops in Scotland?