CBEF, BIC, etc.

[smcgrath76]

I am hearing that ACC should not have become ABP, but I don't think that one overall producer group could really make that big of a difference either.
1. Ag represents very few votes
2. Even if you had one big group, I suspect it would be impossible to stand up and sing "solidarity forever" witha straight face.
3. We are playing in a global economy through trade policy, etc. whether we want to or not. If we held out to raise the price of live cattle, I suspect that the evil packing empire would go elsewhere they could more readily exploit the masses, and policy would be to import beef.
4. I think a mass move would just piss off Canadian consumers.
5. I am not sure that we can go down the road of protectionism or mass uprising. Canadian farmers have been pretty successful where they have been allowed to compete and inovate. I think our groups need to help us move into the food chain, rather than the commodity chain. That is where the real money is.

[smcgrath76]

Ag may represent a very few votes but the commodity groups that represent the livestock industry have a lot of power with the AB Government, because they represent the suppliers of the products that are part of the governments benchmark in value added production.

[cowman]

Getting way too much ageement on here lately? I guess I'll have to come up with some really outrageous statement soon before this love fest gets out of hand? Maybe I'll just have to beat up old Willowcreek to get things going? LOL

[smcgrath76]

Further thought this morning...
Commodity groups are basically formed to maintain/produce stability in the industry they are representing. They are directed to fight for income insurance, marketing boards, and general good times for the already established producer. Admittedly, in new industries the commodity group is often a real seller of the industry, but as the industry is established they generally settle back into maintain the status quo (as directed by their members).
Basically the beef groups are no different, and I can see how as a producer nearing retirement or financial freedom that is perfect. Personally, I think I would prefer chaos. For young producers chaos creates a lot more opportunities for ingenuity and low cost market access.
Perhaps the problem isn't with our farm groups, but with our farmers.
I doubt when I reach the average age of farmers today (54 or so) I will be as into taking risk as I am right now when I have hopefully got a lot less to lose.

[DaneG]

Promoting our product may help influence consumer choice? It seems to me that ag producers are one of the very few industries that do this.You don't see mining companys promoting jewlery or oil companys promoting car tires.

[cowman]

Sean: Think you are a little low on the farm age thing? A few years ago it was 58? Don't know if there has been a big infusion of young blood...if so not in my area?
I think you have it pretty well right though? When a person gets a little older they aren't out to set the world on fire but tend to just go with the flow.
I remember when I was young I thought the old man was a hopeless dinosaur...but it was amazing how he got smarter as I got older! LOL
And hey when you are young and full of beans that is the time to take a risk not when you know the old rocking chair is right around the corner! I personally find it sad though that in so many cases that's the ball game for that particular farm? The lack of young people entering agriculture is a sorry state of affairs, in my opinion?
I don't have any solution for this problem. Government neglect wasn't helpful. And I'm not talking subsidies...just real poor policy for too many years!
I think also lack of family support wasn't helpful. We live in a world where everybody thinks of themselves and never look at the big picture? The reason most of us are here is our anscestors were sick of being serfs or slaves and desired to be their own masters? And we are slipping back into slavery! Just my opinion.

[Willowcreek]

Cowman-"Getting way too much ageement on here lately? I guess I'll have to come up with some really outrageous statement soon before this love fest gets out of hand? Maybe I'll just have to beat up old Willowcreek to get things going? LOL "

Cowman- The same thing regarding the cattle organizations happened down here.. We had a good organization with the NCA- then they decided to bring in all "phases" of the industry- and we ended up with NCBA which pretty well now only represents the large Feeders and the Big 4 Packers anymore...That is what brought about the formation of R-CALF- which love it or hate it, does represent the grassroots cattleman....

As far as people going into ranching- the same is occurring down here...Very few young ones going into it...Unless they inherit or marry into a large operation they can't compete with the land prices being paid by the corporate land investors or hunting and conservation groups...Most end up leaving the rural community for school and never come back......

[cowman]

Well Willowcreek, I think up here many of us think the ABP(Alberta Beef Producers) represents the big feedlots and to a certain extent the packers, rather than the cow/calf rancher? Sort of like how you see the NCBA?
Actually about ten years ago there was a movement to set up a cow/calf organization but it didn't fly because many of the big ranchers grazed cattle on public land and the ABP has always stood up for them in a really big way!
Now I'm not really sure of your situation down there in regards to a checkoff? Up here we have an enforced mandatory checkoff that goes to the ABP...supposedly for beef promotion, export enhancement, and lobbying the government. Probably also buys a few steaks and whisky for the boys in the know...but I'd better not go there! Does your NCBA have a mandatory checkoff?

[Willowcreek]

We have a mandatory Beef checkoff that was mandated by the USDA for beef promotion- good idea- but problem is that NCBA wrote the law to give them control of it, contracts the operation of, and pretty much controls it and the message it puts out...Altho they are not supposed to be making money, they benefit thru the contracting of office space, personnell, and also use it as an advertising source for themselves...

Pretty much the same down here as far as membership...Many of the members of the NCBA are the Big feeder operations and the big ranchs with large holdings of government lease... None of them want any type of government control or intervention to shake the boat....

[cowman]

So let me get this straight: Somehow or other you can join or not, but no matter what, you pay the checkoff?
Up here I think you are a member of the ABP whether you like it or not and you pay the checkoff on every animal sold. This was a "democratic" decision where anyone who sold cattle in Alberta got a vote on whether or not the checkoff would remain mandatory. It was a big deal up here. 12% of elegible producers bothered to vote and 51% of those 12% voted to keep the checkoff mandatory! In other words slightly less than 6% of producers decided the checkoff would be mandatory! This gave the ABP the right to do whatever in the hell they wanted...democracy in action...you see!
Now personally I was on the NO side! In fact I did a lot of campaigning and donated $200! Well so much for that...as my momma used to tell me...A fool and his money are soon parted!
The good old ABP is very efficient? Every month they sent out their little propoganda sheet, whether you wanted it or not? In fact they sent my old dead Dad one every month for ten years after he was dead, despite several letters, phone calls etc. telling them he was dead! In the final letter I told them he had changed his address and to please send the sheet to the Pine Lake grave yard! Not sure if they finally figured it out but the sheet stopped coming....don't know if there is a big stack out at the graveyard or not! LOL