new hay field...........

[tweaker101]

Was looking on the web at all the varities of hay blends from the different seed companys out there and was looking for some ideas and opinons on what I should seed. I want to hay this land for atleast 5-7 years and put it back to pasture after.

[PureCountry]

Not sure what area you're in, but keep in mind that haying it for 5-7 years is going to mine alot of nutrients out of your soil. You should monitor the health of it with annual sampling to see if you need to make any amendments.

As for a mixture, I would say take a soil sample first thing. Find out what your pH is and all your nutrients, then go from there. If you're in black soil country, Alfalfa with some Brome, fescue, or timothy is hard to beat. Varieties matter very little in my opinion, as long as you get healthy seed to start, and have healthy soil, it'll grow to beat the band.

[tweaker101]

picked up some alfalfa seed mix last night was a three mixture of tapping and creeping root and another that was to have a quick recoverey after being cut. Also have meadow brome and am currently looking for a tall fescue?. Thanks for the comments PureCountry we will be checking.

[PureCountry]

Coincidentally, we're seeding 100 acres the same way this weekend - when it stops raining. 6lbs of Meadow Brome, 1.5lb Rangelander Alfalfa, 1.5lbs Matrix Alf., and 1.5lbs Annex Alf. The Annex is supposed to have twice as many seeds per pound as other alfalfas, so we're pretty much seeding 6lbs equivalent of alfalfa. The grazing will have to be monitored a bit, but it'll be worth it for how far it will go to rebuild the health of the soil in those fields.

[grassfarmer]

You wouldn't consider seeding some sod forming grasses as well as a bunch grass and alfalfa? On the area we seeded down in 2002 with meadow brome plus many other species there is still a problem of getting complete ground cover (ie no soil visible.) I wish we had slightly increased the kentucky/creeping fescue component just to get quicker, better ground cover. These are not very productive or desirable species for me but they are better than bare soil! Maybe it's hard to get and maintain complete soil cover due to moisture limitations in Alberta? It's sure disconcerting for someone coming from a wet country to see less than complete ground cover.

[mb_rancher]

In my opinion you cant beat a good alfalfa/meadow brome mix. They seem to darn near compliment each other. The meadow brome can get chewed down a bit and get some rain and it just jumps back up. A lot of trouble with the sod forming grasses is tthat they dont grow as fast. Those are my experiences here in Manitoba.

[grassfarmer]

I absolutely agree that meadow brome is a great grass, it's certainly the most productive we have - but until I see the bunches touching each other I will still worry about bare soil. I haven't much experience of alfalfa but on another quarter it is coming in strongly from volunteers. I laugh at that as the last owner told me the place couldn't grow alfalfa, he hadn't seeded any since about 1996 there wasn't a plant of it to be seen when I came here in 2001.
On another area that was formerly a straight timothy stand we went to a near monoculture of quack but are now getting a predominant stand of orchard grass with red clover. And of all these meadow brome is the only one I seeded, it's great what nature provides.

[PureCountry]

If I could grow fescue here, or Bluegrass, I'd do it. It just doesn't seem to go. Once the alfalfa and brome get well established, I don't think we'll have much for open ground. With proper grazing and stock density, we should always be laying down some litter, which will only go straight into the organic layer. It's a positive cycle once you get it working for you.

Our landbase is going to get a few acres greener every year until there is no cropland.

[smcgrath76]

Interested in the conversation about Meadow Brome. It seems to be pretty productive for us. We have pounded it hard in drought years to keep cattle from going onto native range prior to mid-June. It comes back and is fairly productive. The litter is an issue with this grass though, as we have noticed the leaves are quite fine and break down quickly without a lot of thatch developing.
One forb we have looked at, but have not used as yet is Cicer Milkvetch. A legume, but less bloat risk than alfalfa. We are considering interseeding it with crested wheat for early spring and then followup grazing regime. Anyone have any experience with this one?

[PureCountry]

I'd be careful of that combination, just because crested wheat is easy to catch and very competitive, and Milkvetch is supposed to be the absolute opposite. The crested wheat may hold the milkvetch back some. Anyone I've talked to that tried the milkvetch had to wait 3-4 years for a good stand.

[grassfarmer]

We have worked with some cicer milkvetch - some seed went in with that mixture in 2002 but there are very few plants visible but the ones that are there are getting stronger every year. The best I've ever seen was at Brian Luce's place up next to where Randy is. In their almost drought conditions last year the other grasses were fairly short even after extended rest but the cicer was standing up like bushes across the field. Each plant was 12-14 inches high and maybe two feet across with trailing branches reaching out across the ground. The plants do well once they are really established and suit extended rest periods better than alfalfa as the regrowth doesn't turn woody before the rest of the pasture is ready to regraze. I think it would be my legume of choice if we can get it established as it essentially lasts for ever and palatability is good although I note my cows don't specifically seek it out to graze first. Brian seeded a lot of his by incorporating seed in the cow minerals and we are doing this now too. I saw plants here yesterday that were as strong as the ones we seeded 4 years ago and the seed only went on last summer. It seems that some seeds will not even germinate for 3 or 4 years so perhaps putting it through a cow might be a good way to do it. It's certainly a cheap way to do it!
I agree with the point on meadow brome not making good litter - we have tramped a fairly heavy stand into the ground in wet conditions but it seems to break down too fast, as if it lacks tough enough fibre. Timothy on the other hand makes better litter than cattle feed!