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questions for grass farmers, ie grassfarmer

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    #13
    I like grassfarmers comments but there are a few oft-repeated misconceptions in this thread.

    First of all I'm getting tired about hearing how deer, elk, moose, wild buffalo and just about every other ruminant calves in the spring, looks after its young quite well and so on and so on. The point being that we should work more closely with mother nature and everything would be rosy. The fact is that deer, etc. generally have low conception rates and overall weaning rates of about 60% per animal exposed. Can any of you guys live on that for your cows?

    The idea that feeding cows during calving season somehow has a negative impact upon calving is bizarre. Cows can easily be fed in a large field--ours is 85 acres--and the feed can be spread far and wide on that field. I believe in late calving too but let's not reach for reasons that are not sensible to justify it.

    Finally, the notion that buying land to make feed is flawed is not borne out by history. I have had silage custom made on my land for close to 20 years and through many of those years it was the cheapest feed around. I have never not had feed, even during our worst droughts.

    But more than that I have come to see that the value of the land is really in how it grows in value and increases our net worth. In reality it is not the cows that are going to grow your estate--it's the land and many of us, especially in Alberta, have prospered on the back of our land values rising. Does this relate to farming? Maybe not and maybe it means we have to be investors as well as ranchers but I'll tell you that I'm really glad that I bought land to make feed many years ago--land that has made much more money during the years that I've had the use of it than I ever will make from my cows. So when you're thinking about making feed on your own land, think about the investment merits of buying that land too.


    kpb

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      #14
      Kpb, that's a fair comment on buying land whether for hay or for pasture, but everybody's situation is different. I have actually pulled a fair bit of capital out of my property value with moving here and invested it where it earns a better rate of interest than real estate price increases, or ranching, would have generated. I have settled on an amount that I want invested in farm land ownership and am looking to expand through using other peoples acres from now on. That's my diversified investment stategy and I think the Prairies offer a great chance to make it work.

      PS Further to your thread about fly repellent salt blocks - who makes them or where do you get them?

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        #15
        fair enough.

        I'll look up the name and manufacturer of the blocks and get back to you tomorrow.

        kpb

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          #16
          I agree with kpb that land ownership has been a good investment historically.
          My challenge as a young producer is that with current local purchase prices (and soon to be lease prices) I can't cash flow the interest payments. I don't see this as sustainable in the long run.

          The leasing, stubble grazing, crop sharing and other unusual options that are out there are pretty astonishing at the moment and have really impacted our profitability (positively).

          We use a couple of different "systems" in combination on our place, including an intensive rotational system with electric fence and portable reels, swath grazing, bale grazing, and some extensive rest rotation/deferred grazing. As well we have been working with some different approaches to water pumping, etc. that are extremely low cost and have noticable positive impacts on cattle distribution and forage utilization.

          What we have noticed with improved grass management (often taking no extra time) is that we have more grass of higher quality, can restore stands of grass pretty fast, and for the most part have moisture to spare, when everyone seems to be dried out. Not only do we cash flow better on the same land base (more production), we are also more profitable and have significantly reduced our risk associated with weather.

          As far as mothering and feeding cows...
          My thoughts are any cow that doesn't mother her calf is fine, as long as she belongs to someone else.

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            #17
            we use Saltec sulphur blocks which have your basic blue block ingredients along with sulphur.

            there is a bit of a controversy regarding the use of sulphur blocks as an insect deterent. I don't think there is any science that says sulphur in blocks stops flys and there are a few web pages around on both sides of the argument. All I know is that it works for me. The cows actually smell different after licking these blocks as the sulphur comes out in their hair and presumably deters the flys from landing on their backs, etc. Their hair coats definitely are better. Sulphur is used in the orchard industry as an insecticide so there is some science to it I guess.

            Anyways it works for us and I would suggest anyone who is interested should pick up a couple of blocks and try it. We used to get ours from the Co-op but now get it privately. However, I was at Masterfeeds in Didsbuy this morning and asked them about it and the lady there had just sold a flat to a rancher (which sold her out) and was about to order more so it should be easy to get. It's kind of an orangey yellow in colour.

            kpb

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              #18
              Thanks for that kpb i'll look into these blocks as the flies are pretty thick up here just now. I did a google search the other day for fly repellent blocks and came to the sweetlix website - I hoped it wasn't those you were referring to! They are made and sold in the US and appear to be a complete mineral/salt block with an organophoshate component which kills all fly larvae before they hatch out of the manure. Feeding organophosphate to cows? I thing BS-man Bullard will have some more BSE cover ups to do in future if American ranchers are using this product!

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