Another one bites the dust!

[cowman]

In yesterdays paper, they had an article how "Southland Beef" has decided to not build their proposed 400/hd/day plant at Lacombe Alberta.
It was rather disappointing but not really unexpected? The good news was Premier Meats is nearing completion in Lacombe. It is a 100/hd/day federal inspected plant that will kill cattle, bison/elk.
I actually wondered about Southland as the guy proposing it was the CEO of XL...before Neilsson Bros took it over? I think XL was on the hook to the Alberta Government for about $40 million before Neilssons got a sweetheart deal!
XL was the worst run packing house in Alberta when Cargill came in, but since the Alberta government had so much money in it...it survived while more efficient packers like Burns and Canada Packers sold out and shut down!
Lakeside was a tough competitor but also was on the government tit...until IBP bought them out.

[Willowcreek]

Tyson/Cargill won't have to worry about marketing Canadian beef much longer..They're finding cheaper sources to import into the North American Union...They could care less if Canada goes down the drain- but Canucks can't see it- won't even admit it when the FMD Argentine beef is coming thru the States into what used to be Canada....

We need mandatory truth in origin labeling laws in the beef industry in both countries...

---------------------------------------

SANTA ROSA, La Pampa Province, Argentina, Jan. 12, 2007 (PRIME NEWSWIRE) (PRIMEZONE) -- Tyson Foods, Inc. (NYSE:TSN) has entered into a joint venture in Argentina, which will create the first vertically integrated beef operation in the South American country. The venture is expected to produce both products for the domestic Argentine consumer and give Tyson access to European and "other high value beef markets".

http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=175884#175884

[farmers_son]

Lets get it straight here. Mandatory country of origin labeling as you envision it is more designed to keep Canadian beef out of U.S. retail coolers and out of U.S. packing plants than it is concerned with Argentina beef.

Like it or not, NAFTA does exist and the U.S. benefits from that trade. In fact there is more trade that takes place over the Ambassador Bridge every day between Canada and the United States than the total trade between Japan and the U.S. That is just one border point.

When the U.S. reneges on those trade arrangements like is being contemplated with MCOOL then other countries notice.

I would point out that the story you quoted mentions the beef from the Tyson plant was destined for Europe not the U.S. However I can assure you that there are regions in the U.S. that produces beef that is no better and maybe worse than what comes from Argentina. The problem you are going to face is the consumer used to blame that crap beef on imports. With MCOOL there will be no denying that it is USA all the way.

You R-Calfers are determined to wreck your own market in order to stop imports. The problem for us when you do that is it that wrecks our market too.

Bottomline, U.S. producers need friends and allies when it comes to trade in beef and us Canucks were the best friends you had. We had a similar production system and a similar cost structure. The Canadian beef you successfully keep out of the United States will be replaced by beef from countries that have a lower cost production system than you do.

[Willowcreek]

farmersson- I think it is you who are being blind...Last week the the USDA proposed dropping the FMD import rules against Argentine beef- this week Tyson/Cactus feeders announce a big vertical integration in Argentina...
If you look at the whole article it said the beef they slaughter was for domestic, European, and "other high value markets"....
This beef will be coming into the US stamped with a USDA stamp- and thru NAFTA on into Canada....

If you don't think this will effect US prices and in turn Canadian- you have your head somewhere it isn't getting air....The S.A. costs are extremely low in comparison to N.A..And now with them entering the fed cattle market they have the advantage not only of cheaper costs- but many areas can produce multiple grain crops a year....

M-COOL will be the only way the US or Canada can distinquish their products against the flood of South American imports the Tyson/Cargills are already building the infrastructure for.....Campbells Soups already source all their beef from South America...
They could care less if the US/Canadian producer survives or not...

[farmers_son]

And you could care less if the Canadian producer survives or not.

If the Americans like you want to build support in Canada for MCOOL, saying we need to be able to identify Argentinian beef, or Australian beef or beef from Paraquay then why not exempt Canadian beef from those non-NAFTA offshore imports and allow our beef to be in your coolers.

Really, what you want to exclude is all non American beef. Tyson and Cargill operate globablly, when people like you want to pit producer against producer it only serves their ends. The common problem is the packers, not a producer in another country.

[cowman]

I think you read Willowcreek pretty well on this one farmers son!
Canada is the enemy...Argentina is just an excuse to bash Canada some more!
All you have to do is read some of his posts over on Ranchers to know he has a great hate for everything and anything concerning Canada?
I'm not sure what his problem is? I know lots of people from the States who are not like that at all! Maybe some Alberta kid beat him up or something when he was young and he never got over it?
Willowcreek: We are not the enemy...get it through your head! We are one market, one people! Learn to work with us instead of trying to
destroying us!

[Willowcreek]

Since our enviromental, health, and safety laws/standards all differ from country to country- their is a difference- either real or perceived- in food products...I know after reading about some of the Mexican slaughter house investigations that showed overt corruption amongst government officials/inspectors and unhealthy conditions along with the knowledge that the live animals could have drank out of some of the most chemically polluted waterways in the world- makes you wonder when you see a package of burger how much Mex beef is in it...And if Rule 2 goes thru there will be that question also of how much higher BSE risk old Canuck beef is mixed in...

Each countries food product should be able to stand on its own value and reputation- not have to be falsely promoted as something it isn't...Mexican beef was not raised in the US and should not be allowed to be promoted and sold as such- neither was Canadian- nor South American...

Something else I think you failed to read closely was that this USDA/APHIS proposal reduces the safeguards against bringing FMD infected product from Argentina into the US- which naturally will go thru your beloved NAFTA into Canada- all unmarked or labeled as a US product with the USDA stamp...

But if the only way Canada can sell their product is by lying to the consumer I can see why your opposed to M-COOL and any Truth in Labeling Meat Laws...

[grassfarmer]

"I know after reading about some of the Mexican slaughter house investigations that showed overt corruption amongst government officials/inspectors..." So Mexico is quite like the US then with your concealed BSE cases?

[cowman]

Willowcreek: It is not "our beloved NAFTA"? Your government signed it? You have met the enemy...and it is you!
Do you really think you don't benifit from NAFTA? Maybe you need to have a reality check? When you fill the old pickup up...thank Ronald Reagan you have NAFTA!
I find it funny that suddenly you have issues with Mexico? All your posts on here are about what scoundrels and lay abouts we are up here...living off you wealthy Montana boys!
I often wonder if you have ever even been to Alberta? You seem to have this idea we are like Sicily, home of the Mafia or something?
You should break down and take a trip up here this summer? You might be surprized that we don't have horns and a tail? You just might find that we are just ordinary people chasing the Alberta dream...just like you chasing the American dream? But whatever...don't ever let reality ever get in the way of your preconcieved notions.

[Willowcreek]

cowman- I have been to Alberta 3 times- once long ago to Edmonton, then when I was Supervising the Drug Task Force I had the opportunity to spend several days in Lethbridge on 2 occasions- working with the locals and the Mounties on the drug problem...I really thought Lethbridge was a neat little city- especially the fact the local police had their own private cop bar in the basement of the Police Station...LOL
Been all over southern Saskatchewan- and know many folks from there...Don't think there is really a Canuck I've met, I disliked (excepting the one that tried to shoot me)...

I do disagree with many things your government has done- same as I do some of the things mine have done...I totally disagree with what NAFTA has become- where the corporate world has seen large profits- often taking advantage of tax or law loopholes to import from everywhere in the world-- while the average Montanan and our resources/industries have suffered...And not only are we tied to this "free trade" agreement- but so are our children and grandchildren...No government should be able to sell my grandchildrens rights before they were even born...And now they are on fasttrack to sell out the entire sovereignty under this North American Union...

Contrary to what you think I don't hate Canadians- enjoy visiting with all the card players we have come down for the weekly card games- many who are ranchers...And the majority appear to me to be quite honest...And thats what surprises me when I get on these websites and find that some on here support the Packer/Retailers using fraud and deception to market their product...

That is contrary to most I have talked with, who while cussing the US Packers buyout of the Canadian industry, don't think it is right for them to profit from fraudulent activity-- nor do they as producers want to be tied into such an illegal action...They'd prefer to be marketing a good Canadian identified product...Most can see how the Packers use this generic meat to jack over the producers/consumers of both countries...

Cams and rkaisers writings remind me much of what the Canadian ranchers I have visited with are saying...Many of the oldtimer ranchers sound like they wish they could have the old days back- before the Anaplas/Bluetongue argument and the multinational takeover...Or the government telling them who they can or cannot sell their grain to--But that can't be...

But we can stop these multinational corporates from using the cattle producer of both countries as pawns in their profit machine...

Tyson must not be too broke if they can do all this Argentine expansion-EH..

[cowman]

Willowcreek: Despite the fact that many label me a Cargill/Tyson lover on here I am not a happy camper with how things have turned out up here!
Make no mistake, the Alberta government of the day did everything in its power to bring in the big boys and squeeze out the existing packers. I think it was an ideology thing, although there were always rumors that Premier Lougheed benifitted in a big way from the IBP takeover of Lakeside packers!
Unfortunately this is what we have to live with today, and rather than beat our heads against the wall and chase pipe dreams we need to deal with reality?
I don't really blame the American rancher for trying to protect his market. I do object to some of the tactics used though?
Before 1994 and the death of the CROW rate Canada was a net importer of beef. American insistence that we kill the CROW was what drove the Canadian farmer into livestock production. It was the only solution to survive as we are hamstrung from processing grain by our state controlled monopoly(CWB)that discouraged any type of value adding...you would think we live in the old Soviet Union!
For the first time in over thirty years we finally have a federal government in place that is trying to make some meaningful changes. To stand up for the western farmer and western businessman!
It might all be a waste of time though as the urban heartland is more interested in keeping the status quo where all wealth heads east!
Keep your eyes and ears open, if the Harper government fails we might be "Americans" sooner than later!

[Willowcreek]

cowman-quote "Keep your eyes and ears open, if the Harper government fails we might be "Americans" sooner than later!"

Well- I already know the words to God Save the Queen- never did learn this new O'Canada...Maybe they'll combine them all together for the new North American Union...Tho the way things are going they'll make us sing them in Spanish...LOL

[farmers_son]

There is a difference between economic cooperation and political union. You are no less an American if you can realize the benefits of cooperating with Canadian producers in areas of mutual benefit. We do have a common problem of packer control over our industries and unfair pricing of our live cattle. American producers can never benefit over the long term by pursing domestic and international policies that drive down the price of live cattle in Canada. And vice versa. It is in our best interest to see live cattle prices strong in the United States. When American producer is pitted against Canadian producer the packers are the only winner. Americans can still be Americans and cooperate with others for everyone's mutual benefit.

[Willowcreek]

farmers son--"There is a difference between economic cooperation and political union. You are no less an American if you can realize the benefits of cooperating with Canadian producers in areas of mutual benefit."

Well farmers son it appears to me like they are driving thru a political union- possibly even tighter than the EU...One currency, one set of laws, one police force, one ID card and D/L, one border/defense security plan-- to me that is political union and is giving up too much power for just the mutual benefits of the corporate world...

[silverback]

Did we not just limit the amount of imported beef into Canada??

Are we not allowing all cattle into Canada from the US?? Limitations?