American cow plants?

[cowman]

When the USA banned Canadian cattle the American plants that specialized in cull cows were really hurt?
When Rule 2 comes into effect, there will be some cows crossing over...but really how many? How many cull cows will be able to fit the March 1999 rule?
Now consider this: Cow meat, of any age, will be able to enter the American market! Will this basically be the death blow for the American plants that specialize in cull cows?
I don't know what the USA cow plants have to pay for a cow? Probably considerably more than the pittance we recieve up here? Will they be able to source enough cheap Canadian cows to compete with the flood of cheap Canadian cow meat that will be going across after rule 2 is implemented?
No wonder guys like Willowcreek are concerned? Their packing houses are about to disappear...and they don't have a lot of them now!
But don't worry we'll let you send them north to be slaughtered...or will we? Should we?

[wade]

Are you suggesting we start R-COW?

[rkaiser]

Have you heard for sure that the 1999 date is on all cows entering the States cowman, or is it only for cows not destined for direct slaughter? Last I heard I was unclear.

[Willowcreek]

WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)-A recently unveiled U.S. plan to let Canada ship older cattle - usually too decrepit to produce milk anymore - to the U.S. for slaughter would result in an average of about 610,000 of them crossing the border yearly, according to an estimate made by the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

A “Key Economic Impacts“ summary that USDA recently distributed to state agricultural leaders is a five-year prediction. It says the imports of Canadian cattle over 30 months old “would account for about 10% of U.S. cull cattle slaughter.“

There goes whats left of the US cull cow market......

[cowman]

Randy: I don't know. That is a good question. I would think most cows older than that would be purebred seedstock but not sure?
Willowcreek: I really doubt we'll be sending you 610,000 cows a year? The fact is we just couldn't come up with that many culls born after 1999?
Believe it or not we've kind of got our act together up here...in a way? We are pretty well using up all our culls right now...despite really poor prices caused by a captive market? I think a small number will cross the border and probably quite a bit of OTM meat until prices stabilize on both sides of the border? The best thing you could do is work toward opening the border as everyday you keep it closed you are creating a situation that will come back to bite you harder?

[WilIow-Kreek]

Idaho State Journal
Canadian beef ban?

FORT HALL — D.J. and Ellen Ball of Fort Hall said lifting a ban on Canadian cattle could potentially jeopardize U.S. herds, hamstring U.S. producers in the global marketplace and pose health risks to consumers.

The Balls support label of origin packaging and a ban on Canadian cattle.

With over 81,000 members, consisting mostly of cow-calf producers, the non-profit group, located in 47 states, represents U.S. cattle producers on domestic and international trade and marketing issues.

R-CALF is currently appealing the 2003 decision to lift bans on Canadian beef and opposes expanding imports to cattle over 30 months old.

The appeal alleges that stricter standards have been placed on U.S. producers in the global market since the ban was lifted.

“Korea has said that as long as American cattle co-mingle with Canadian cattle they won’t open their border to U.S. beef,” D.J. Ball said.

According to R-CALFS reports, the full effect of Canadian bovine spongiform encephalopathy is still unfolding.

Nine cases of BSE, or mad cow disease were detected after feed bans went into place in 1997.

D.J. Ball said many Canadian cattle are sold to slaughter and mixed with U.S. beef.

“It could contaminate all that meat,” he said. “The label says USDA, but it could be mixed with other beef.”

Ellen Ball said she believes the USDA should be more attentive to providing safe food for Americans and the government should not enact policies that put U.S. producers at a disadvantage.

[cowman]

Willow Kreek: I think that is a pretty old article? I think I saw it a couple of years ago...maybe you clipped it out of your R-CALF scrapbook?
I don't know why R-CALF is getting so bent out of shape over Rule 2? I truly doubt it is going to have much of an impact in the long term?
You want to keep our old cows out...fine! But the fact is you can't keep OTM beef out much longer...NAFTA(and sound science) won't allow it? You are only going to shoot yourself in the foot here! Do you have any kind of an idea how cheaply cull cows are selling for up here? With an open border to OTM beef, our cow packers are going to eat you for breakfast! Say goodbye to whatever kind of cow plants you have down there!
R-CALF needs to consider a different approach...because what you are doing is not helping you or the Canadian rancher! What you are doing is insuring Cargill and Tyson are going to make one hell of a lot of cash in the cull market! And in case you didn't know both Cargill Canada and Tyson Canada are killing every cow they can lay their hands on! You are creating a situation where they can exploit all of us...both Canadian and American! Shame on R-CALF!

[Willowcreek]

r-kaiser- I saw the same article..Actually it is out ot the Idaho State Journal dated January 8, 2007 ....

I don't think you folks are seeing that the majority of US cattlemen are changing...The old world of NCBA is being left behind and R-CALF's thinking is now much more the norm- even if they don't belong to R-CALF...

Heres from USDA's newly published poll of cattlement nationwide on the beef checkoff:

Ninety-two (92) percent of those surveyed would strongly agree or somewhat agree that “if it were possible, all or at least some portion of the Beef Checkoff dollars should be used to promote only U.S. born and raised beef.” Currently, the program promotes beef, in general, and importers also pay into the program at $1-per-head on live animal imports and a $1-per-head equivalent on beef products. Even if promoting only U.S. born and raised beef meant canceling the checkoff assessment on imported beef and beef products, 75.4 percent of the survey respondents still strongly or somewhat agree that a portion of the checkoff dollars should be used to promote only U.S. beef. Currently, about $8 million or 10 percent of the total assessments collected comes from imports.

Folks are getting tired of Canada shirttailing on the backs of an industry built by US cattlemen.....

[Willowcreek]

OOPS- sorry that last one should have been to cowman- not the Kaiser...

[InAHurry]

"A recently unveiled U.S. plan to let Canada ship older cattle - usually too decrepit to produce milk anymore"

We've got exceptionally good cattle but I don't think the 66,000 head of bulls and stags the author included included in his figure are capable of producing milk.

"decrepit" leaves visions of what in your head folks?
I imagine willowcreek has added it to his 'useful' list of CDN adjectives.

Is there a failure to recognize that the author has also labelled OTM, in the US, as the same...... 6,100,000 US cull cattle - "usually too decrepit to produce milk anymore"? willowcreek, are we to believe the picture Mr. Tomson paints?

[Willowcreek]

InAHurry-- I thought you read all about it on ranchers....It comes from USDA's multi million $ contracted “Key Economic Impacts“ summary that USDA recently distributed...

It also says the increased supply will be extremely costly to US producers- accounting for $1.24 billion in consumer gains and
$657 million in producer losses....

Guess what that means is going to happen to cow and bull prices?

But on the positive side they said that the increased ability to kill young cattle in Canada should increase the US fed cattle price by 0.2% over 5 years.....LOL--Thanks

[cowman]

Willowcreek: I doubt that will happen? I wonder how often governments have ever been right?
You should chill down and take it easy? The fact is when the border is opened there won't be a big "rush" to fill the market? Now I will grant you there will be a "re-adjusting" of some of the inequalities that the BSE game created!
Prediction: You won't be bankrupt! You won't see "devastating losses"!
You will face reality...which is a good thing?
There are a lot of problems in the beef industry? A lot in Canada...a lot in the USA? Your group, R-CALF, did not help in a solution...instead they were part of the PROBLEM!
Listen! Me and mine have been raising cattle here in Alberta for over one hundred years! We want to continue! We are sick and tired of being stabbed in the back by the people we considered our allies! And that isn't the packers, the retailers, the American or Canadian consumer...but the miss-informed idiots who make up R-CALF!!!
Wake up and smell the coffe...you are a cow/calf operator not a damned American or Canadian!
Sorry if this offends...I really don't have a lot of allegiance to any "country".

[Willowcreek]

cowman- Maybe some of your folks up north read this study too-- the reason so many are dumping bred cows now to get out of the business as one of the other threads suggest...

Because they know like I do that the Packers will use the increased supply to dump the US market into the toilet-- which in turn will automatically do the same to your cull market- more than it is now...And the only ones profitting will be the Packers.....

By the time it starts to regain- they should have their Argentine and S.A. imports lined up to guarantee that won't happen....

[cowman]

Willowcreek: I'm not sure how it is in Montana, but up here the cow/calf producers are really old? After 4 years of completely devastating returns, I think they are giving up?
You aren't hurting the "tough guys" but the old ones who have just said to hell with this?
Now I'm not some sort of guru who knows everthing so don't take that to the bank or something?
Now I have a "tough boy( I hope I raised him right)" who intends to go right on raising cows. Now he might be tough because "daddy" has a few bucks and doesn't take kindly to getting run out of the game by a bunch of four flushers, but whatever...he's the one you need to worry about!
Prediction: He will be raising cows, and probably his son after him, long after this "joke" called BSE is long gone!...I think I raised him right...and I think I raised him tough!

[kato]

Exactly how are we going to be hurt by these upcoming poor cow prices? We sold 10 cows today, and got top dollar for them, but came up about five thousand dollars short on what we got for culls in 2002.

If they got any worse they'd be free. Threats of lower cow prices are beyond worrying anyone up here.

It's not fear of future markets that is making people sell their cows, it's the fact that after almost four years, the BSE crisis is not over for us. As long as we're selling top quality young fat cull cattle for less than 30 cents a pound, it ain't over yet. The sale of cull cows makes up a good chunk of the cash flow for most guys, especially if they are constantly improving the herd with replacements.

The vast majority of the so called old and decrepit cull cattle are actually going to be just barely over 30 months. They will be the ones that didn't make the cut under the 24 month rule.