Democracy/free press

[grassfarmer]

Yes, it seems you were getting close per. Farmers_son replies with some more blatant lies.
1. The NFU gets a significant part of its funding from check off in PEI and New Brunswick. What a ridiculous statement - the numbers of producers in those provinces is tiny, it is not a check-off on livestock sold. As I understand it for producers with under $100,000 gross revenue they can pay $150 a year to NFU or the other regional political body or they can apply for a refund of the $150.
Surprise,surprise NFU membership across the country is $150 per year and we have thousands of members across the country.
2. To imply the extent of the NFUs interest in the livestock sector is collecting levy is not worthy of reply. You are only making a fool of yourself especially having been one of the spearheads of the ABP campaign to hang onto the mandatory ABP levy.

It has proven an interesting allegiance between you and Roy, The ABP man who likes to conceal his identity and the Nilsson man who pretends he is simply a rancher.
In your last post you suggested that I didn't have much to do with my time pursuing this issue of press freedom. I would argue that nothing is of more importance than democracy. Droughts will come and go as will cattle prices but democracy can never be taken for granted. I am not frightened to put my name out there in this fight to ensure democracy prevails - the fact that those of you on the other side choose to lurk in the shadows tells it's own story. Readers might be interested to know that at a recent cattle sale I sold some cull cows for 20 cents/lb less than identical cattle I hauled in for a friend. I wonder which buyer withheld their bid? Democracy comes at a price, one that I am prepared to pay but I sure would appreciate it if a few more of you would at least raise your heads far enough above the trenches to venture an opinion on this issue.

[farmers_son]

About the comment re who you hang with is how you will be painted. I try to "hang" with good people who are interesting and involved. I try to also listen to people who have differing viewpoints because I think that broadens my perspective. Because I listen to them or consider their viewpoint does not mean I "hang" with them. Sometimes the most interesting people are the ones I may not agree with.

I do not know Roy Rutledge personally. I did know he built up Saskatchewan's largest auction and then sold it to Nilssons. Other than his column in Alberta Beef I have no opinion of him one way or the other. I pasted his one column because I thought it was interesting and no I do not agree with every observation he made in that column.

It is my opinion that Alberta Beef Magazine should be free to publish or not publish whatever they wish. If Grassfarmer and the NFU do not like the editorial content of the magazine they are free to cancel their subscription.

Would it make any difference if Rutledge signed off his column in some other fashion or should his words stand on their own? Many of us wear quite a few hats anymore. . Rutledge should not have to post his resume in order to express his opinion.

I am sure Rutledge does ranch in Saskatchewan. To be perfectly correct there is no "Dog River, Saskatchewan" which only exists on Corner Gas. Why doesn't Grassfarmer and NFU jump on that and say ahah obviously the man is a liar. The NFU needs to lighten up a little bit. Alberta Beef Magazine should be free to include his column or exclude any contributed rebuttal as they see fit. For goodness sake, it is their paper.

The NFU thinks they can tell Alberta Beef Magazine how they think that paper should be run. The next thing they will be trying to tell me how my farm should be run. Come to think of it they are already doing that. They should make like a fly and buzz off.

In this time of drought if the NFU were in touch with what really counts they would be focusing their attention of more important matters. The real problem they have with Rutledge is he dared to point out their little report on the beef industry was a load of crap.

[kato]

I agree to a certain extent that the magazine has the right to decide whether or not it will publish both sides. However, I also feel that they have a duty as a publication which is supposed to be reporting to cattle producers, to choose to report both sides.

This is the foundation stone of responsible reporting. When balance is lost, then credibility goes with it. Readers have to wonder what else are they leaving out? Are they running an informational publication? Or are they running a propoganda publication designed to promote the views of only certain (advertisers maybe?????) people? Can any article printed in the future be depended upon to be a true picture of the real story? You have to wonder.

It may be their right to not print opposing views, but that doesn't make it right in the true sense of the word.

[grassfarmer]

"The real problem they have with Rutledge is he dared to point out their little report on the beef industry was a load of crap."
If you believe that you are a bigger fool than I thought farmers_son.

[farmers_son]

My latest issue of Alberta Beef just came. Could not resist pasting it here. It needs no further comment other than to say the stink the NFU is raising is doing a lot to raise interest in Roy's column.


The Truth Hurts
Roy Rutledge

It seems the NFU is upset with my views. One of their henchmen finally called me but was extremely reluctant to debate any point with me. He said I misquoted two words of their writings. Maybe I read between the lines. That was one of his concerns but his main object of calling was to find out my involvement in cattle marketing. Maybe they have me in mind to man their single desk selling solution! Why does the fact that I still do livestock auctioneering over shadow my ranching interests? Frank Gattey didn't seem to have that problem. Maybe I should go back to equipment auctioneering. At least there everyone understands the concept of selling to the highest bidder.

I think I have a little more depth in the cattle business than the NFU/R-CALF guy who called me. When I asked him to enlighten me and change my mind, he snippily declined. I think he missed a great opportunity to impress me. Things progressed to the point that I dropped the N from NFU. Like or not, I have the same constitutional right to speak my mind as any other citizen, exercising that right is not the sole property of the fanatical left.

Here is something to think about to further complicate things. The US slaughter plants are not subject to the stringent feed ban and SRM removal and disposal regulations that the plants in Canada are. This alone puts the Canadian plants at about a thirty to forty dollars per head disadvantage when competing with the US plants. The US plants also have some labor cost advantages too.

The CFIA seems to have gotten ahead of itself and the US, with all these SRM regulations. The ironic part is that the US ships millions of tons of beef into Canada that has not had to adhere to these regulations. Isn't that a double standard? Their beef is safe enough for us to eat but our own beef needs special SRM regs. to be safe enough for us to eat or for us to export. They ship beef to the same overseas customers as we do, yet they do not need the same stringent regs. which the CFIA has imposed on us. Has the stringent CFIA rules opened any doors to new markets for us, over US beef? So, why do we need those regulations? Can the NFU get this CFIA policy changed? That would be a good way to show us how effective they are. Teaming up with R CALF doesn't impress me much.

Am I making myself clear enough why packing plants in Canada are at an extreme disadvantage when bidding on Canadian cattle? Do you think that might be the reason that Tyson's wanted to close or sell their only Canadian plant? Why run a plant in Canada when it is more cost efficient to operate in the US? If new plants start up in Canada how long can they compete when harnessed with rules and expenses that the US plants aren't? Do you think Cargill might be going through the same thought process? Unless the playing field levels out soon, I don't think it is unreasonable to speculate that they could be next to concentrate more on their US operations. Those who feel there is not enough competition in Canada may have to realize that all Canadian plants are at a competitive disadvantage in the real world. Build more. They won't last. The few plants we have may not last either. There is one for sale in Melfort. The Crown Investment Corporation is the major or possibly, the only shareholder.


I don't think that there is any great conspiracy at work here. It is just business. Am I a radical or a fortune teller for predicting that the slaughter capacity in Canada will continue to dwindle and/or consolidate until there is less capacity than pre-BSE levels? Then what happens when the US shuts us out again? I am not trying to scare anyone. I am just pointing out that all the rhetoric from the left wing extremists has little or no bearing on what is happening in the real world, in my humble opinion.

There are more Tim Horton stores going up every year. There are fewer meat packers every year. Which business do you suppose is the most lucrative? How many of us really need more doughnuts?

I would also point out that in my opinion (which no one but me gives a damn about) I have more money and time invested in land and cattle than the average NFU member, certainly more than their president and very possibly more than any one of their members or employees. That doesn't make me special but it does indicate to me that I have more at stake in the cattle business than any of those R-CALF wannabes.

None of the cattle organizations will challenge the NFU/R-CALF because they know that when you argue with a skunk you end up with a lot of stink on yourself. Stink doesn't bother me. I have been getting dumped on, catching it or walking in it most of my life.

The opinions expressed in this column are not usually the opinions of this magazine, its editor or any of my business associates. In fact, most of those people wince every time a new edition comes out. They are the opinions of one cattle rancher. Of course not everyone agrees with me. They are not supposed to. What a dull world that would be! Really, there is little point in writing if I can’t provoke some dialogue.

By Roy Rutledge

Roy Rutledge is a self opinionated, broken down old cowboy who ranchers about forty miles from Dog River, Sk.

[grassfarmer]

To correct a few of the most obvious lies in this edition.
The "henchman" referred to was disputing more than two words and by all accounts it was Rutledge who was reluctant to debate - indeed I believe he tried to deny he was a Nilsson auction market operator but was let down by his secretary who had already confirmed he was. Notice he talks about the enquiry regarding his "auctioneering career" and omits to mention that the point of interest was whether he was a Nilsson employee.
Rutledge then goes on to blame SRM regulations as being the root of all problems - does that sound like a ranchers opinion or that of an employee of the countries biggest packing plant? Read the NFU analysis - SRM costs are a false cause of the current crisis.

"Am I a radical or a fortune teller for predicting that the slaughter capacity in Canada will continue to dwindle and/or consolidate until there is less capacity than pre-BSE levels?" No not a fortune teller - merely working for Nilssons to make sure that corporate concentration continues because they know that every time there are less buyers and less competition they can lower the price of fat cattle paid to producers.

"Teaming up with R CALF doesn't impress me much." "None of the cattle organizations will challenge the NFU/R-CALF" The blatant lies continue that there is any connection between R-CALF and the NFU - there isn't, never was and never will be - this is an out and out lie.

It's interesting that farmers_son is so happy to tie his ABP flag firmly to the Nilsson ship - it merely confirms what many of us have suspected over the years ABP are to all intents in bed with the packers working against producer interests. So what price do you get when you sell cows f_s? do you get the "packer backer bonus" or do you get discounted like I do because I dare to speak out against them?

[kato]

All I have to say about this is that we went to one of the informational meetings put on by the NFU.

1. No one asked us to join.
2. No one asked for money.
3. No one called anyone a skunk or placed labels on anyone.
4. All of the information was given in a positive manner, without resorting to name calling or inuendo.
5. The information was laid out for the audience, and the floor opened to discussion, with no one being judged or put down if they did not agree with the report. All opinions were listened to in a civilized and polite manner.
6. There was no sign of any left wing wackos anywhere to be seen. Maybe they were hiding outside in the bushes?

That's all I have to say about that. For today, anyway. ;-)

[kato]

And today I have a bit more to say. ;-)

I also do take offence to that one comment that Mr. R. has more to lose than any member of the NFU, or any other smaller producer. I have noticed over the years that those who have the biggest operations and the most invested also have the most safeguards against losing things like their homes and personal property if things go bad. What is more of a loss? Some money? Or your home and all your possessions?

And why, because someone is not as wealthy as another, does their opinion carry less weight? It's the smaller, and poorer producers with the least to lose in Mr. R.'s opinion who are producing those feeders that the players higher up in the chain depend on. They are the ones the whole system depends on to keep the supply of calves there. And they are becoming disillusioned with being held in such low regard. It's a basic law of business that if your suppliers go out of business, so do you.

We don't belong to the NFU, and we do pay our checkoff money to the mainstream groups, but that doesn't mean we aren't willing to listen to any new idea that comes along, no matter where it comes from.

This whole trend lately toward closed minds, labels, and judgmental attitudes is wearing pretty thin with me. It seems that when one person or group has an idea that another doesn't like, rather than come up with a counter proposal, they just start name calling, and labelling the other as being not worth listening to.

Why? In everyday life, if your neighbour comes up with an idea that you don't like, that doesn't mean you start calling him a nut case and refuse to ever speak to him again. You don't tell all the other neighbours to do the same do you? No. You look past that one idea and move on. His next idea just might be a terrific one. And your neighbour doesn't go around telling everyone that you are never going to accept a new idea for the rest of your life and that you cannot be reasoned with.

This is what is going on right now, and quite frankly I think we need to get past it. There are a lot of problems in our industry right now, and there is no black and white anywhere in the mix. We need to approach our difficulties from whatever angle works, no matter who comes up with the idea of how to do it.

If everyone in the world closed their minds to any new suggestions we'd still be living in caves.

That's it for today. Gotta go water the garden...

[grassfarmer]

Thank you for your input Kato, it's good to hear others views especially from someone outside Alberta.

The point you make about Roy claiming to have more to lose than smaller producers is valid but remember also that Roy is not who he claims to be. If producers returns continue to be severely adversely affected by corporate concentration and captive supply practises as they are at the moment I don't think Roy will be out in the street. Remember he is a Nilsson Bros. auction mart manager so will be sitting pretty while real beef producers large and small go to the wall. If half the cows in Canada were to disappear overnight the two packers would still be sitting pretty - with an
oligopsony limited to two players you really can't lose.

I take on board your comments about producers/organizations being more likely to throw insults at those with opposing views than work with them.

[farmers_son]

Grassfarmer: I note your remark "I take on board your comments about producers/organizations being more likely to throw insults at those with opposing views than work with them."

I also noted your earlier comment "If you believe that you are a bigger fool than I thought farmers_son." Enough said about that.

I agree with Katos comments. I usually do. I believe my comments were along the same lines.

I will be taking a break from Agriville for a while. I enjoyed the opportunity to discuss cattle issues with interesting people but it is time to move on.

As an industry we are facing the most challenging times I have ever been a part of. We will pull through and I continue to see a bright future for cattle. However in the next short while it seems inevitable that our industry is going to fragment and tear apart as it seeks the lowest common denominator instead of the high road.

Exactly what we do not need as the greatest challenge facing primary producers continues to be how to come together in order to improve their competitiveness.

Take care one and all.