GM triffid Flax and Pedigreed Seed

[TOM4CWB]

Bucket:

"If you could please explain how triffid was allowed to enter the commercial system without the pedigree seed system"

As I have said time after time... the pedigreed system has no ability to deal with background traces levels of varietal impurities under .1%.

How can anyone blame pedigreed seed growers...

For growing pedigreed seed they had no knowledge there was any problem with... and no moral or ethical indication or technical reason to know they were doing anything wrong?

The exact same issues are 'in play' for 'farmsaved seed'.

If I believe:

1a) Do unto others as you would have done unto you,
b) Do not do unto others as you would not have others do unto you;
2a) Do not infringe upon the Rights, Freedoms or Property of others, and
b) Keep all contracts willingly, knowingly and intentionally.
3a) That for every wrong there is a remedy,
b) The end does not justify the means,
c) Fundamental principals cannot be set aside to meet the demands of convenience or to prevent apparent hardship in a particular case,
d) Ignorance of the law is no excuse for breaking the law,
e) Two wrongs do not make a right, and
f) One can enlarge the rights of the people; however they cannot be taken away without their informed consent.


I will do what I am doing on Agriville.

I do believe there will be a day of judgement... and liars will pay. How many others... believe the same in business today?

[bucket]

Tom

Because I am a dumb farmer, could you explain the path of seed?

The breeder seed goes where - directly to commercial farmers or to seed growers?

Where does foundation or certified seed come from?

I won't dispute that the breeders didn't have a hand in this but if the audit trail is followed somehow the certified seed growers are a part of it as well.

The one thing I do know and it is very important:

Triffid flax was not developed by comercial flax growers - the seed came from somewhere. Unless by using certain chemicals flax built its own resistance but I haven't heard that theory yet.

[TOM4CWB]

Bucket:

Here are the stages of Pedigreed seed:

1. Breeder Seed: released by the plant breeder; The Progeny of a variety of Breeder seed: next generation is; Select seed.

2. Select seed: Up to 5 generations of Select pedigreed seed can be reproduced from the original Breeder seed lot the Pedigreed Seed grower gets from the Plant Breeder of the variety being grown (ie; CDC Saskatoon being a breeder farm).

3. Foundation pedigreed seed is the progeny of Select (or possibly breeder) pedigreed seed.

4. Registered pedigreed seed is the progeny of normally Foundation pedigreed seed.

5. Certified pedigreed seed is normally the progeny of Registered pedigreed seed; the last multiplication normally in the pedigreed system.

Pedigreed seed can be demoted to Certified seed at any point; if the seed grower is allowed to release the variety to commercial growers.

Now often the Pedigreed seed will be 'demoted from select to "foundation" after one year... as 2.5 acres [1HA] (the size of a select plot) only requires 3 bu for the next select plot... meaning that on flax a 40bu/ac crop nets 100bu from the select plot.

I am a 'Select pedigreed seed grower' by CSGA regulations. After certification involving 3 years of probationary growing of Pedigreed select seed (and proof of varietal purity being maintained), a Pedigreed seed grower becomes a 'Pedigreed Select Seed Grower'.

There are many rules on isolation between pedigreed seed fields, break rotational crops between production of different kinds and varieties of seed.

Have a look at CSGA seed.ca for rules, mostly in circular 6 of the regulations.

Each year each field of pedigreed seed is inspected for purity and weed problems at the pedigreed seed growers cost.

Select plots have plot charges. Breeder seed often costs over $140/ 15kg bag... as an example. Low plant populations are normal on the first Select plot after breeder seed is planted.

Select plots have samples submitted each year and analyzed for purity. Spot checks are done on Foundation Pedigreed varietal purity. Authorized Conditioners are required for resale of Pedigreed seed, with sample and inspection of these establishments and a whole set of protocols for conditioning of pedigreed seed.

Hope this gives you a brief overview to how the CSGA system works.

[parsley]

Who owned Triffid seed? Who sold Triffid seed?

As with most new eligible varieties in Canada, once the Canadian Food Inspection Agency approved a new genetically modified variety for registration and issued the certificate in the name of the ag minister, "CDC FP967 Triffid" seed could then be purchased.

Triffid was approved first, by the registration committee in 1994: thus, tenders were put out so that seed marketing companies were provided with the opportunity to buy Baby Triffid seed. However, the final "Decision Document 98-24" approval from CFIA was not officially stamped and issued until May, 1996.

According to the man who fathered Triffid, and who should know, and who documented the details in his book called "Pandora's picnic basket : the potential and hazards of genetically modified foods", Alan McHughen shares the following:

"Triffid had several bidders, including one of the largest seed companies and some of the smallest.

An 'arm's length" committee considered the bids and eventually awarded the marketing rights to Value Added Seeds, Inc. (VAS), a small local seed company operated by a group of co-operative farmers. In addition to buying the rights to market the variety, they also bought the actual seed." (italics and bold added)

That's clear.

Considering that two Value Added Seeds Inc. representatives, Bill Hetland, and Shane Johnson, sat on the Oilseeds Committee, both they men and reliably update their peers sitting on the Oilseeds Committee, with first hand information on the progress of the very first genetically modified flax in the world.

McHughen ironically writes:

"VAS arranged for their farmers to grow a seed increase of Triffid for the summer of 1994, blissfully unaware of the difficulties that lay ahead."

[parsley]

[parsley]

tom4cwb
Seedgrowers have <a href="http://www.seedgrowers.ca/about_us/objectives.asp?lang=e">responsibility </a>

Could Triffid seed have been sold/released to a group of kindergarten students? Only a group of seedgrowers, am I correct? If not, what's the point of even having seedgrowers if a variety is released to my very clever cat.

[TOM4CWB]

Parsley,

Value Added seeds was wound down some time ago; it became Farm Pure. That to is now gone in the last year with a little help from our friends in winter-peg.

Many many farmers and seed growers lost megabucks... all through this 'ordeal'...

To speculate there was a scheme by them... to rip off farmers... does not compute.

[parsley]

Again, you miss the point.

With that protocol in place, it will be prudent for Viterra and JRI and Canterra et al, to buy varieities under a "company name",gobble up the royalties, and if tanything goes amiss, changge the company names, and leave the conventional farmer to pay for environmental problems, gene insertion causing health problems, etc.

"Let bucket pay. He's too stupid too know better." chortle chortle.

You think?

My point is...somebody bought the variety. With ownership comes responsibilities. Pars
W

[TOM4CWB]

Parsley,

You miss the point.

They gave up on triffid... cause the gm event did not make anyone money... and only really benefited commercial growers. Group 2 resistance increased production on land with carry over chemical issues... but was not even designed to have the chemistry directly applied to the GM flax crop.

I simply perceive you are looking up a tree... that will not, and did not... make any one any money... even if they had a 'grand scheme' thought out!

As for organic flax growers... get pure seed, grow it, with a 35m isolation it is next to impossible for flax to outcross to other flax crops.

Flax is not Canola on the pollination side because the window is so short!

[bucket]

It did not make anyone money? Really Tom, for the next two years the seed growers are going to make a fortune selling flax seed!

Basically a ticket to buy to play the flax game. No audits. The flax council isn't coming to my farm next year to see what I grew. I bought new flax seed so I could sell what I have left. The yield will be astronomical. All because I bought certified seed. Did I plant it? Who knows and who cares, as long as I paid the ticket price, I can go to the game.

I might buy 30 bushels of certified seed for testing purposes only. Then I won't have a triffid problem.

See the problem with the solution, yet?

And does anyone see who is part of the problem?

There seems to be alot of steps between breeder seed and the commercial grower. The problem, as tom pointed out, if the problem starts at the breeder seed, then the problem amplifies throughout the seed growers.

Finally as it comes to the commercial farm they have the problem and for whatever reason, its the producer's fault and he gets to clean it up. Not the seed growers, not the breeders of mons or normandy, not the flax council.

The average producer who is now getting a discount for his flax, gets to pay to fix the problem.

Meanwhile the seed growers thicken their wallets.

Am I correct Tom??