Lobbyists

[parsley]

I had a dandy discussion with a consulate member involved with writing one of the free trade agreements, and also with one of the the lawyers who did the draft for the government. I wasn't involved, my role was a social conversation with both of them.

The point is free trade agreements are government to government documents. I don't get to write it. Neither does an employee.

Free trade agreements are regulatory frameworks set up by government.

Not Buckwheat Bureaucrats flying over to Bolivia. Now, a lot of bureaucrats want to wangle a trip, okay, I understand. But I'm saying, no. Let's be smarter. Not just agriculture, but as a nation.

Your idea is grab all we can get,and ask for more right?

[dave4441]

We have lentil markets that are at risk to free trade agreements between some of our main customers and the USA. We will have a 20% disadvantage on a generic product and a supplier of last resort. You say sit and do nothing?? Some have calculated that the pea phyto issue in India is costing $10/MT on field peas. SHould we as an industry do nothing because the only way to enfluence the Indian government is to involve the CDN feds? What possible gain could come of that. In conventional agriculture we are reliant on exports and always will be.

Are you actually concerned about the travel costs? They are insignificant part of building a bridge between countries. Could the canola issue be resolved without travel costs, or the flax issue. Do you not visit your customers from time to time?

I want to grab it all and ask for more? You bet. Kinda thought that was what an enterprenuer did. Don't mean to come off sounding greedy with that comment, but i am not so philosophical that i am concerned if the government is involved in developing solutions. They have to be involved becuase they are involved.

I voted for Mulroney on free trade, not too many people will admit that, and i think it has put more profit in my pocket as John Cross would say. I view free trade as less government involvement.

[parsley]

http://www.canada.com/reginaleaderpost/news/story.html?id=df6bc26d-420a-4cca-9c9f-7753ef1235c7&k=17645

"On average, Saskatchewan farmers earned $17,000 from their farm operations in 2006, slightly less than the $17,300 they earned in 2001, not accounting for the increase in the cost of living"


http://www.agriculture.gov.sk.ca/Default.aspx?DN=6dae21c7-fdfe-4e7d-bd31-ddcb176618f4 :
Average Farm Operator Income
2006 2001-05*
Net Farm Operating Income $19 218 $18 065

My apologies, Dave.

[dave4441]

Wow, you got me on this issue.

[parsley]

The more money farmers beg from government, the more governmen get to make decisions on your behalf. Their own people get put in place, too. Who really pays Pulse Canada staff?

So if China has a deal and wants xy, and Canada wants mnop, all of a sudden,to reach common ground both negotiate by putting Canadian ag exports on the chopping block, say, yelling "disease" in a crop.

That's government to government roosters strutting and lunging. And ag is the pawn. Farmers don't want to be a pawn, not a good position to be in.

Argentina went from being a lively healthy vibrant ag export indusrty TAXED on their ag exports, to now being weak and government influenced and overun.Pars

[parsley]

It's one of the reasons Dave, why I have pursued blogging and commenting.

Net income for farm families is appalling. It is a systemic problem, as I see it. It isn't because farmers are bad at what they do. it's because first of all, farmers are so bloody busy creating wealth, that they get bogged down in work, but the worst is, they have trusted governments to work in the farmers' best interests.

Governments have done exactly the opposite. IMHO.

I don't get any money for blogging. I only say what I want. And although I may be wrong, out to lunch, and pretty dumb most of the time, and may get on a rant, I have to say, I'd really like to see all the farm Mammas with a fuller purse.

Farm families are good, good people. Pars

[dave4441]

Yes,on that point I agree. The point I am trying to make though is that our customers in the pulse industry are India and China. Really important future consumers and you are not going to influence these countries without using the CDN govt. It is unrealitic to think these issues are going to fix themselves. We have to move big volumes and as it is a competition in global business, we have to be efficent. I would love to see a day where govt was not involved and where industry could create and controll it's destiny, but we might as well hope and plan for the 2nd coming of Christ because it is about as likely to occur in our lifetimes. I am more interested in what is possible then what should be. Heck it was not long ago china quit killing protestors. At the end of the day we will work with these mkts on their terms as we are pretty small fish. We can not even market our own wheat in Canada let alone plan to negotiate without govt influence with a 3rd world customer.

[wd9]

Geez parsely if i didn't know any better i swear you'd be lobbying for the line companies and the crop life companies to keep those trouble maker farmers away.

There is nothing that opens a door more and has an MP listening better then when a farmer goes to Ottawa. A real one that is.

[parsley]

I don't consider farmers' Wheat Board lobbying successful at all.Do you? The government has no intention of providing market choice.

I do agree that some farmers lobby Ottawa to "advance" the GM/biotech agenda via government set up/funded agencies...ie Pulse Canada/Flax Council etc. That's why they were set up in the first place. They are government instrumnets, and they keep sproinging up for every commodity,looking to grab grant money.

Lobbyist-farmers merely provide the government with a voter-face to legitimize chanelling practically all agricultural tax dollars where governments want them to go....mainly private biotech corporations, or else universities with their chairs owned by those corps. The Liberals set it up that way in the 90's. And indeed , Wd, goverments do "listen" to a farmer 'come to the Hill' who says the right things.... but you know that.

Governments have run debt and deficits for so long, it's terribly harmful. But they continue to spend spend, Harper included, (God slap Canada, Tom) to which I propose they should adopt frugality and restraint. Old fashioned, isn't it?

The government looks to commerce to crank the economy, because if companies make money, it keeps grinding. And indeed, farmers ultimately buy more fert, more gas, more chems, and soon more seed.

But returns don't increase because most of the institutions are really government directed, and governments don't want inflationary food prices. Can you see who's paying here?.

Yes, well, although the present kind of strategic planning does indeed guild the hand of a few enabling farmers, ordinary farmers and indeed farming as a whole will suffer the effects of such policy.

The young will run.

I have the stats from a few years ago from Saskatchewan; they are general stats, not individual, overviewing farmers undergoing a farm review. The four quarter section farmer will survive. Some have an off farm job, but he also is frugal. It was the guy who had between 3500-8000 or so acres that gets bloody desperate. Operating and long term loans could crush him overnight with a sharp interest rise coupled with a small downturn in prices. His average net income...well read it in a previous post.

But he is the guy who lobbies and courts government handouts.

So...
one group...off-farm jobs
other group...farming governemnt programs/getting government per diems. Either one is not farming.

Hey, I think there is actually really good coin to be made from farming if strategically, farmers plan differently. Pars

[parsley]

<a
href="http://parsleysnotebook.blogspot.com/2010/01/did-savings-bank-in-sweden-ask-makhdoom.html">If you were now a taxpayer in rural Manitoba</a>
<a href="http://parsleysnotebook.blogspot.com/2010/01/has-fisher-makhdoom-abbas-permanently.html">don't you just wish </a>
<a href="http://parsleysnotebook.blogspot.com/2009/12/sunbelt-prairie-products-red-inked-to.html">that just ONE of the Pulse lobbyists you admire so much</a>
<a href="http://parsleysnotebook.blogspot.com/2009/12/sunbelt-prairie-products-bites-altona.html">had been an internet detective for just one moment for the farm community?</a>

Yes, well. pars

[dave4441]

This has nothing to do with the topic. You are making it sound like lobbyists are now responsible for a private enterprise bankruptcy. What has this got to do with anything.

[TOM4CWB]

Parsley,

I have been to many presentations by each of the folks who work at Pulse Canada.

Your attack is simply off the mark.

Each one of these people is articulate, knowlegable, well respected in our industry, focused on areas of our industry that demand coordination and development... and make real differences to the possible returns for grain at the farm gate.

Railways, grain co's, chem co's... have skilled folks to get their message across... now you are telling me I must take a day job in Ottawa... as well as farm?

You miss the mark on this issue.

Farmers need more influence and honest help in Ottawa... NOT LESS.

[parsley]

Tom, It is not a personal attack. In fact working for Pulse Canada is a great job from an employees point of view.

Stand back.

I am saying the overall structure of agriculture includes intensive, expensive, extensive ag lobbying to our own government. How many man days does ag, as a whole including all ag players, spend, pandering to government? Countless.

And we live in the information age!

Whether at the local level, the provincial level or the federal level. lobbying doesn't serve people well. Nor is it respected. Ask your neighbor what he really thinks of lobbying.

The government only listens to those it wants to hear from, who provide the gov't with an excuse to legitimize a pre-determined decision.

You know that when anti- Wheat Board lobbyists went to Liberal's offices, the government had their mind already made up. It was such a waste of human resources.... which includes employees on both sides, and valuable time for all. I watched Friends of the Board expend piles of money and time lobbying to the Conservatives. This government knew years ago they could have issued export licenses to free up marketing.

Both sides spent money lobbying for no reason..... so I have concluded lobbying only benefits government, and those whom they wish to distribute wealth to.

Farmers are not among that list. Right from 1947.

Pulse Canada is only another bureaucratic organization that will continue to clone efficient government reps. Sorry, but that's what it is. So is the Flax Council of Canada. Both are funded, regulated and dominated by Government. And yes, some farmers love institutionalized central planning.

Pars
I have the following structure handy on my desktop hand....so look at the structure of the flax organization! You really don't think this was set up to serve farmers, do you?


QUOTE

FLAX CANADA 2015 PROJECT FUNDING:

Agricultural Policy Framework (APF), Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada

Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada provides information, research and technology, and policies and programs to achieve security of the food system, health of the environment and innovation for growth.

As the Canadian agriculture and agri-food sector moves into the 21st century, it faces many challenges and opportunities for continued prosperity. Federal, provincial and territorial Ministers of Agriculture have pledged to meet today's challenges by jointly developing a comprehensive Agricultural Policy Framework
Province of Alberta

Alberta Agricultural Research Institute

The Alberta Agricultural Research Institute (AARI) is the primary agency in Alberta for funding, coordinating and promoting strategic agricultural initiatives in research, development and technology transfer for the agriculture and agri-food sector.


AARI was established by the Alberta Science and Research Authority Act and funds numerous projects each year that play a significant role in advancing Alberta's position as a global player in the agriculture and food sector.

Province of Manitoba

Manitoba’s Agri-Food Research and Development Initiative (ARDI) is the primary funding body for agri-food research in the province. With contributions from Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada and Manitoba Agriculture, Food and Rural Initiatives (MAFRI), ARDI funding supports innovative research that results in vibrant rural communities and profitable, sustainable farms. In addition, MAFRI provides complimentary support to primary and value-added enterprises through a range of farm and rural services delivered throughout Manitoba.


Province of Saskatchewan

Saskatchewan Agriculture and Food's mandate is to foster a commercially viable, self-sufficient and sustainable agriculture and food sector. Working with individuals, businesses, communities, and governments, the department assists farmers and ranchers, encourages higher value production and processing, and promotes sustainable economic development in rural Saskatchewan.

Flax Council of Canada

The Flax Council of Canada is a single organization, representing the producers, grain handlers, shippers, exporters and end-users of flax. Established in 1986 with full representation from all agricultural and industrial flax interests, the Flax Council promotes the advancement of flax and flax products.

The Council focuses the resources of the entire Canadian flax industry on flax market development, market and production research and crop promotion. Through its marketing initiatives and communication programs, the Flax Council creates worldwide market opportunities for flax. The Council has a strong research and technical emphasis, supporting flax-related research both with direct funding and indirectly as a coordinating forum.

Saskatchewan Flax Development Commission



The Saskatchewan Flax Development Commission, established in 1996, works to lead, promote, and enhance the production, value-added processing and utilization of Saskatchewan flax.


The Saskatchewan Flax Development Commission has defined three main areas of activity allocating check-off dollars annually to research; communication and market facilitation with the intent to provide for the orderly and effective development of the flax industry in Saskatchewan.


FLAX CANADA 2015 PROJECT MANAGEMENT:

Ag-West Bio Inc., the executing agency for Flax Canada 2015, is a not for profit, member-based organization at the forefront of Saskatchewan’s bio-economy. Ag-West Bio works as a catalyst for partnerships and industry growth through investments, aiding strategic alliances, providing regulatory advice and communications. Integral to the development of one of North America’s most successful life science clusters, consider Ag-West Bio your complete resource for information on Saskatchewan’s bio-economy.

Ag-West Bio Inc.

101 – 111 Research Drive, Saskatoon, SK, S7N 3R2, CANADA

Tel: (306) 975-1939 Fax: (306) 975 1966 UNQUOTE

[parsley]

Dave, I'll own up.

"You like to sit around and play internet detective while the rest of the world moves forward with real concerns"

I admit I got a little pissy with that comment. Not because I fancy myself an internt detective, in fact I'm quite dumb at it, but from the Altona Manitoba municipal taxees' point of view, nobody, including themselves, did any due diligence. I figured one of the paid pulse elite should have.

And I was being sarcastic, I indulged, but you'd have thought one fancy degreed pulse-collar flying to Ottawa with blackberry in hand would have thumbed in Makhdoom Abbas. These Pulsettes are the smart kids of the industry, aren't they? But it is, yes, ultimately Altona's baby. Pars

[TOM4CWB]

Parsley,

Have you actually been involved with one of the Pulse Canada folks and see them work FOR US?

I have... for years... and some of the best money I ever spent... as a pulse grower... was provided to them to represent me in a timely manner.

AND I should know... Parsley... we as growers spend far too little on the market development and public policy areas... which is EXACTLY why so many grain growers complain we end on the short end of public policy.

You can not have it both ways at the same time. Pulse Canada is doing real and important work with the medical research community, transportation sector, environmental policy, jobs growers are woven into where important... but the day to day facilitation needs are met by those skilled at bringing progress to farmers farm gates through skilled and talented peoples hard work!

You are picking on the wrong people Parsley. The Industry out spends us $20-1 and you complain about the $1?

Good Grief.

<(>;{ GRIN you goofis!