farm subsidies

[liberty]

I find it ironic that L Weber's post above mentions the pervasive influence of socialist thinking among the Western Canadian farm community, at the same time that several of the posters for this topic seem to prove his point.

"...we are dropping like flies and there is no one to pick up after us."

If I had a dime for every time I heard that ridiculous statement, I'd be a millionaire.

While it's true that there are far fewer farmers today than there were ten, twenty or fifty years ago, the amount of land in cultivation is still roughly the same as it always was, and its productivity has soared.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, the free market has worked in agriculture for the most part as it should have: to make sure that incompetent, unproductive farmers are pushed out of the industry so that competent, capable producers can take their place. More subsidies would only slightly delay, but not stop, this vital dynamic.

Can you socialists also stop repeating that absurd cliche about our alleged "cheap food policy"? An example of that would be the CWB's cut-rate post-war grain sales to Britain, but I doubt that you socialists would want to dwell on that issue for long.

In any case, what would you propose to replace a "cheap food policy" with? An expensive food policy?

[ivbinconned]

"Greed" has been around since Adam and Eve and it may explain some things but not everything.
Man's inner instinct to be creative and productive is what has driven western cultures, industry, and even trivial pursuits for hundreds of years.

Saddly many today fall for socialist cures having been enticed there, by government funded corporate entities that champion the "free market" all the while hiding behind regulations implemented by their political friends that regulate their competition.

I go to jail if I haul my wheat outside my borders...

“A slave is one who waits for someone else to free him”

[sagewood]

liberty, some of your comments don't really deserve a reply--you seem to have trouble expressing yourself without using profanity.

I have no trouble with a cheap food policy, as long as it is not on the backs of those in agriculture who are supposed to work double time to keep the prices down and continue to raise food to feed this country. Those in other industries are able to raise their prices to cover the input costs--when this happens in agriculture in this country, the government simply brings in cheaper imports to undercut home-grown products. If we were simply competing with each other as you say, well fine, even playing field--but when we have to compete with the government and live by their rules, (or go to jail), well then I cannot agree that we are socialists. Not all of us were given the farm and all the equipment by our parents--many, many of us have had to pay top dollar to stay in the business, while being paid what amounts to less than a minimum wage.

liberty, please try to get a little sleep tonight and have a better day tomorrow.

[ivbinconned]

As I was writing that last blurb I was thinking...I have spouted off on this topic before. The old memory still works!!

On sept 5th 03 we had a good discussion going here on this topic and I don't know how to access the archives but I did save the thread to my putor for future reference.

Here is one of my posts way back then.


posted Sep 6, 2003 11:04
________________________________________
From 1991 to 1999, there was a 78%reduction in direct federal expenditures in support of the agri-food sector in Sask. and a 69% reduction for Alberta. In the same time period there was only a 27% reduction in Quebec. I am NOT bad mouthing the Quebec farmer but I do "bad mouth" a system that bleeds money from Alberta to "lavishly" support farms in another province.

If Alberta farmers don't mind this at least you would think they would rise up and insist that the money goes to there neighboring province where there grandpa and uncles farm.

Now that is just the federal expenditures! What about the "lavish" support of Alberta dollars the Quebec farmer gets through their provincial government via federal transfers...hush-hush...were not supposed to know.

While I have seen my Saskatchewan assets drop in value 50% in the last 10 to 15 years, in Quebec the high level of Quebec government support is a major reason why average net worth of grain and oil seed producers increased 51.3% compared to 12.7 per cent in Ontario from 93 to 97; during the same period, average assets in Quebec increased by 53.5 per cent compared to 15.8% in Ontario.

When total crop receipts for Quebec were just $1.3 billion as compared to Ontario’s $3.1 billion the Quebec Ag ministry spent $527 million while Ontario's spent just $372 million! Neat what you can do as a "have not" province while Alberta sleeps.

I have said it before in these threads, what does a pick pocket do? He makes you look the other way! So we are told to look and blame the U.S. and Europe, while with in our own country the 21 year old Quebec ASRA programs (indirectly funded with ALBERTA money) heaps impressive benefits on, for example, in Quebec a 780 acre corn grower over a 9 year period ending in 99 amounted to $580,000, or an average of $64,445 per year with a 99 provision of $99,480! Not bad eh!

This program now includes all ag production and guess what, it is acreage based, cost of production based, and also has an interesting aspect to it in that the benefits are based on 90% of a skilled workers wages in Quebec, ie. nurse, teacher, government employees, etc.
Could this be why the average age of farmers in Quebec is much lower than say Saskatchewan?

Could it be that a net payout in 1999 of $120.00 per acre of barley to a Quebec farmer is why he could afford to send us that load of hay that the Canadian Alliance got so excited about and we where all supposed to feel so warm and fuzzy about. Give me a break!
End of old post.

[sagewood]

liberty, I apologize, I see it was not you using profanity on this site...

[bucket]

It was me. And I will repeat, it was directed at the government. They don't care and neither do I about them.

My hand is up. I can admit that I swore. Don't take offence. I could really spice it up if you want to be offended.

[ivbinconned]

It would be great if in all ag products there was a free and open market (free of gov. support) but that is something that has never been and never will be.
Since the time of Kings, food (grain etc) has always been used as a political tool to be used to manipulate something or some one.