Agristability

[BreadWinner]

The overpayments that were forgiven had nothing to do with inventories or cheating. As I understand it, it was more an issue relating to structure change formula's, forage pricing etc. The applicants overpaid had reported the correct data, it was the adminstration that made the error. That is why they never clawed it back. It would have been different if it was farmer data submission errors.

It is hard for any administration to see what is going on in every single operation. They are only going to see averages.

You are correct in your comments about not being able to change what is correct. Is it an issue of areas such as classification of expenses on your tax returns in each year (separating interest from input costs, custom work charges including in chemical etc).

I think the biggest issue is cut off of the inventory at year end. How many producers give that number as of March 31 when their tax is getting done?

I will agree that the program has a fault in that if you have experienced poor years in a row that your reference margin is very low. Tell my why some farms are able to manage through it? Luck is part of it, but when I saw the database my accountant had in various RM's all across his region and you have reference margins in every RM from $50 per acre to $200 , what is each of them doing different? It didn't matter the size of the farm or the RM.

[Hopperbin]

Your right Sask.99 your accountant should give you a statement regarding your reference margin and if you trigger or not. That is what I was used to with MNP.
FBC sent my agristability in in Feb. I guess at that time there was no year end prices set for inventory so inventory adjustment cannot be done so a trigger statement cannot be sent to me. By now they sure as hell should have the year end prices set. Reason I think I trigger is I planted canola on pea stubble last year a lot of it, it was bent over crappy specialty oil shit. We spent triple time swathing it and then it averaged 15 to 20 percent moisture at harvest plus lower yield. We took it off but not without spoilage. So I have spoiled canola listed in inventory. When do they set the year end inventory prices Sask99? I prefer it in years past when it was set I think near end of Feb following year. At least you know what you had coming then. I am so fed up with FBC you phone in and always talk to a couple assholes that don't know anything first and give a line of bullshit.

[Burbert]

WOW, WOW, is all that I kin say. You big boys are lining up at the trough toooooo! An all this time, I thought yous was so smart marketin from home and grown the best of the best. Wit brokers bangin on yer door fer yer 80% of all the grain grown. Now it turns out yer just like all the rest, nobody knows what their doin. Whinning and snivelling is still the main theme in farmin it seems. Gagstability yeah lets have more and more gagstability, me and my accounter kin get rich....

[sewen]

To me these program is just creating an unlevel playing field, huge greedy farmers with all the shiney equipment getting large sums of money. Small guys that are making money but getting ahead very slowly get nothing. To me it's too much like being on welfare, so it doesn't bother me that I have never received anything from it. Sounds like some know how to milk the system though.

[skhadenuf]

Oh my God sask99 all those lines and words to basically say that clerical errors are the reason some farmers have poor margin???? Uhm well, let me see doesn't having good weather and growing a crop have something maybe to do with it?

but as with most bullshitters the more you talk the more is revealed, you have admitted finally that the majority of clerical errors rest within CAIS itself, and just as you stated above it's a nightmare to get those errors corrected yeah that's all stuff we've been saying on here for years.

Are you really saying the reason that people's margins differ from 0 to 200 is because of clerical errors or as you mentioned on another thread because farmers are not declaring personal fuel on their income tax. Are you kiddin us all?????

the things you are saying come exactly almost word for word out of the ag department which really reveals who you are and that the ag department is in total disfunction and out of touch of it's own program and farming in gereral.
When ag ministers rely upon geeky pencil pushers to design programs you get the fu--ing mess we have now.

The free ride for the Conservatives and Sask Party is over. They took our votes for granted, put as littly money and effort as possible into changing the CAIS program and crop insurance into something better, simpler, and faster. There were areas like ours and freewheat that had total wipeouts but because not as big an area they were willing to forego the votes. Others had relatively good crops so the CAIS and crop insurance weren't even an issue. But now the shit has hit the fan and the reality that they have no real plan for a disaster no real program that deals with declining coverages and slow, bureacratic, accountant friendly, farmer nightmare details have come to the forefront.
Just a month ago Ritz stated the programs will look after everyone, well obviously the fact they are in the back room scrambling to figure out what the hell to do speaks volumes, they don't have a fu--ing clue, because these programs are so complicated. The problem is he has to save face and put some spin on this mess so there are the paid peddlers pushing the idea that if only your clerical errors were corrected Ritz's Cais would have worked. The pencil pushers have influenced the ag department to develop so farm specific programs that now they realize they actually should have concentrated on maintaining a bottom line of income and not whether or not your cow is 1000# or 1150# not whether or not your wheat is #1 or #2 but instead a simple program guaranteeing you a basic amount regardless of past weather or price fluctuations that drag you down financially for years.

Get the fu--ing pencil pushers out of the back room get some farmers that know what's going on.
Design a program you buy a certain amount of coverage, whether it comes from more dollars or bushels ie 10 bushels at 5bucks or 5 bushels at 10 bucks, as long as you get your guarantee. Get rid of the thousands of overlapping jobs in cais and crop insurance, that money iself would go a long way to pay premiums. If you produce better than that good for you you will prosper further.

Ritz would gain a whole lot of respect if he just came out and admitted look this thing is a mess, that by trying to be so exact on each farm we have lost sight of the big picture, shut the programs down, let's just go to guaranteeing everyone x amount of dollars, everyone is equal and develop it further for the future.

[newguy]

I have always said cais can never work proper because most farmers have reduced risk themselves. Why does the government just get a copy of the US program and go with that.The US could not say we were using unfair programs . Oh yea and the CWB would have to go also. Another reason.

[newguy]

Hadenuf you are such a wingnut! No where in any of my comments did I say it was administration that caused the difference between 0 and 200. There are hundreds of reasons and that is just one of them. Land productivity, when you buy your inputs, what you use, how much you yield,how you market and how well you market. These are the biggest factors. If the gov't would design a program that provides your magical level of income you would be the best one at finding a way to fall under and get a payment. Between crop insureance, agriinvest, agristability, we have a base line guarantee. You just have not demonstrated profitability ever before and the way you talk its obvious. If its a multiyear weather issue I can sympathize. Doing what you are asking is the same as the US and europe and there program isn't working either.

[Hopperbin]

Saskfarmer99 I thought grain prices themselves was enough to trigger agristability payments in most cases. I did have another drop in income from my loss in poor canola crop. Burbert yes I am at the trough LOL. I am not compaining about gov't payments just poor accounting service, I hired them assholes to do the job and they take money up front before anything is done and I did give them a big chunk of cash so when I now talk to 3 assholes that don't know anything and don't get back to me what am I supposed to think, they could at least tell me that the people that know anything are on holidays, they don't even know enough to say that. I was just wondering if anyone got a payment yet. I must phone into agristability and now do the rest myself, that was not supposed to be my job, I hired someone to take care of this for me.

[skhadenuf]

Woooooooo!!!!! Those are scarey words from the government geek, must have hit a nerve there, Wooooooooooooooo!!!!!
Did that come out of the Geek handbook of insults, you must be on such a high now that you actually had balls to say something?
But please keep on talking,now you are saying there are thousands of variables that make up this "simple" program. That's exactly what most of the rest of us are saying,this program is trying to be so specific when it can't be and is actually bizarre to even attempt to call itself accurate, fair, or simple when there are thousands of variables to account for the end product.
Ask Freewheat about how these shit programs based on past averages gives you a base line. Yes when you are like yourself and had good weather for the past 10 years in a row your average is good but what happens now. If this turns into a three year crop loss which it may very well be we'll see who'll be whining.
As far as taking money like I said before if your so smart don't take the government subsidy, tax payer supported cais money do it on your own. I and I am sure freewheat and others are not asking for a windfall but rather a fair compensation to ride out this disaster, you with your no loss years will be recieving more money than your expenses so who is the greedy one?

[skhadenuf]

message above intended for sk99 not hopper delay in posting I guess.