OK Any one who Really understands the Canadian AG Programs and Accountants.

[SASKFARMER3]

Yes its funny but a lot of farmers are going to be using these programs this winter.
1. No crop scenario with crop insurance.
2. Crop some flood damaged checks and crop insurance.
3. Hailed out.
4. PS poor crop, No crop insurance.

OK so if some of you that studied the three programs we have Crop insurance Agristability and Agriinvest.
Scenario Use good healthy margin plus money in Agriinvest.
Will the Flood damage payment come off your agristability and crop insurance etc.
Some have excellent crops others will need to know these programs to a tee.

[TOM4CWB]

SF3,

Since Crop Insurance is voluntary... and a pooling of risk with other growers... over 10 years... why should those who pay huge sums of $$$ for years into this insurance pool... pay?

For a straight disaster with no avaliable insurance... we do need to put a program together more like the US has. Does the Agri-program do this?

Our experience is that it is better than nothing. However to figure out what is going to be paid before the claim is paid... is seldom possible. Perhaps that is the way it should be... to stop folks from manipulating the program.

After all... it is taxpayer funded... which puts over 95% of the funds not earned/submitted by farmers!

[SASKFARMER3]

Tom thanks for the political style answer to the question. DAH. Just farmers need to get a grip on these two programs because unlike Alberta farmers in Sask and some of Manitoba will need them for 2010. So yes your right I have paid years into Sask crop with premiums and only collected a few times. (02 and 04). That's why you have insurance for shit years. But on agristability and Agriinvest that's the game for tier two and three. That's where most farmers have a hard time grasping the programs.
So simply put if a farmer has a high 5 year average margin and some money in Agriinvest what are the out comes. That's the question not BLA BLA BLA Alberta has a good crop so what attitude.

[riders2010]

so what do you think sf3 about the people that flooded out in 05 06 and part of 07, and therefore have very little margin, while others that had good weather and therefore good crops therefore some margin may collect something is that the way a program should work. those that need it least get more money.
By the way there are supposedly a couple of guys out west that know they have a margin know they have no crop so filled their bins with fertilizer and chemical and agristability is going to pay for it for next year, because who is going to check if it was used this year or stashed away in a bin or shed?

[Gerald_sk]

Not true unless they are crooks. The fertilizer is inventory
and comes out of any payment. Even an extra 100 gallon in the
fuel tank is increase in inventory. One way to get money would
be to put it in the ground. Not sure what the rules are for
that, if you have never done it before.
Personally think Ag-stability and the old CAIS are made for accountants
and people who figure out ways to get money out of the program,
whether it is real need or just paper need.
When Viterra got the millions out of CAIS I figure all these
program are just a scam to make the rich richer and John Q Public
thing the rich crying farmers are getting a other handout.
The flood program is a good example. Every dollar they pay
will come out of money they would have paid under Ag-stability

[Hopperbin]

Actually a lot of farmers are working the agristability and the gov't knows it which is a big reason they are so far behind.

[Hopperbin]

Well everyone knows that crop insurance, the federal $30 per eligible acre are going to become part of the agristability program payment calculation.

The biggest thing that everyone forgets is that this is actually a good thing. If you didn't receive something from these these 2 programs, agristability would only cover about 65% of the income loss.

You are better off, even with the premiums you pay to crop insurance.

I fear for those that are not in crop insurance as you won't see a very big payment (at least not as much as you would have received in total will crop ins figured in)

And as far as the BS that people keep saying that you cannot calculate where you are at, well my accountant has done a great job from day one.

And for those that have no margin and have experienced no crop 4 out of the last 5, I don't have the answer and the program will not provide much help. It is what it is, it will never satisfy all.

[riders2010]

That's right Gerald they are crooks, and not anyone is checking this stuff, and even if they did are they going to look in sheds and that sort of thing? Also you don't even need it to be in a shed all you need is a piece of paper and there is your payout it's as easy as printing your money especially dealer farmers how would anyone ever prove how much chemical etc they used.

So this program is for crooks and those that don't need the money, and of course accountants and papershufflers.

If you have grain in storage Jan 1 and then again dec 31 the change in value of that grain is a factor in your payment so if your a good marketer and held grain seeing that the flood is coming you are going to be penalized, one year should not affect another year.

Hopper the reason these things are late is because the paper shuffles to so many departments that no can keep track, one little glitch and bang your file is screwed for who knows how long.
There are people waiting for 2008 notices.

Your right sask99 many farmers that have listened to minister Ritz say the program will work just trust us until after the election are going to find out there is nothing there for them, that is a really good point thanks for that!

Waht does it cost to run agrivation, counting severance, retirement income wages, office space equipment etc. where is this amount it must be staggerring that on top of crop insurance wow cost and crop insurance comes off of agrivation so all the agrivation cost is for about what coverage, nothing for 75% of all farmers.