Fertilizer price and ag-stability

[Gerald_sk]

Wonder how many a applying fertilizer this fall just because of
ag-stability. I know there is a lot more going on this fall
than in past years. Seems like a great deal for any farm that
will be getting payment next year.

[Hopperbin]

I believe all farmers are trying it, but for myself I have been auditted and need to give statements no problem from suppliers. no shit on why, farmers have very small brains no wander we are treated like sheep.

[riders2010]

Yeah I hear that big time out in the high margin areas, that would be something called fraud but hey they (cais) can barely keep track of the forms there'd be no way they can catch those screwing the system input suppliers want their money so just back date the sale easy as printing your own cheque.

What a crock of shit, apas and all those farm organizations gonna be held to task for not speaking up on this bull going on. The flooded out and drought areas with no margins gonna get nothing.

[Gerald_sk]

I wasn't implying anything about fraud. Just the farmers are not
looking a prices because there is money to cover come at about
70 cents on the dollar. Once in the ground it is not inventory,
and very easy to say you changed your timing because of the open
fall and bad spring this year.

[riders2010]

I don't quite follow your first post then, the money from agrivation coming next year is for the program lottery winners that have margin decline on this crop, putting fertilizer in the ground this fall is a prepaid expense for next year, are you saying they will get more money from agrivation for this crop because of putting fertilizer on this fall? If so that is free fertilizer if it is declared as an expense and not inventory also. And that is my point it is a free for all for any with a margin that want to abuse it. They can audit all they want as long as you say that went on for last year's crop nothing they can do except be out there with a video camera perhaps.

[riders2010]

Here yet another perfect example of the great missunderstanding of the program and getting the information correct on the forms.

You are a 100% correct Rider about the prepaid expense. Fertilizer fall applied is inventory but only if it is also recorded as an expense in the same taxation year.

One could even argue that fall desication is partly prepaid as some is for harvest, some is for subsequent year benefits. Spraying after crop is harvested is a prepaid also.

I think there are many things Agristability could do if they suspect a shady application. One being throw the whole application out and deny any benefits for the year. They have done it in Alberta! Because of the administration in Sask, I think there will be closer ties to what actually is happening (at least I hope)

Back dating receipts will not necessarily be enough support. Evidence of payment or charge to your account, evidence of delivery are other means. If you didn't seed a lot of crop in 2010 it will be tough to argue you have too much of the expense. I have a good relationship with my input suppliers but I don't think they are going to doctor their books to assist their customers in fraud.

Besides all the concepts of right or wrong, fraud or error, I hope all remember that what you choose to report now has a significant bearing on the reference margin of future payments. As some of you describe your unfortunate repeated disasters, you may need the funds another year more than you need it now.

[Hopperbin]

Gerald do you understand that pre buying fertilizer, seed and chemical at this time now goes onto your 2011 agristability? And fertilizer in the ground in fall is a pre buy. Sask. crop ins. which has more brain power than the previous administration will be catching a lot of it. All in all it would have been better to do it right in the first place as some farmers may actually be screwing themselves for having done it all the years and claims for the last couple years are being caught resulting in huge payment losses. Sask99 this is how it usually goes is it not? If you owe the gov't money they will go back more years than if they would have owed you money. Watching the snow fall I sure wish I would have started anhydrosing a little earlier, the price is now adjusted up.