EU Triffid (zero tolerance) vs. Negative Triffid Test Result vs. Consequences for All Crops

[parsley]

There are challenges in co-existence between canola and mustard. And also between conventional and organic.

GM contamination can occur at field level. It presents both genetic seed problems and marketing problems in organic crops.

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=10&ved=0CEUQFjAJ&url=http%3 A%2F%2Fwww.sapidlife.org%2Fdocumenti_repository%2F scarica.php%3Ffile%3Den20060403200334proceedings_1 st_conference.pdf&ei=vT4uTfXiBY-ssAPdhYXWBg&usg=AFQjCNFUugcr1dzOx8TBXT_JBW4-jn5t0w

"When the relevant management measures are taken to reduce GM pollen dispersal, we expect that an isolation distance of 100 m will result in a GM content in the range of 0.1% to 0.3% of the total oilseed crop in the organic field (very small fields excluded). Single test samples collected from especially the field margins may however show a higher GM content."

The hotdog vendor in Austria doesn't want to recall GM mustard becuse it tested positive from cross-pollination.

Co-existence of crops and farming methods is necessary. Many work and consult with their neighbors. You throw up your hands and screech, "Lunatics."

Pars

[parsley]

My point is, there are two systems in play. charliep And have to be respected as such.

I referred to the plastic bags to illustrate how something from the past, that was originally "deemd safe" all of a sudden, is deemed no longer safe, charliep A reversal, that non-gm food won't have to deal with.

Projected number of events in GM crops worldwide, by trait:

http://www.agbioforum.org/v13n2/v13n2a08-cerezo.htm


Look at Figure 1
They include:
Herbicide Tolerance
Virus Resistance
Anbiotic Stress Tolerance drought)
Insect Resistant
Crop composotion oil/starch composition
disease resistance
other or unknown

Some traits are 'in the tube' for Canola, besides the ones already in the field.

The big question wd, is, think about GM food when there is worldwide negotiated global free trade, including China, North Korea, India and Iran, and all of them release hundreds of Events for all crops, with all of them stacked with three or four traits?

Science also surprises us with long term results.

You are still at stage one where you want to argue gm vs non-gm, safe vs unsafe. wd

EU prefers to buy from me and not from you. Try courting Africa. Parsley

[parsley]

"A few writings on a piece of paper"

EU legislated tolerances:
.09%
.01%
.00%
They precisely mean what they mean.

[parsley]

A document called:

"The legitimate and viable regulation of coexistence in the EU"

http://www.gmcc-09.com/wp-content/uploads/27-etty-2.pdf

".. it should be recalled that Member States’ dissatisfaction with GMO regulation has brought the EU regime to its knees before. If conflict over coexistence continues, this risk is
likely to recur."

charliep, there are many doucments with this TONE from the EU. Pars

[charliep]

Strange comments on mustard. Outcrossing of 0.1 to 0.3 percent 100
meters into a field (numbers you quoted). Brown mustard mainly grown on
brown to dark brown soils due to better drought tolerance (yes canola but
not like black soil zones). Assume there are rotation practices on mustard
and canola too keep them separated.

I note that mustard of all types and canola have been grown in western
Canada for years without impacting their unique quality and agronomic
characturistics. Pedigreed is able to be grown to exact specifications and
purity. Malt barley is sold on varietal purity. Specialty oil canola. Yet brown
mustard is held to a higher standard based on _________? I know the
comment will be the buyer is always right but________.

[wd9]

But change those writings from 0% to .01% and it makes all the difference in the world. One is achievable, one is not. But you are absolutely right, what the customer with a full belly and the need for market manipulation and protection of domestic production and prices wants, that customer gets. With canola at 13$ a bushel here, there must be a few customers out there for it who know it is safe and healthy.

Consequence for canola, soy, wheat, barley, corn? Minimal. And as food demand rises, less all the time.

The most memorable event i can remember was watching half the european group go out and have a smoke at break at a food safety meeting in Ottawa. Came back in and argued how harmful GE canola AP was in shipments. Its a messed up world parsely but policies are apparently not written in ink. Light pencil with an eraser close by should the actual need for food arise.

[charliep]

Maybe to help me as a consumer, what are the dire consequences of eating flaxseed with a 0.01 % triffid presense in the overall system. Lets just assume I a tablespoon a day (don't know if right but lets assume 50 seeds) 200 days each year (not every day but close). Over the course of a year, I may consume 1 seed of triffid out of the 10,000 seeds I consume. I may actually dodge the bullet one year but eat 2 seeds the next. I may be really unlucky and eat 1,000 seeds one year but the probability is low (not that much triffid seed in the system).

Will I get sick or die?

[wd9]

No you will not charlie because triffid is safe for food feed and the environment.

You are much more likely to die from starvation from policy that makes no sense.

From Reuters:

(Reuters) -- America's stockpiles of corn and soybeans will be drawn down to uncomfortably thin levels this year, according to a government report Wednesday that sent grain prices soaring and added to concerns over surging world food prices.

Dwindling stocks in the world's biggest food exporter -- depleted by strong ethanol demand and a sharp reduction in estimated corn and soy production last year -- and poor crops in other major exporting countries are setting up what could be one of the toughest years for food prices and supplies since 2008.

[ianben]

Hi Charlie
I think the numbers for BSE
are even smaller than the ones you are
quoting if you take world wide cattle
numbers and confirmed BSE cases.

Confirmed human cases are very very few
and I my view the link to eating beef
unproven.

Yet still countries ban and restrict
beef imports. Seeing the cost of BSE in
UK I can understand this reaction.

It is just plain risk management

Why take any risk no matter how small if
it can be avoided ?

[charliep]

Too much of an economist/numbers guy. I look at risk from two components. Probability and severity. Probability of the event is something I can for discussion as has been talked. Severity is another point altogether. Regardless of probability, CJD is not something to be ignored - pretty horrible death. Having said, myself combined with most Canadians have not reduced beef consumption much and likely for other reasons.

Don't understand the EU attitude toward risk. North America has been consuming GE crops for 15 years although most is not direct but indirect via meat. Europe and the UK are part of the process in that soybean meal makes up a major portion of your livestock feed. Suspect soybean oil also is a major component of your human consumption vegoil market. Parsley will site a number of different medical issues but I suspect even these are a result of a complex mixture of environmental/other issues.

Welcome. I appreciate both your and malleefarmers view from a different part of the world.

[ianben]

Perhaps it is the thought of CJD and its
awful consequence which induces the
horror and panic over BSE.
I have never understood why it became so
emotive even before the human link was
made.
Why would someone who smoked 40 a day
not eat beef?
Is lung cancer a better death?

I would guess almost every activity
carried out by man has a greater risk of
death than eating beef and contracting
BSE. Death by choking must be way higher
but does anybody live on soup.

Logic science risk are not why EU still
does not recognise GM.

Fear of an irrational public reaction if
some funding seeking scientist invents a
frankinstein senario and repeats the BSE
crisis

Perhaps you had to be in UK in the 90s
to understand.