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    Lakers Q and A

    No Mention that in a *co-operative* they envision this to be someday you get an equity cheque.

    No mention of Measners ties to Mission Terminal.

    Slight mention of consultation process.

    Who do they think they are Qaddafi?


    http://www.cwb.ca/public/en/hot/lakers/#qanda

    Question and Answer - updated February 22, 2011

    Q. How are these ships being paid for?
    A. The investment in these two vessels totals $65 million. This will be paid from general revenues over the course of four crop years. The purchase will not be financed over a longer period, meaning there is no borrowing and no interest charges.

    Q. Do only farmers who ship from the east coast pay for the boats and benefit from the boats?
    A. All farmers will pay the upfront cost of the investment, and all farmers will benefit from the long-term revenue. The cost is coming from CWB general revenues, so all farmers pay a share. The long-term revenue will flow into general revenues, benefitting all farmers. The costs and benefits are not limited to those whose grain moves in any one direction.

    Q. How does the CWB expect to be able to operate ships? What do you know about operating large lake vessels?
    A. We are not experts at operating ships. That's why we are entering an agreement with two major shipping companies, Algoma Central Corporation and Upper Lakes Group Inc. The ships will be operated by Seaway Marine Transport, which is a partnership of the two companies. They will operate as part of a pool of ships that will include vessels owned by Algoma and Upper Lakes.

    Q. Will these carry exclusively Prairie grain?
    A. No. They will operate as part of a pool of ships managed by Seaway Marine Transport, and all shipping opportunities will be maximized. In general, the ships will often carry grain eastward out of Thunder Bay, and carry iron ore or other commodities from seaports back into the Great Lakes. This will maximize the revenue potential of the ships.

    Q: What else will the ships be carrying?
    A: These boats are dry bulk carriers, which means they can carry goods that are classified as dry bulk, including grain, iron, ore, coal, aggregate, salt. In terms of what they will be carrying, it really depends on the trip. Seaway Marine Transport will be marketing these ships to get the maximum value for producers.

    Q. Is this purchase within the CWB's mandate?
    A. Yes. The CWB's goal is to maximize farmer returns. Reducing transportation costs by investing in these ships can help achieve that goal. Every year, it costs farmers $70-75 million to move their grain through the Great Lakes. Through this investment, farmers share in the revenue and recoup part of these costs.

    Q. Is the east coast going to continue to be an important route for shipping farmers' grain?
    A. Yes, Last year, CWB-chartered lake freight totalled about three million tonnes. Volumes through the east are expected to increase in coming years - our projections show east coast shipments could grow more than 20 per cent by 2018. East coast ports primarily serve Europe, Africa and Latin America, and our projections show increased demand from these regions.

    Q. Why do this now?
    A. The Great Lakes fleet is aging and needs renewal. The Government of Canada recently removed a 25-per-cent tariff on imported ships to make the renewal of the Canadian domestic fleet economically feasible. Tariff removal, combined with a strong Canadian dollar, make this an opportune time for this investment.

    Q. Can the CWB own assets like this?
    A. Yes, the CWB can legally acquire movable property, such as the hopper cars it already owns or these ships. (The CWB owns about 3,400 hopper cars, which have proven a sound investment that has paid for itself many times over.) The CWB is only prohibited under the Canadian Wheat Board Act from buying real-estate assets such as grain elevators or port terminals, without government approval.

    Q. How large are these boats? What is their tonnage capacity, physical size and fuel usage?
    A. These two vessels are in the Equinox class, and are regarded as the next generation of Great Lakes bulk carriers. They can each haul up to 30 000 tonnes, roughly 5,000 tonnes more than the average laker today. These lakers will be able to carry more cargo, sail faster, consume less fuel, and be more environmentally friendly. A video explaining the features of the new Equinox class bulk carriers can be found here.

    Q. How long will these boats provide a revenue stream?
    A. We are projecting a lifespan of 25 years for these vessels. Keep in mind, however, that every boat currently serving the Great Lakes is now older than 25 years - the newest boat was launched 28 years ago.

    Q: How much CWB grain is moved through the St. Lawrence Seaway, in tonnes and dollar value, each year?
    A: Between 3 and 3.6 million tonnes per year, with a dollar value of between $70 and $75 million.

    Q: How many trips will they make in a typical year?
    A. Each boat will make 14 trips in a typical year.

    Q: Where will the crews come from and how big will the crew be?
    A: The crews will be all Canadian, as required by Canadian law, and currently each laker employs a crew of between 21 and 24 people.

    Q. How many ships are in the laker system?
    A. There are currently 20 Canadian dry bulk ships in the laker fleet, and they are aging. The newest boat was launched 28 years ago. Aging vessels, as well as changes to ballast-water regulations and fuel-usage restrictions, could make a large part of the lake fleet obsolete.

    #2
    You dont need much of a calculator to know the equation doesn't compute from the answers given. It never seizes to amaze me how stupid the CWB believes their support is.

    Comment


      #3
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_freighter


      The average lifespan of a laker is 40–50 years.[5] Boats older than 50 years are not unusual. The St. Mary's Challenger, built in 1906 as the William P Snyder (552 ft), is currently the oldest boat in active duty on the Lakes. She is managed by HMC Ship Management, LTD. and owned by St. Mary's Cement, a subsidiary of Votorantim Cimentos.

      (5) http://www.boatnerd.com/welcome.htm

      Comment


        #4
        I like this part.........(The CWB owns about 3,400 hopper cars, which have proven a sound investment that has paid for itself many times over.)

        That must be why it cost me only $1.60/bushel basis at the elevator in South East Sask. The last time I checked, I could have got $10.25/bushel in the pit 150 miles from me in North Dakota. What was the highest Pro? in the pocket? Yup them cars have proven to be a real sound investment. And now with 2 Laker's as another sound investment, I can hardly wait for them savings.

        Comment


          #5
          Just love the matter of fact statements. No borrowing or interest costs? Where does this money come from? Do thet not understand that they are "borrowing" this money from farmers without consent.

          Comment


            #6
            If they are taking the money from farmers, shouldn't farmers expect the 15 percent return on their money as the lender every year from the time the spend the money.

            This return as a good investment can not be proven as I don't get a dividend cheque from the hopper cars every year.

            No transparency.

            If the asked farmers for the money with a commitment of a return in the form a share/dividend it might make more sense.

            This is just theft.

            Comment


              #7
              I wonder what ex prime minister Paul Martin, who is probably the liberals largest financial contributor thinks of this deal. Have the liberals even commented on this deal, I have not heard anything?

              Comment


                #8
                CSL and Algoma shipping are linked as partners already.

                Martin is waiting to buy these ships for nickels on the dollar when the cwb realizes they made a mistake.

                Or maybe Martin through goodale/measner are still calling the shots.

                The deal stinks.

                And if you look at CSL vessels, the cwb ships are smaller than those currently operating by martin's company.

                Comment


                  #9
                  There is a zero % chance of these ships
                  ever making money. First there will be
                  cost overruns and then the CWB boats will
                  nicely be sitting at the dock when they
                  find there is overcapacity. After all
                  they will be operated by the competition
                  that just bought boats of there own. The
                  addition of eight new lakers has got to
                  generate overcapacity and guess which ones
                  will be sitting first.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Q: How many provinces are under the control of the cwb?
                    A: Three

                    Q: Has the board ever made a decision or policy direction designed to benefit farmers west of Oyen.
                    A: No

                    Q: Why not?
                    A: They don't vote for us.

                    Q: But they still provide a lot of grain to the system?
                    A: Yes

                    Q: Are you worried that they will revolt against this system?
                    A: Not until they get rid of the closet liberals in government do we have to worry. The PCs have had our back for a long time.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      siverback

                      The PC's have had your backside for a long time and they continue to bend you over anytime they like and steal your wallet in the process!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Agreed.

                        I can only hope that someday we can elect some true conservatives who can agree that gov't needs to get the hell out of the way of commerce.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Silver and Bucket,

                          You must admit that this 'Ship' issue has brought a whole 'new' understanding of how far out of touch the CWB Directors are with real commercial reality.

                          Here are two inexcusable blunders... that prove chairman OBERG and president and ceo WHITE have been duped and sold a farce:

                          1. THEY know capital is not free. They are crazy to answer the first question from the selfish greedy CWB view of absolutely no respect for grain growers assets they are confiscating!

                          Inexcusable.

                          2. On the second question... by lowering the cost of shipping on the great lakes... where not one kernel of my wheat or barley is shipped... how on earth can my shipping costs be reduced... when I ship and pay to ship to the west coast?

                          T ishere cross subsidisation and I am being forced; against my knowledge... to pay for laker freight I do NOT know about... to pay costs to the CWB I do not owe... for grain I do not own... to be shipped to markets I will never supply with grain? Are our deductions for freight we pay on CWB grain a hoax?

                          It would cost way less... in the very near future... when the Panama Canal upgrades are complete... to ship to Africa and middle east by Panamax via the Pacific ports.

                          It is totally obvious this is meant to buy votes for the CWB 'single desk' in Manitoba.

                          This decision is like gold in the bank it goes directly AGAINST the Federal COurt ruling telling the CWB to stop funding the promotion of the 'single desk'.

                          CWB management is totally out to lunch. And now we have absolute irrefutable proof they do not care about the whole west half of the CWB 'designated area'.


                          Background questions that prove CWB negligent:

                          "Q. How are these ships being paid for?
                          A. The investment in these two vessels totals $65 million. This will be paid from general revenues over the course of four crop years. The purchase will not be financed over a longer period, meaning there is no borrowing and no interest charges.
                          Q. Is this purchase within the CWB's mandate?
                          A. Yes. The CWB's goal is to maximize farmer returns. Reducing transportation costs by investing in these ships can help achieve that goal. Every year, it costs farmers $70-75 million to move their grain through the Great Lakes. Through this investment, farmers share in the revenue and recoup part of these costs."

                          Comment


                            #14
                            So with 14 trips the boats might move 450,000 tonnes out of the 3.8 million the cwb says they are moving now.

                            How can the cwb save money by doing this?

                            Its like saying you can save freight by shipping to the local flour mill in saskatoon and still being charged to send it to the west or east coasts.

                            Nothing about this computes.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              NEXT TIME you boys/girls should vote!
                              Whinning and snivelling doesn't get it
                              done, never has, never will

                              Comment

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