Either way life will go on!

[PrairieSodBuster]

Francisco all I can say is you proved my point once again, ad nauseum, over and over again, forever and ever amen!!!

Maybe you can comprehend that things generally just don't come to a screeching halt there usually is a drawdown. You've been fighting this battle for a long time, is five months going to kill you. No it won't! What Allen Oberg is doing or might do is irrelavent as much as he is or will be.

It is also very obvious that you want to bait me once again, because you think it is such good sport. Really all it proves is you can be a jerk. Hey instead of calling me a socialist why not go all the way and call me a Commie...which will be very amusing, ironic and an oxymoron because then I'd be a Marxist Capitalist. I ask you don't you have anything better to do besides bitch away here looking to bait another poor little CWB Supporter real or imagined.

Finally is the Desmond Tutu quote the only one you have for us "fence sitters". First apartheid was way worse than anything you've had to endure under the CWB and the quotes context was in regards to apartheid where one race had dominion over another. Shame on you for even thinking your "plight" is similar. Furthermore Desmond Tutu for the most part is a man that looks for compromise, as did Nelson Mandela otherwise you would have a situation in South Africa similar to that in Zimbabwe with Robert Mugabe. Hmmmm is Allen Oberg Robert Mugabe...perhaps in intellect but not in oppression.

hey buddy I'm on vacation (Stampede Week and all) please feel free to spout I'm game! All those beans have me all fired up! Some might say you are full of them, as equally you are as full of yourself.

[PrairieSodBuster]

Francisco a further add on in regards to Robert Mugabe and Zimbabwe...this is what happens when an extreme occurs. There was no compromise, no attempt to heal past wounds, no desire to work together to find something that works for all, not like Nelson Mandela (supported by Desmond Tutu) did in South Africa Zimbabwe is considered a failed state. It's economy has collapsed. All the white farmers lost their farms and were chased out of the country or killed. An extreme, kind of like "either you are with us or against us" that you always demand.

For most of my life I belonged to co-operatives such as the Alberta Wheat Pool, UFA and when they were around Co-op Implements (great idea, okay equipment...but management sucked). They were built on the idea of working together, combining resources, co-operation and
everyone gaining a benefit. If that makes me a socialist you bet guilty as charged.

I like to think I am community minded. What killed them is an apathetic membership who only cared about their patronage cheques, boards that were more interested in being pampered and playing golf and management that was only interested in building empires and compensation equivilent to the rest of the industry.

The CWB could and should have been built into something that still kept the benefits it did have, but have more farmer control with less bureaucrats warming seats and more go getters going out and getting deals and selling our grain for us, not for the government, not for a political party's agenda or the grain handlers wetdream, but for us. Something we create not just a copy of someone elses idea. Because of the extremes on both sides this will never have the opportunity of happening.

There will be fall out, and there will be opportunities just as there was when the Crow was dropped. The CWB isn't the real issue...it is consolidation of farms and maybe the CWB slowed this a bit (maybe not, I'm spitballing now). I would say anyone who has less than 10,000 acres won't be around in five years. However it is inevitable as it is with any commodity based business. I would prefer that we all work together and co-operate, but we don't have too, I have no problem being equally cutthroat if it means the survival of my business as I suspect all of us are now or will be. Just keep in mind that if it gets brutal there are some of you on either side of the issue who won't be here arguing in a few years or you might be here shaking your fist as you are on your way out of the industry. Lets just see what happens in five or ten years...nothing is ever as cut and dried as we imagine it will be. There will be winners and there will be losers from both sides of the issue...life will go on.

So you can call me all the names you want, you can say I'm weak because I don't adopt your point of view. But don't ever underestimate me because I do understand what is going on and what the outcomes could be and I have my plans made for any eventuality. Instead of wasting time shaking your fist at a dying enemy, you might just want to be doing the same.

[Fransisco]

"Hey instead of calling me a socialist why not go all the way and call me a Commie...which will be very amusing,"

Read the thread again, from the top, slowly and carefully. I never called you a socialist. I called Wilagro a socialist. Are you blowing a gasket because you're really Wilagro?

And you really don't understand my position if you characterize it as an "either you are with us or against us" Robert Mugabe kind of stand.

I want to be able to be able to sell my grain to whomever I want. If everyone else wants to sell their grain to the wheat board I don't have a problem with it as long as its not compulsory. That's why I have always maintained that it should be voluntary.

You can't get more compromising or accommodating than that. But for you PSB somehow that is just far to "extreme". You're sounding less and less like a fence sitting, middle of the roader and more like an extremist yourself, the more you ramble on.

[PrairieSodBuster]

Francisco I note that you love to cut and paste, maybe put the whole sentence in.

So Wilagro is a socialist but I'm not (no I'm not Wilagro) I was a fence sitter but now I'm not. Maybe you should look at your own position and see if it is moving too. We can use the CWB if we want...well no it will soon be gone so I guess we can't.

Truly all I want is for both extremes to shut-up, its over, the winners and losers have been decided and there is nothing that Allen Oberg can do about that. His plebiscite will be meaningless, yes it is a waste of money, but I suspect it is CWB Supporter money more than yours as I assume you don't "do board grain". If it is (your money) there is always a legal option that you could pursue. Have your day in court like normal people.

Lets move on to something else. Truly I'm sick of hearing both the Pro and the Anti guys bitching for the last 20 years and I suspect so is the government. But you just won't be happy! You won!!! YOU WON!!! enjoy it already.

[Fransisco]

The legislation has yet to pass.

And if all goes well I expect it should by next christmas. But until then the mono's are going to be kicking and screaming their collective heads off trying to keep it from happening. If you think people are just going to sit back and let them have the floor all to themselves without challenging their silly arguments you're barking up the wrong tree.

[Fransisco]

PSB, "We can use the CWB if we want...well no it will soon be gone so I guess we can't."

The only thing that will be gone is the single desk which didn't contribute a nickels worth of value back to rank and file farmers. If you want to market your grain, collectively, cooperatively, together with others or however you want to put it that option is still there. But you actually have to want to do it, and do it. People have to quite sulking about the "monopoly" and realize they can still work together but its up to them to do it not someone else.

[Fransisco]

Now let me get back to the Desmond Tutu quote that got you all bent out of shape.

The quote was about injustice.

It was a statement of general principle and it is as valid on smaller injustices as it is on larger ones. Stealing $100 from someone is worse than stealing $10 but at the end of the day its still stealing and its still an injustice.

No, I don't think the injustice done to western farmers is equivalent to Apartheid in South Africa. You are the one who made that leap. The fact that other people around the world face, or have faced, worse injustices does not erase the wheat board one. This thing costs me tens of thousands of dollars every year(I'm being conservative here)and I'm sick and tired of people trying to tell me its really no big deal that your wheat is not really your wheat. Well it is a big deal, to me, and to thousands of other farmers.

You want us to shut up? Well we will when this is finally over. The end is in sight, but its not over yet.

[Fransisco]

Here's another quote for you PSB, this ones from Ayn Rand's novel Anthem...

<blockquote>The word "We" is as lime poured over men, which sets and hardens to stone, and crushes all beneath it, and that which is white and that which is black are lost equally in the grey of it. It is the word by which the depraved steal the virtue of the good, by which the weak steal the might of the strong, by which the fools steal the wisdom of the sages.</blockquote>

[Braveheart]

Fransisco, you said, "the end is in sight but it's over yet." That's right. And important to note. When you're in a fight or a competitive sport it's important to finish it. Finish it fast. It's not over til it's over. Not a cliche. The truth.

[BTOfarmallll]

PrarieSodGrower, Like F*ck its cheaper to build new containers. Tell us all here why then is China buying all the scrap in sight, then shipping back to China???? Half ton loads to Super B loads, don't matter we want itall!!!!! Theys takin the last of Thee old good steel, once shes melted down, GONE. I know fer A fact theys shippin empty containers back, Piece of Piss shipping anything to everything via Ship, Cost is almost nothing........