Please tell me - what is so bloody sacred about the CWB?

[AdamSmith]

Chaff seems to be having a little trouble getting cwb friends to respond to the following simple question.

***Please tell me - what is so bloody sacred about the CWB that you can't see its shortcomings?***

This thread is intended for CWB SUPPORTERS ONLY to respond to. I'm sure chaffmeister isn't the only one who wonders if they even have a well thought out and meaningful answer.

So if The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (Burbert, BennyHin, Wilagro and Agstar) can't answer, call someone who can.

Zero replies speaks volums as well.

[Fransisco]

Lets not forget the new guy on the block. I'd like to hear tower's answer to this as well.

[SASKFARMER3]

I for one am getting sick of the Four horse men but if someone who supports the CWB could enlighten me on the differences between the US price I have posted and the CWB price go ahead i am listening.

[wilagro]

Sorry, but I don't dance to your tune. I don't need to answer/argue as I am confident in my choice of marketer.

Sacred...hardly.

A reverse question...what is so darned sacred about the big multi-nationals (primarily American), who dominate the grain trade and set (and fix) prices?

[Incognito]

You want proof - you cant handle the proof...

A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven.
Jean Chretien


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aX6XMIldkRU

[AdamSmith]

Willy I shouldn't be suprised by your response, it is childish and evasive.

"I don't need to answer/argue as I am confident in my choice of marketer."

Good for you for being confident, but please don't delude yourself that you have any choice in the matter. I suppose you have a choice in supporting the cwb or not, but you, like me, have zero choice in dealing with the cwb. Providing you actually still grow wheat and barley that is.

And of course you don't have to defend your choice to us skeptics, but you must realize that that only leads us to the solid conclusion that what ever it is that leads you to have confidence in the cwb is neither tangible, verifiable nor easily defendable.

[wilagro]

AdamSmith: I really don't care what conclusions you reach. I'm not competing in a bloody popularity contest.

I'll not be bullied either, so pick on another potential victim.

[AdamSmith]

"I'm not competing in a bloody popularity contest."

No, you're just advocating forcing your choices and beliefs down other peoples throats and you don't have the courage to stand up and defend that position.

"I'll not be bullied either, so pick on another potential victim."

So now you're the victim and I'm a bully???

Because I protest your prefered choice of ramming YOUR beliefs down MY throat!

Wow!

[highwayman]

Wilagro
Its fine if you believe so whole heartedly in the CWB and their price pooling system. You have that right and I am willing to acknowledge that. But please tell me why you and your board supporter freinds need to enslave the rest of us that want our own freedoms to market to whom ever we choose to. You talk about "choice of marketer", what choice!! We have all been shackled without choice in the designated area since 1943. If you wish to ignore all the market comparisons and price data presented to you that clearly shows the CWB does not extract a premium,that is your CHOICE but please dont ask the rest of us to do the same. I once upon a time through the 70's thought that the CWB was doing the job that I needed from a marketer but as I educated myself and as my farm grew I realized that it was not maximizing the returns that I needed to stay viable. All any of us are asking is that you and your board supporting freinds respect the individual rights of your fellow producers whoe are willing to do the same for you. If you choose to give your grain away and take an averaged price, fine, but maybe the rest of us want something better. Give us the same respect.

[chaffmeister]

Wilagro – no one is trying to make you dance – just asking you to openly discuss the merits of the CWB as you see them. You criticize those you think are attacking you, yet when given the opportunity to plainly and clearly explain your support of the CWB in real terms, you balk. No – you don’t balk – you reject out of hand the opportunity. This tells me you would rather just spar with open marketers than explore our differences in the spirit of understanding each other's position. And you, as one that complains about the divisiveness of this whole debate, has a moral obligation (in my mind) to diminish that divisiveness – or else admit that you are contributing to it.

You are no doubt confident in your “choice of marketer”. That’s great. But the question is why? You see, I see that there are some real shortcomings at the CWB – that can be described in real dollar terms. And since I assume you are a profit-maximizer, when it's shown that the CWB is leaving a lot of your money on the table, I just assume you would sit up and take note - but you don't; you don't even react.

It appears that you either refuse to accept the information that’s being presented - or you have some other facts that convince you that the CWB is bringing good fiscal value – even though other facts point to the CWB’s poor performance for farmers.

So my question, what is it? What do you know about the CWB that allows you to rationally disregard actual facts and data that tells you that you’re losing money with the CWB and continue to support it?

Please don’t take this as some form of sparring – I sincerely want to understand what it is that you see and feel about the CWB.

[SASKFARMER3]

I to agree wilgro please explain in a open discussion why the CWB is their for you. If they are you should be as passionate as I am about getting the wheat board. I give examples of what other farmers in South are getting and what farmers in Ontario etc are getting. Show me how the CWB works for you. Here is your chance. Then if its reasonable I can judge it like you judge the rest of us.
Simply I would like a world where I could do as I like and You could have your CWB to help you.

[SASKFARMER3]

Here is why I dont want the CWB.
Going with a relative today to Bottineau Farmers Elevator since we are not going to harvest because of rain and sleet went for a drive. Here is what he is getting for #2 Durum from Farmers Elevator not the CWB.
Delivery Date Basis Month Basis Cash Price
Sep 30, 2007 NONE 0.00

Settlement price $9.20 a Bushel.

1256 Bushels x $9.20 = $11,555.20 US

Now me the Canadian farmer delivering to Cargil or VIAGRA

1256 x 2.97 (PRO is $8.49 - 1,50 freight = 6.99)= $3,730.00 now I have to wait for $5,049.00.
$8,779.00 total to me from CWB fall of 08.
Difference for people with IQ like Benny $2776.00 less thanks to CWB.
Now take US dollar and add $401.00 for that difference I am out $3,177.00
Also took a sample of My #2 in Canada the guys looked at it and figured it would grade a #1 and its 15.6 protein.
Now My reletive feels the 9.20 is excellent for him for cash flow so he is selling all his production.
1000 acres at 47 bus = 47000 bushels x 9.20 = $432,400.00 check is going in the bank next week
Canadian way on my farm have to deliver what CWB is calling
25%
11750 bushels x 2.98$ = $35,015.00 now and wait and wait and wait till fall of 08 for the rest have to take out cash advance to cover bills etc.

[wilagro]

SASKFARMER3: The pooling takes time in order for calculations to be finalized. What could be plainer than that.

If you don't like "pooling", then work towards eliminating it. Tell your CWB directors that you want it stopped. If you get enough support, I am sure they will kill it.

[BennyHin]

Saskfarmer3:

Since you like to measure a pool return (or fixed basis price for that matter) to a conveniently hand-picked US spot price, why don't you instead provide us with a real-time marketing plan for this year so that all of us can measure your extraordinary ability to beat a pool return every time.

For example:

Lets assume that you can deliver these fictitious tonnes to a US elevator without ND and MT farmers shooting out your tires.

Lets also assume you have 1000 tonnes of #1 13.0 durum, and 1000 tonnes of #1-13.0 red spring to sell.

Now whenever you make a theoretical sale between today and July 31/08, you have to post your selling price on this website on that day.

I'll even give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you would not have pre-sold anything this spring / summer at much lower values, in a "free-market" environment. This is a big gift to you.

Also remember to subtract trucking costs and or corrections for rail freight differences for shipping to the pacific north west using US rail, versus cwb deductions from your shipping point (please remember to include trucking premiums to Canadian elevators).

Then on July 31, we will compare your averaged selling price to the pooled returns.

Thanks,
BH

[wilagro]

As for the rest of you...

"So if The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (Burbert, BennyHin, Wilagro and Agstar) can't answer, call someone who can."

Better start calling the CWB for answers...not too much discussion except for the antis piping in ONE AFTER ANOTHER AFTER ANOTHER...not much point explaining as you wouldn't believe anything anyway. For six years I have been reading this forum and I see no end or resolution to the questions you keep asking. WE "four or five horsemen of the apocalypse" as you state, are not the CWB. Send your questions to THEM.