"evil corporations"??????

[northfarmer]

just had to start a new thread, this one is buried down the page and want to share the "savemycwb" fringe perspective....


Tower:
"You think the evil corporations would be giving you Ontario prices for your grain? Good for you.

Even were it true, or were it false that the vast majority of farmers want the board around, It does not justify the betrayal of democracy by a politician like Ritz."

Betrayal of democracy?????get off the crack!!!

I am pretty sure those evil corporations across the border or to the east of the DA would gladly take the cwrs wheat from our bins and pay us handsomely for it.

But Tower, those evil corporate interests have no problem paying $13 dollars for my canola, $10 for my peas, $3.20 for my pony oats. We delivered them all last week, money is the bank.

You belong in Cuba, or better yet with Chavez. They seem to beleive more in your form of "dmocracy"!!!!

We had a federal election run on a plaform for marketing choice, how many opposition mps from the DA?

Harper will get his election soon, or expose the opposition for the hyprocrites they are.

Bring DA farmers freedom now, do not stop at barley, take wheat out at the same time!!!!!!!!

[TOM4CWB]

Northernfarmer, good thoughts
the big bad multinationals are bidding against one another for acres to get the crops they need seeded - sounds like competition!. Each one has diversified to move them out of the cyclical swings of dealing with straight commodities. By doing this, they can weather the cycles of higher prices. Sounds like good fiscal management to me.
We all know that if we produce to much the prices naturally go down, even then the CWB can't garner enough of a premium if the world has a production excess.
Yet we are new fast pace times, where volatility seems to be the norm. Where markets rally fast, then can crash just as fast. One where the discipline marketing of the CWB doesn't work. Nor as producers can we hit the mark 100% to price our crops. We are though, the best judge of what is best for our individual farm businesses, and take those risks accordingly to our level of comfort.
The big bad multinationals are a business, one that can either **** or reward their suppliers, Competition does that. It's how you play the game as to if you get ****d or rewarded.
I choose to take those possible rewards.
Erik

[northfarmer]

With the exception of a very few (cargill for example is family held to my knowledge), most of the so called "evil corporations" that operate in the ag industry are owned by a broad cross section of the public both here in Canada and abroad.

Undoubteldy some of these investors are even farmers. And who would regret buying Agrium, Mosiac, Deere and Monsanto a year ago?

What do they expect as shareholders? A fair return on their investment, increases in share value, maybe even capital gains when they sell?

It is shareholders that control these "evil" corporations. Those evil teachers and union pension funds, those families planning and investing for their own retirement.

So, Tower, by your deinition the investing public is evil, and that would leave the only ones that are not evil being those that do not invest in these evil corporations.

Typical fear mongering logic of the libbers and dippers and the rest on the left wing fringe. They would take care of it all for us, us "evil" people.

The trouble will the well worn capitalistic conspiracy theory model of fear mongering in todays realm of primary agriculture is that those that can become fearfull from these type of absurd claims are fewer and fewer.

[chaffmeister]

Buyers competing for acres. What a concept.

Let's compare:
How much has the CWB single desk been able to push new crop prices higher? Anyone know? Didn't think so.

Now, how much has competition for acres pushed new crop prices higher? Still a tough question but I think it's pretty clear that competition is much more powerful than the single desk in terms of getting good prices.

Now here's something to think about when you're trying to answer the first question about the CWB pushing prices higher.

When the CWB is not showing new crop prices, they're not in the game. I've been told many times that many farmers aren't looking at malt barley because the price signals aren't there. Which means that they are going into other crops. If there were very attractive, competitive prices for malt barley out there, it stands to reason that there would be acres going into malt barley, and less going into the others. Now, here's the question:

What effect would that have had on the price of other crops?

I'll give you a hint.

Low interest in malt barley = greater interest in other crops = more acres of other crops = less need for high prices to get those acres.

The flipside is:

More interest in malt barley = less interest in other crops = fewer acres of other crops = higher prices in other crops to get the acres.

[agstar77]

There was a blurb recently from American maltsters , worrying about malt barley acres in the U.S. because of some of the low contract prices that had been offered last year. They add no one had failed to fulfill their contract. Yeah, they will have to compete.

[parsley]

Here are the top 25 corporations in Camada in 2004.

Not one of them has CAPTIVE raw materials.

Some of you want to get rid of them. You do not condone them, or support them. You would be glad if, like Chavez did, they become state run.

The Canadian Wheat Board is listed amongst them.


This negative thinking, that does not support business, is absent from reason.


TOP 25:

RBC Financial Group Financial Services Research in Motion Limited
WestJet Airlines Ltd.
BCE Inc. CommunicationsThe Bank of Nova Scotia Financial Services Manulife Financial Corporation Fnancial Services
BMO Financial Group Financial Services Power Corporation of Canada Financial Services
Loblaw Companies Limited Retail
Canadian Imperial Bank of Financial Services
TD Bank Financial Group Financial Services
EnCana Corporation Energy
Suncor Energy Inc. Energy
The Jean Coutu Group (PJC) Inc.
Petro-Canada Energy
Bombardier Inc.
IBM Canada Ltd. Electronics
Four Seasons Hotels Inc. Hospitality
Imperial Oil Limited Energy
Canadian Tire Corporation Limited
Microsoft Canada Inc.
Dofasco Inc.
TELUS Corporation Communications
Magna International Inc.
Wal-Mart Canada Corp.
Dell Canada Inc.

Think about what would happen to Canada if they closed their doors on Monday morning.

Parsley

[parsley]

Look again.

Nope, not there.

THE CANADIAN WHEAT BOARD IS NOT LISTED AMONG THE 25 top corporations in Canada.

So much for being among the best.


Parsley

[parsley]

Agstar77
I asked RARH that question when they spoke to the WCWGA convention in Minneapolis.
I asked, due to the rapid rise in malt barley prices did some of there contracted producers try to break their contracts?
The answer back was no, they have worked hard to build a strong business relationship with their producers - one that can reward them later.
One has to remember a contract is a contract, you can off set the risks of price increases by other means.
The price RARH was offering its US producers back three weeks now was over $7.00 with an act of God clause built in.
Erik

[agstar77]

You are right a contract is a contract. Now they are being forced to pay up to guarantee supplies. I see nothing wrong with a contracting system for malt here, similar to Warburton's.

[tower]

Evil? Evil Corporations, it does have a ring to it doesn't it? If you look at the thread you'll see that it was Fransisco who used the term. I was replying to his argument. Which was a comment on my monologue about Ritz and his use of backstabbing tactics to circumvent the law and democratic rule.

I don't think that all the corporations are evil, although some of them may be. I think that they and their shareholders are misinformed about the nature of economics, and greedy, and the closest thing we have to central planning in our economy.

[northfarmer]

that corporate enterprises are the closest thing we have to centrally planned economic activity?

based on these statements you should keep your ideas to yourself when it comes to commenting on economics

do not know frisco, but have read enough from him to know his context if he used the term was far different from yours....

as for Ritz circumventing democarcy, I do think he is the Federal Minister in charge oif the CWB, his party leader is the Prime Minister of Canada, and he is acting on the platform of which his party was elected, the plebicite results of last year also support his moves.....

[Jay-mo]

Evil corporations don't know economics and are greedy???
The reason alot of people talk smack about big businesses using names like "evil corporation", "big money" or "big oil" is this. They are envious, the jealousy of others enjoying success and money drives them to hatred and the rationalization that they are all evil and breaking the law.
I hear it even between farmers, where a fella I know with a fairly unsuccessful farming operation talks to me about how the successful neighbor across the road must be "farming the government" and cheating on his taxes.
Most of those "evil corporations" started with one or two people, some business smarts and alot of hard work, made money, expanded and created a pile of jobs.

[TOM4CWB]

Tower,


What is this?

"...my monologue about Ritz and his use of backstabbing tactics to circumvent the law and democratic rule."

Please explain how Minister Ritz broke the law, and circumvented democratic rule.

Exactly what kind of 'Democracy' do you advocate?

[tower]

Northfarmer I said the closest thing to central planning we have in our economy. There is a difference. I wouldn't call what a lot of those corporations do economic activity. I believe it is very un-economic activity, and until there is recognition in the way they behave towards environmental, social, and economic sustainability I think we should stay as far out of their clutches as we can.

Jay-mo I hope that answers a few of your concerns as well. You are quite right, all of them did start out small, and have through hard work, and over time, research and development, consumer studies, service, lobbying, and eventually social irresponsibility towards the environment, labour, democracy, the law, and economic development they have achieved their present status. Am I envious? no. Perhaps I feel a small amount of pity for the people involved in them now.

Tom, this is the thread that I was commenting on. Perhaps if you go back and try reading it this time you will understand the comments I made.

As to the kind of democracy I support I guess it would have to be one where the majority has the rule, kind of like the one we live in now. I understand that it is really tough to bear when the majority rule is against your specific interest. I do. However the alternative is going to be worse.

My marketing philosophy could best be summed up as the Gordon Lightfoot school of keeping your eyes open.

Never hit seventeen when you're playin against the dealer for you know the odds won't ride with you. Never leave your woman alone when your friends are out to steal her. Years are gambled and lost like summer wages.

https://www.agriville.com/cgi-bin/forums/viewThread.cgi?1202419038

[parsley]

tower,

The people/corporations/companies/partnerships are supposed to hopefullt create wealth. Farmers sure do.

The Government job is supposedly to regulate that wealth.

In the case of the CWB, THEY want to ALSO be the player/the kingmaker.

They want to have all the wheat and barley wealth at their disposal, to toy with as they see fit.

The CWB does not want to be just a regulator. The CWB ALSO wants to be the SOLE PLAYER.

That is not democracy.

Democracy? You wouldn,t recognize it if you fell over it.

Parsley