Protein Question ?

[LWeber]

http://gfo.ca/Marketing/WheatMarketing/Proteinpremiums.aspx

[poorboy]

In answer to the original question, I have only gotten a very small protein payment for above 13.5, but have only been deducted a small amount for protein below 13.5 also.

On comparing to the CWB pool offering on your protein comparison, you must remember that it is a pool. The CWB offered their best guess on the initials, but has the ability correct the protein payments in the interim and final payments. Possibly the CWB has a few select buyers from over the years that are willing to pay a slight premium for protein. Only time will tell.

We may find out that the CWB has been moving us to growing high protein hard red wheat and the world actually wants #2 cwrs 12.0 protein. Think there is going to be lots of learning for everyone over the next few years.

[wd9]

I forget the stat, but most of the flour
milled in Canada is made from #3 wheat.
With the CWB in the picture we have been
so isolated from our real customer its
scary. Hobbyfmr did a great job of
explaining how and why, but got kicked
in the balls for it.

In answer to your question, there is
little to no premium for protein this
year. The CWB won't be getting it
either, they just don't have to be
honest. Also explained above.

[charliep]

You can look at CWB Deferred Delivery Contracts and Pool Return Outlooks. Limited to no protein premiums and tighter than normal lower protein spreads.

On domestic mills, they buy basis specification starting with falling number and protein. There are also issues like flour yield. Example the flour yield on a frosted 3CWRS wheat with down grading factor kernel plumpness that a nice 1 or 2 CWRS even though other quality characturistics may not be that different or still within the specifications of the flour mill/baker customers. A 3CWRS will also likely have other characturistics like flecking (more of the hull retained in the flour) which require more bleaching or other processes to produce the nice white flour customers want.

Perhaps the challenge is in the new world is knowing what customers want, what they are willing to pay for something that meets their needs exactly and finally how you are going to change your marketing processes to put the package together. The more middlemen in between you and a processor, the more muted this process is.

[farmaholic]

Ok, if you know what you have it should
be fairly straight forward.
Secondly, if you see a price you like
during the growing season(with the crop
still in the field) and want to lock it
in has anyone signed a contract with
grade and protein spreads written into
the contract? Why is it I have to
commit to a base grade and protein
without any guarantee of what the price
will be if it doesn't meet those specs?
Yet, the contracting company can have
the clause (if it doesn't meet
specs)..."to be determined at time of
delivery". We let it happen. But if
they aren't willing to take a RISK they
simply pass it on to us. TAKE A CHANCE
BUYER, like I do growing it, make a
****ing commitment!!
Does anyone wonder why I don't like
giving up what little power we do have.
What a lopsided deal!!!

[wmoebis]

Are we headed toward a system where we will sell wheat for one price?

#3 cwrs (cwad) etc. 12.5 pro or BETTER.

[agchat]

wd9
I am sorry but I am going to be persistent
here. You, by now would have had a rack full
of fines if you were on the stand in court. The
question is did you grow any CWRS and sell
any with a protein premium since August ? YES
OR NO ? Do not get me wrong everyone, but
this was the question of the post. I did not
mean to come down so hard on hobby, and I
do appreciate the thoughts on why or how we
are not getting protein. I simply was trying to
see if anyone was getting a bit of a premium.

[charliep]

So what happens differently? Standardized contracts the same across all companies? Private driven or government regulated? Protein spreads do vary year to year based on crop quality as do basis levels (cash price relationship with futures). What tools are there for all members of the supply chain to mitigate this risk?

An interesting comment from the US is farmers contract corn and soybeans with more generic specifications prior to harvest but not spring wheat (at least until it is in the bin and quality/discount schedules are known). Another solution for some managers may be more CPS wheat - a more standardized product where there are less quality unknowns prior to harvest.

[charliep]

agchat,

Not trying to get yelled at but a couple of questions.

Were you aware ahead of the delivery that you had 14 protein? Could be sampling processes or prior deliveries.

Did you communicate this to Viterra? Not likely to pay premiums for higher protein if their elevator is plugged with 13.5 protein that meets their shipping specifications already with no blending. It would be a different conversation/pricing is they had a shipping program for 13.5 protein and the wheat in their bins is 13 protein.

[Burbert]

SO NOW IT BEGINS! The fleecing and *** of
Comedian framers by the multies. Nough of
good prices, they are seduced. Let the
clusterfk begin, wink wink smile while yer
doin them. They (framers) thought they
had us by the bag, well inn fact now wes
gotem by the gag bag and kin do what wes
whats ta them gag boys/girls. Wayta go
open market!!!!!!!!

[charliep]

Perhaps you are right Burbert. I can only remember back to fixed price contracts and spreads based on payments at time of delivery (not market based) or waiting to the end of the year to know the final results. Spent to much time answering questions from farmers as to why their fixed price contract values changed after an adjustment payment.

I note you always have a smile and wonder why.

[TOM4CWB]

Agchat

We have been paid a premium above 13.5... and not
been paid a premium.... both the fall of 2012. Cargill
was better with Protein... harder on grades... Vittera
good on grades and blending... SOME contracts NO
premium above 13.5. With Viterra the 14px blended
with the 13px gave an average blend that we were paid
for of 13.5px.

I do not see much difference in our marketers from
past... integrity in both contracts and execution of
these contracts. Volitility is higher... because we were
not being pooled... but overall we were treated very
fairly in 2012... as we have been in years past.

Cheers!

Happy New Year!!!

[Choice2U]

I signed contract in july 2012 based on #2 12.0%, delivered #1, 14.2% got paid $0.40 over contract quality. Calculated that as $0.10 for difference between a #1 and #2 and $0.30 for difference in protein up to 13.5% in which they said they were not paying any further protein premium.

[Burbert]

Sue the frs! Ifin ya win, they'll never
deal wit ya agin though. Hee, hee, hee.
Multis now weidalotta power, scarin
framers from coast to coast to coast.

[Oliver88]

At Viterra I signed a contract for #2, 12.5% for
$8.63. (At that time a #1, 13.5 was $9.23.)

I delivered #1, 14%. I was paid $8.96.

They could not supply information on grade or
protein spreads this July when contract was
signed. They mentioned the spread will be the
spread on day of delivery. Viterra did not pay for
premium over 13.5.