Question for Mustardman

[Guest]

I usually don't give a shit much about politics , but listening to you badmouth Grant Devine got me to thinking . It was interesting reading all the positive things he did for this province . a lot I had forgotten about . so just wondering can you list a few times the blakeney/romanow rule helped the sask. farmer or rural sask ? just curious ? I have nothing but respect and admiration for the man and really can't figure out a sask rural farmer could feel this way about him ? and as I said politics don't interest me much , not looking for more political haggling . just a serious question for you

[BTO_farmalll]

Looks Like Everyone has Me and You Blocked Already and are on The New Site!!!!!!! Guess its Just Me and You now Case!!!!!! Hey wanna Play Cards!!!!!!!

[mustardman]

Just to Refresh your memory on the Devine years. Grant Devine had many good qualities as Premier but Fiscal Responsiblity was not one of them.
As far as Romanow he got the books balanced albeit by lots of cuts and No Spending . But we WERE BANKRUPT

I find it ironic that some on here talk about all the Give aways that got the Liberals elected. If you Want to see give aways look at the 80's with the PC Government.
Devine, Grant (1944–)
Grant Devine, October 1989.
Regina Leader-Post

Grant Devine was born July 5, 1944, in Regina, and was raised on a farm that his grandfather had homesteaded near Lake Valley, not far from Moose Jaw. After high school he enrolled at the University of Saskatchewan, where he earned a BSc in Agriculture. He pursued post-graduate studies and completed a PhD in Agricultural Economics at Ohio State University in 1976. He joined the faculty of the University of Saskatchewan, where he taught Agricultural Marketing and Consumer Economics.

Devine was drawn to politics at a time when the fortunes of the Saskatchewan Progressive Conservative Party were rising. Dick Collver, who was elected leader in 1973, argued that the Liberals were a spent force provincially and that the only way to dislodge the NDP government was to build an anti-socialist coalition around the Conservatives. His brand of right-wing Populism appealed to voters. In the 1978 election, the PCs displaced the Liberals as the official opposition.

The election marked Grant Devine’s entry into electoral politics. He contested the constituency of Saskatoon Nutana and was soundly defeated. When Collver stepped down as leader, Devine put his name forward and cruised to victory at the November 1979 convention. He led the party into the provincial election called for April 26, 1982. It soon became evident that the NDP was vulnerable. Interest rates were at 18% and there was a feeling that Allan Blakeney’s eleven-year-old government was out of touch with the people. On the first day of the campaign, Devine announced that he would eliminate the provincial tax on gasoline. This was followed by a commitment to guarantee home mortgage rates at 13.25%. The Conservatives rolled to victory, winning 54.1% of the popular vote and 55 out of 64 seats in the Legislature.

One of the first actions of the new administration was to organize an “Open for Business” conference in October 1982 to advertise the fact that the “socialist” era was over, and private investment and free enterprise were welcome in Saskatchewan. As an incentive to the oil industry, the government introduced a three-year royalty holiday for new wells and reduced royalties for existing wells. Drilling increased markedly, but at the sacrifice of a lower royalty revenue share of the value of production. The expansion of Crown Corporations was curtailed, but there was no large-scale effort to sell them. A notable exception was the Land Bank, which the NDP had set up to facilitate the inter-generational transfer of land. Devine said the government should not be in the business of owning land, and he dismantled the Land Bank (see Agricultural Policy), replacing it with 8% loans to enable farmers to purchase their own land.

The government ran consecutive deficit budgets, accumulating a debt of over $1.5 billion its first four years in office. Sensing that he might lose the 1986 election, Devine opened the coffers, giving farmers production loans at 6% and homeowners $1,500 home-improvement matching grants. The strategy worked. Although he narrowly lost the popular vote to the NDP, Devine won a second term with 38 seats, against 25 for the NDP and one for the Liberals. In doing so, the PCs ran up a deficit of over $1.2 billion in 1986–87, a far cry from the deficit figure of $389 million that had been presented in the pre-election budget.

The fiscal crisis led to cutbacks in services, cancellation of programs, and firing of employees. The government launched a Privatization crusade, disposing of a wide array of Crown corporations from the $15 million SaskMinerals to the potash Corporation, valued at well over $1 billion. When the government broke its promise not to sell utilities and placed the natural gas division of SaskPower on the block, the NDP brought the Legislature to a halt by letting the bells ring for seventeen days. The public sided with the NDP, and the government backed down from the sale.

Although he pledged to get government out of business, Devine gave loans, subsidies, guarantees and other incentives to private business. The results were impressive: two Heavy Oil Upgraders, a fertilizer plant, a paper mill, a pulp mill, and a bacon-processing plant. The Rafferty-Alameda Dams were built as a public works megaproject. However, the government was never able to control the debt it had incurred in its first term. By the end of the 1980s it was running a surplus on operating expenses excluding debt charges, but interest payments drove the province deeper into debt each year. By 1991–92 the accumulated debt was over $15 billion, and annual interest payments exceeded $500 million, the third-largest item in the budget after health and Education.

On the national scene, Devine reversed the old rule of Saskatchewan politics: pick a fight with Ottawa at election time. He was a staunch supporter of Prime Minister Brian Mulroney and gave wholehearted support to Mulroney’s two main initiatives, the Meech Lake Accord and the Free Trade Agreement with the United States. Mulroney responded with deficiency payments to Saskatchewan farmers who were suffering Drought and record-low grain prices. Farmers were not the only beneficiaries: the billion-dollar assistance package announced days before the 1986 provincial election was a key element in Devine’s victory.

Devine sought to undo the legacy of CCF/NDP socialism in Saskatchewan and build a pro-business, entrepreneurial culture. His government carried out a massive privatization program, reduced Social Assistance payments, and curbed the power of Labour unions, but private enterprise continued to rely heavily on government financial assistance. The greatest failure of the Devine years was the accumulation of an unprecedented debt, much of it attributable to tax cuts and unwise election spending. The government lost power in 1991, winning only 10 seats and 25% of the popular vote. After the election, a scandal came to light, resulting in the conviction of several former Conservative MLAs on fraud charges. Despite setbacks, Devine remained an eternal optimist holding fast to his free enterprise principles and his belief in the potential of Saskatchewan. In 2004, Devine attempted a political comeback, but lost in his effort to win a seat in Parliament in the federal election of that year.

James M. Pitsula

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[mustardman]

I voted for Devine his first term and then began working for his gov't in dept of Ag.
I did not vote for him the next election as the writing was on the wall that we would be paying for these freebies and giveaways for years and years

[Hamloc]

A nice history on Devine but very little on the NDP. Fairly obvious Devine made a lot of mistakes in hindsight. If I read it correctly he accumulated 15 billion of debt over nine years, certainly the high interest rates and low oil prices of the period didn't help. One thing governments love to do is spend and they all do it until they are forced not to, many examples in Canadian past and present.

[Guest]

but , can you please just answer the question I asked you , mustard ?

[mustardman]

case if the NDP had not stopped Devine we would have had Sask Energy and probably Sask Power SOLD off to private hands. How Much Debt do you like Paying for??
Look West to see how expensive utilities are there under private hands.
A wise man once said "Dont ask what my country can do for me, ask what can I do for my country"
I don't Want a Government to DO THINGS for me. I am always more Afraid of Gov't that does things TO me (Harper ag policies of handing everything over to Corp)

[mustardman]

Romanow and Blakeney had balanced budgets. This means you and your children and your childrens children will not keep paying off debt forever.

Did we really need Guarantee home mortgages at 13.25 % when Bank rate was 18% ?? How many Billions did that cost us?
Did we all need Crops Wrote Off when they were Actually above the Minimum ??
Did we all need Hot tubs on the deck?? Paid for by the gov't
Did we need to give Oil Cos 3 years of Royalty free Drilling ?? (brought back by Ndp and Sask Party Still Using same Insane Formula)

Yes Devine accomplished some good Things but as Murray Mandryk said:"Devine was in an awful hurry to do a lot of things awfully fast, and we paid a huge financial price. I certainly think we'll be paying for this for the remainder of my lifetime."

[Hamloc]

So basically the NDP's biggest accomplishment was to balance the budget, not a NDP policy but one that was forced upon them by accumulated debt.

[RD414]

Lucky Grant came to power when he did. Unfortunately, he could not catch a break on any commodities'. Oil at 10 bucks, poor grain prices and dry, dry ,dry for most of the province for quite a few years. He could get hospitals built in rural Sask. cheaper than that ****ing asshole, sorry Tom, Romanow could tear them back down. I still absolutely despise that son of a bitch.
Grants livestock plan saved our cattle herd and, yes, we did need interest reduction.

[mustardman]

RD so your saying you voted PC so you could have socialist policies ??

[Guest]

what i really remember is that i was working and living in bc in the oil patch . when grant gave his speech he told us we could come home now . i did and been here ever since .

[Hamloc]

Mustard, one lesson to be learned, government attempts to diversify the economy only result in debt accumulation and decades of repayment for the mistakes. Ontario is a good example, Alberta will be the next. For some reason someone always thinks they are smarter than market forces, market forces always win. People who are elected to public office are our piers with no greater intelligence than the rest of us but for some reason we are willing to let them waste billions of our dollars, it really is insane.

[mustardman]

Hamloc don't forget the biggest subsidized industry in Canada and the world for that matter is
The Oil industry

490 billion worldwide

Why not Cut their subsidies and put that towards more sustainable sources??

[Hamloc]

Mustard, the majority of this subsidy is made up of uncollected taxes which at present don't exist such as carbon taxes and is really a theoretical number not an actual monetary subsidy to the production of oil. It is a number that enviro's love to throw around to justify the real money governments will have to come up with to make other forms of energy competitive. I am not against low carbon energy production, I simply believe the technology isn't as affordable, again this has been proven in Ontario as an example.