Global Warming

[vvalk]

grassfarmer. how ys that the CWB has never sold barley for more then Lethnridge cash barley. Feedlot alley was created by on open barley market. Where is the value? Wheat would be no different.

[vvalk]

grassfarmer. Explain, how is it, that the CWB has never sold barley for more then Lethnridge cash barley. Feedlot alley was created by on open barley market. Where is the value? Wheat would be no different.

[grassfarmer]

Yes, Perfecho your theory sounds plausible to me.

vvalk, You say feedlot alley was created by an open barley market. I think it is also generally accepted that feedlot alley's expansion has been based on low cost grain since the removal of the CROW. Since grain prices have risen considerably in the past year or so the economics of feeding grain in feedlot alley have taken a catastrophic turn financially. If, as some on here suggest, removing the CWB monopoly would
increase ex farm grain prices how can that do anything other than continue the turmoil in the livestock sector? Why then is the removal of the CWB monopoly stated as an aim of the new livestock strategy devised by the Alberta Government? It can only be because they know it will lead to more cheap feed grains in western Canada.

I should add I would be happy to see grain farmers net returns increase - it is long overdue. Grain price increases do not worry me greatly as I am a grass/ forage based producer who only uses around 2.5 tons of feed pellets per 100 animals per year.

[TOM4CWB]

Grassfarmer,

I note feeders as STILL getting cheap feed barley... long after the CROW was washed down the river of life.

Take one look at the 06-07 "B' Barley pool... with $110/t PORT PRICE @ Vancouver that was dumped into a market that was paying 50% more...

Wheat that the CWB grades feed ... worth $22/bu in Sweetgrass MT. in Feb 08... and the buyback at the time being over $200/t and #1 $500/t to keep our domestic prices DOWN...

Please explain how the Ontario Wheat Board/AWB... and cooperatives around the globe... keep on buying and selling grain... without a CWB 'single desk'... yet manage to provide value for their members and remain valued members in the supply chain!

This adds up to one conclusion... the CWB basis offered wheat and barley growers... proves one thing alone...

The CWB IS VERBAL 'Global Warming'... so VERY much hot air...

That is backed up by intimidation... fear... deceit... and greed.

I get something for nothing by stealing my fellow farmers grain and stopping them from earning a fair return for their labours!

HOW on earth can you defend the CWB 'single desk'... when you yourself KNOW it is HOT AIR?

[charliep]

grassfarmer

Will note you by passed most of questions including whether the current dual market should be gotten rid of and all barley sold through single including the domestic livestock industry. I note your grain pricing would be easier - just one phone to Winnipeg to speak to a cooperative CWB merchant. There would be no relationship between the price you pay the CWB for feed and the price the farmer/grain company gets paid that delivers grain to your feedlot. In fact, the farmer really doesn't get paid the full amount but only an initial payment and waits for the rest.

This should be an easy question for you to answer.

[charliep]

I will note again that CWB only represents 20 % of the feed barley market. The 20 % is important because of the malt industry and perhaps a good reason why farmers grow barley. To maintain let alone grow barley acres, the system has to improve pricing signals to farmers.

I also note you ignore the feedgrain center of excellence and go straight to the CWB issue.

[perfecho]

I recall during the drought we experienced about 4 yrs age, barley was making its way through the $3:00 barrier, when it had been trading for $2:00 the previous years. It was during that time frame, the AB government lowered restrictions on US corn. (Remember the "advantage" we had previous for "barley fed" animals.)
It was during that time, I decided for myself, that governments were not looking out for us, their interests lied elsewhere.
This, and the BSE reaction that proved AB gov and packer colusion, is why I am very cynical over their policies that are for "farmers interests'.

[charliep]

Just curious about what Alberta government policy you would be referring to. Fusarium/corn is the only one that comes to my mind. Policy over imports (and for that matter exports) is under the federal government's control.

[grassfarmer]

No offence Charlie but I don't intend getting in a debate with grain producers telling you what changes to make to the CWB. I am not a grain producer, I don't have the knowledge of the situation that some of you do. As a livestock producer who is largely unaffected by the price of grain my point in writing these replies was to get an answer to the apparent contradiction that occurs in the new AB government beef/livestock initiative. So far no-one has answered it. I'll try again:
"Marketing Choice - Pursue the removal of Canadian Wheat Board monopoly control over wheat and barley." Now if this program is about supporting the livestock industry in Canada and the CWB acts to keep grain prices low in western Canada as some claim shouldn't the AB government be campaigning to keep the CWB monopoly to help the livestock farmers? Or is it an admission that they know removing the CWB monopoly will in fact lower grain prices rather than raise them?

[jensend]

typical agriville - turn anything into a bash the cwb thread. lol.

[perfecho]

My memory is hazy, I will admit, but I do think it was the lowering of the fusarium standards....the Alberta Grain Commission was involved and I seem to recall a bit of feedback on how the fusarium could be a problem in coming years due to this lower standard. This was back in 2001-02, and heck, I'm not sure what all I did yesterday. I do recall though, the impact it had on my thinking of agriculture and the influences corporations had (have) on our governments in spite of how much they say they are trying to help the farming community.

[TOM4CWB]

Dear Grassfarmer;

"As a livestock producer who is largely unaffected by the price of grain..."

Perhaps you forget what is one huge cause of the prices of Calves/Feeders to increase and decrease?

A massive factor is.... GRAIN PRICES.

You are handing us some more 'Global Warming' Grassfarmer... GIVE ME A BREAK! ... which arm... RIGHT?

This post tells volumes grassfarmer...

Addicted to the CWB... you are... and pretending to be innocent!

Posting once again the 'PRO BONO' Responsibility of the CWB to maintain barley stocks for Cattle producers as presented by the Canadian Cattlemen's Association:

Mr. John Prentice of the CCA (Canadian Cattlemen's Association had just presented this statement, for the record... to the Senate CWB hearings in Edmonton on C4 in 1998:

"The present Canadian Wheat Board directors are appointed by the government to act pro bono in the public good. In effect this includes running a national feed grain policy through the maintenance of a minimum carry out of barley at the end of each crop year, and the figure is used of around 2 million tonnes. That is good in terms of looking after the domestic industry, the domestic users."

...

"In conclusion, Bill C-4 sets up a situation where the proposed Board would have the motive, the tools, and the opportunity to cause damage to the industries adding value to grain on the prairies. Remove the opportunity. Keep the Canadian Wheat Board and the open market system separate. The Canadian Cattleman's Association strongly recommends that the power to buy cash grain on the open market not be given to the Canadian Wheat Board."

AND TO THIS DAY... we have not seen fair cash pricing of Barley... from the CWB that arbitrages international Feed or Malt prices...
particularly when feed stocks are tight or high priced!

[TOM4CWB]

perfecho;

Please...

Your 'hazy' memory needs a quote to back up your point... lETS have the proof!

I get VERY suspicious... when anyone makes a claim backed up by a 'hazy' memory!

[grassfarmer]

Oh yes TOM of course high grain prices and the high dollar are the cause of all our problems. Well, no actually these are the reasons cited by our cattle organisations because that way they can say it is factors out with their control and there is nothing we can do about it.
I was looking yesterday at a different perspective on this - accurate historical data collected on cattle prices, grain prices and the $ exchange rate going back to the 1930s and adjusted for inflation. It appears 1974 was a real interesting year with the Cdn dollar at $1.04 US, feed barley at close to $9 yet the price of cattle was around $125-130. Cattle prices certainly slumped into 1975 for a couple of years but were never below $120 adjusted for inflation - how do you explain that?

You say I am addicted to the CWB implying that I have a vested interest in keeping grain prices low - I don't as I've said the price of grain affects me very little as I don't use much and as shown above higher grain prices are not the driving factor of low cattle prices.

This is still all irrelevant to the question I am asking - if the CWB acts to keep grain prices low on the prairies why does the Alberta Government seek to pursue the removal of the CWB monopoly as a means to assist the struggling livestock sector? If, as argued by those of you wishing rid of the CWB, the organisation holds down grain prices here shouldn't the Alberta Government omit removal of the CWB monopoly from their livestock recovery document?

[charliep]

I have realized you are a grassfarmer and this may be the alternative of the future. North America is one of the few regions that feeds animals grain and the future may say this happens less often.

To highlight my take on the recommendations and other policy focus, the livestock and grain industry need to work together to improve the profitability of feed grains relative to other crops. Alberta has traditionally been an importer of feedgrains from Saskatchewan. Since 2001, Alberta has imported US corn a significant amount of time. Corn yields are increasing a rapid rate and will continue to do so into the future. So from a competitiveness standpoint, does it make sense to import 1 tonne of feed north or export 800 lb of feeder south? If Alberta wants to stop that trend, what would be done differently? Does the CWB marketing policy policy contribute or take away from feedgrain competitiveness when farmers are making cropping decisions?

The fusarium policy was developed in 2002 under the Pest Act (hopefully I got the act right). As you indicate some would have liked more teeth but will note would have had to applied equally to US corn as it did to S.E. Saskatchewan and Manitoba grain. US corn that is imported today (and lots was this last winter) has to be tested for fusarium.