Need a independent Fert dealer with Balls!

[charliep]

Interesting comments from participants who have suggested over time with holding grain/oilseed inventory from the market as a mechanism to push for higher prices. That is the right of any business.

Also have to ask what rate of return farmers expect on their fertilizer dollars. Over time, the suggestion has been farmers quit applying fertilizer when the return is less than 2 to 1. $2 of increased crop revenue for every $1 of fertilizer investment. I realize a good part of the discussion is about being asked to make major decisions about inputs/costs when the actual sale price is unknown. that is, the ability to manage risk.

[malleefarmer]

sask how we started was each of the 180 farmers contibuted $1300 we leased a shed at a port,poached a ceo from another company stiched him up for 10 years, bought neccesary loaders and belt elevators wieghbriges etc and paid another loader driver and one secretary.
purchased best quality as cheap as we could sent farmers to the manufacturing plants,bangladesh for urea and mexico and later china for map and dap to check thing and inspect vessel loading got gov approval at our port shifted it to the warehouse then out to farmers.

first 2 years farmers had to preypay for fert but the impact was immediate all the big well established companies dropped there fert prices overnight.

and what happened well is sort of got to big for us to handle in the end and we ended up selling after 9 years and the original invbestors got about a 10 fold increase on there original investment.

which leads me to my point we are thinking of doing it all again but credit facitlies and ratings etc have all changed so we may have trouble financing it without some sort of corporate help which defeats the purpose of it in a way.

sorry for being so long winded

[railway]

That's very interesting mallee, That is kind of what FNA (Farmers of North America)is supposed to be doing. You pay a membership fee, they source and sell you product. I've never belonged to FNA, they are just like a co-op, and in the end, I'll pay my local independent retailer a little more, and keep the money in the community. (ever see a sign in your rink saying "Sponsored by FNA"?)

However, not to say I wouldn't be interested in a new start-up importing company as an investor. Sounds like a great idea, but somehow i don't think $1300 would do it.

[Hopperbin]

Saskfarmer maybe we could hire Malleefarmer. He is a get it done kind of guy, which is something we are lacking out here.

[agstar77]

We had pools in the fert business, all gone , farmer apathy, don't whine it's our own fault.

[poorboy]

Railway,

If FNA or any other fertilizer provider can get you cheaper the fertilizer and keep more money in your pocket, the money is staying locally. It is just in your pocket, not your local fertilizer owners.

If the product is that much cheaper, the rinks should not say paid for by FNA, but by "Railway". Problem in this case, is that FNA product, is no where as cheap as it should be for an oportunistic buying group.

[poorboy]

Can farmers import fertilizer from the US?

Last year there was lots of talk about cheaper fertilizer in the US and currently urea is 400-500 US$/Ton, which is much cheaper than locally.

Can farmers purchase fertilizer from US dealers and have it hauled into Canada, much like used machinery would be imported? Looks to me like Urea could be landed into my yard for about $600 cdn/tonne, and nobody locally is talking numbers that low.

[malleefarmer]

exactly 1300 initial investment would not do it today
fert was $probably $250 per tonne back then when we started

in current financial envoirnment would be hard to get off the ground

[malleefarmer]

money saved was a ball park figure of 25% in the first year and that saved money was spent in the community so its a fallacy that money doesnt stay local

[Hopperbin]

Railway an average farmer may be spending in the neighbourhood of 300,000 on fertilizer this year. Why would you worry about an investment of 1300 when in the order of 30,000 per farmer could be raised in an instant. That is only 10 percent of what fertilizer will or could cost this year. If it saves only 20 percent we double our investment in the first year. Much better than Mallee's return. Now say 180 farmers which is a huge operation would have 30,000 times 180 farmers to equal 5.4 million. Enough to pay any CEO, Weigh scales, labour, inspections, storage, mixing, etc. Should have money left over. That money could be kept for future use. If someone would come to my door with an offer I would be right in there like a dirty shirt. Purhaps Mallee is closer to port which makes things easier, farmers can then pick up their fert. themselves without the use of the railway Railway.

[malleefarmer]

hopper exactly port is at most 200 kms and yes farmers pick it up themsevles

[TOM4CWB]

Hopper,

A good chunk of our diesel is coming from the deep south... perhaps I will work on the same folks to get fertiliser in.

All it takes is one to break the stand off... and it is over!

Fuel/Independants dealers are often the folks that have the connections to make it go! Federated/UFA/Independants.


No one can tell me the fert sheds are as full as normal at the independants!

This is a stand off!

[Burbert]

Wow, Tom4 we really got them by the short and curlies now, YOU are going to change the system, by workin on them. Gosh I wonder how low fertiliser prices are going to go. With desenters on their case, they'll probably give us fertiliser by Spring. LOL's

[TOM4CWB]

Burbert,

Nothing ventured nothing gained.

My real ambition was to get as many folks as possible to pressure independents and co-operatives to get through the log jam.

Perhaps I should have worded what I said differently... sorry!

[railway]

I was not putting the idea of setting up an independent company down at all, in fact I quite support the idea, as I said I would likely be an investor. I just think that some people have the wrong idea about dealers, local and otherwise. They are not stupid people, they will charge whatever the market will bear, wether that is at a profit of 10% or 100%.

fna is no different, but they are not in my little town paying taxes with 4 or 5 employees eating at the cafe, buying gas at the gas station, putting little kids in the school or on the hockey team.

Granted I will not pay huge premiums for local service, but if we are talking about 5% savings, I'll keep it local.