What's Harper and co. afraid of?

[TOM4CWB]

You are strange.

Cheers!

[jdepape]

Prairie fire:
Some things to think about.

The average trucking premium on wheat is over
$6.00/tone.
The average net rate that grain companies pay
(with incentives) is just north of $ 6.00/tonne.

In other words, farmers pay on average about
the same as what grain companies are paying,
regardless of the single car rate being deducted
on your cash ticket. And being a supporter of the
CWB and pooling, I suspect you would be quite
satisfied with averaging things out like this.

As for producer cars and short lines....when
anyone talks about losing these, it is always on
the basis of "losing" the CWB and not just the
single desk. It seems to me that the CWB could
play an important role here by partnering up with
Mission Terminal and Churchill and whoever else
they want, and the CWB could continue to
support producer car loaders and branch lines.

If it's true - as some say - that producer cars are
dead without the CWB because the grain
companies don't want to deal in them, then it
would be an ideal place for the CWB.

It's up to Oberg and Co now. If I were A
producer car loader, I'd be calling Oberg or my
director and pressing them on this one.

[jdepape]

Correction...
The average net rate the grain companies pay is
just north of $6.00/tonne below the single car
rate.

Point is farmers are getting the majority of the
incentives for loading 50 and 100 car blocks.

[Braveheart]

It's obvious to me that Bruce Johnstone is little more than a political pawn.

Johnstone lists as his title,financial editor, yet fails to recognize the CWB issue is a business issue. He has fallen hook, line and sinker for the lefts' fear mongering tactics re producer cars.

This has tarnished his reputation as a journalist, if indeed Johnstone ever qualified. A journalist would have checked the Canada Grain Act to see what rules, since the Sintaluta case, apply to producer cars.

A serious journalist would have asked producer car loading site partners if it was a wise investment to sink thousands of dollars into an investment where your terminal, a terminal like Mission Terminals, can only operate with the CWB entrenched.

A serious journalist would have asked other terminal operators if they would accept producer cars from farmers.

It takes alot more than a measly producer car loading site to sustain a community. The curtain was going to come down on hundreds of communities when the rail system started rationalizing back in the 1960's. Most of them today are thriving today and some are in fact growing. Johnstone could have researched that instead of taking the word of some doom and gloom leftists.

Chuckchuck and Prairiefire seem to think that the words of Bruce Johnstone are somehow tablets of truth delivered from the mount. They are, however, little more than unresearched dribble from a lazy writer. Not a journalist.

[bucket]

Why do pro board people never answer questions?

Why do farmers that load producer cars not share or pool their savings with the rest of us?

ANYONE care to answer that?

Is it because they want the fruits of their labour for themselves?MMMMMMMMMM.

Interesting concept.

[silverback]

I don't know bucket, but God is it annoying.

They cannot answer because they have no answers. Just go on to the next inane comment and ignore reality, thought, facts, reason, etc...

[Prairiefire]

depape how are things at ICE ?

[jdepape]

Why ask me?
Are you like the guy who wrote into the Star
Pheonix saying I was a broker working for the
commodity exchange?

If so, just to get you current, I left the commodity
exchange in 1997. (I never worked for ICE).

How is this relevant to this thread?

No reply to my response to your questions?

[Prairiefire]

Depape so you do not work for ICE....do you have a permit book? how many acres your farm?
If you paid attention to my posts you will have noticed that I do not necesarily link producer cars with the CWB . However it has been my experience in loading producer cars that the existing grain co's are not supportive of farmers loading producer cars ,nor are the railroads . The trucking incentives are only paid to the fellows who haul to the grain co's facilities. Producer car loaders pay full freight with no trucking assistance paid to them.The initial svings in loading cars are the elevation charges which are north of $14.00 per tonne . As well if you are lucky enough to have a short line closeby or a siding on a branch line/main line where there have been producer cars loaded then you save on trucking costs to the distant elevator.Also note that where no car loads have occured the railco's have applied and received permission to remove sidings ,this has happened in the last few years . Turn around time on loading cars is 24 hrs or less. Producer cars are not for the faint of heart.
To my knowledge only one or two companies in western canada are supportive and encourage producer cars....the rest.....?

John if it wasn't for the CWB the producer cars would have left with the CROW Benefit . The CROW should have been considered an entitelment for the historical and actual benefits the railroads received from the Canadian public. As well the freight costs as I have described in one of my posts is entirely borne by the shipper ...us the farmer. How cute!This cost never is reflected in our net returns as a positive number.We pay full freight to get stuff out here then pay again to ship our production out to port.No kickback in this instance...not to us the farmer.
By the way who do you work for and what sort of stuff do you do ?

[Fransisco]

Funny how mono directors and CWB staff who collect big pay checks from the board never get accused of being on the take. Only those who work outside of the board get questioned about their motives. Which by the way are irrelevant to their arguments.

[Prairiefire]

Fran,what take? Is it legal to do ? The auditor general has done audits and found no improper use of funds or position. What info do you have to the contrary? Inquiring minds would need to know.

[jdepape]

Prairiefire:
You may not realize it but you gave one of the
reasons why producer cars and the CWB go
hand in hand.
Elevators charge elevations that are - as you put
- north of $14.00. The reason for that is the
CWB. Once the single desk is gone, there is no
reason to expect those elevations to remain.
Competition should drive elevations to something
like canola - much smaller than wheat.

Once that happens, the economics of loading
producer cars will likely suffer. I personally don't
think that is a problem. You were loading
producer cars to reduce your costs; if the market
is allowed to work properly, your costs are
reduced without needing to load cars.

Remember also - once the single desk is gone
you will see more than just the current stable of
companies vying for your business. Others will
arrive, some from the US, some from overseas,
and some local ones run by local entrepreneurs.
Not only will competition drive costs out,
somebody may even be able to build a business
case to handle producer cars.

[TOM4CWB]

John,

I agree on farmers loading their own rail cars.

The CWB has monopolised the farmer loading of rail cars... BECAUSE of the 'single desk'.

When/if the CWB becomes a voluntary business... then we can sell canola, peas, wheat, flax... any grain to the CWB.

If the CWB provides value...

then grain growers will be happy to ship them grain...

CWB surveys have proved this over and over.

I have no reason to doubt this...

we will be one of the first to load a railcar...
cleaned and ready for export...
of whatever grain the CWB will provide value and opportunity to market and build a BETTER value chain system for both growers and end users.

What are you so afraid of Prairiefire?

Has all the CWB bafflegab... been lies and deception? Can the CWB ONLY sell grain... at a 'discount' price... and growers know what that actually is?

If the Multinationals are SO GREEDY... there should be gobs of $$$ avaliable to the CWB and growers who choose to market with their own CWB value chain system!

[Prairiefire]

Depape on board grains the co's have to show the deductions on the non board they do not have to do this. So in fact what price are we getting for our grain?

John have you ever been a farmer ?

[Prairiefire]

John here is the link to the CGC doc on elevation http://www.grainscanada.gc.ca/statistics-statistiques/tariff-tarif/pp/primary11-05-20.pdf