BillBoyd posted Feb 19, 2014 21:11
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The Government of Saskatchewan is going to be
meeting with officials from both CN and CP rail.
We have heard there are grain cars sitting idle
across the province.
We need your help!
Would you please take pictures of cars that are
sitting idle in your area.
Also add:
Location and train run number
Length of time cars have been there.
Any other information you feel would be relevant.
Please send ASAP as we are meeting with CN
tomorrow morning in Montreal at 11am Est. and
CP on Friday morning.
Please forward to Bill.Boyd@gov.sk.ca
Thank you for your help.
Bill Boyd
Minister of the Economy
Province of Saskatchewan
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 21:34
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Would be glad to help but we don't have a
railroad in my town, but there is one at
Langbank. Anyone farmer online from Langbank?
parsley
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 21:35
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Nothing like pictures to make a point!
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mcfarms posted Feb 19, 2014 22:11
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Mr. Boyd
I hope they get you lots of pictures in the morning, thanks on behalf of I know many frustrated Alberta Producers for your efforts on this matter I'd like it more if our Alberta Ag minister was there with you but no one is quite sure who the Ag. Minister is in Alberta. ( I think his name is Claude Raines)
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caseman posted Feb 19, 2014 22:33
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bill boyd sure.....
its nice to ask for help what 24 hours before a meeting???????? sounds like a joke to me........
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caseman posted Feb 19, 2014 22:36
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bucket, what u think???
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 22:56
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I posted it on twitter and on my FB page. The
address is real. And so is the Minister. He isn't
much of a jokster, but he's dead serious about
the RR situation. I think most farmers are. Pars
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oneoff posted Feb 19, 2014 23:02
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Nothing like getting prepared a few minutes beore an "important" meeting.
That incompetence is no better than the railways failure to provide adequate service.
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fjlip posted Feb 19, 2014 23:17
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Yes Bill, October-December would have been a much better time. The horses have left the barn, and it's burning down as we have meetings behind closed doors and twiddle our thumbs over drinks in expensive hotels.
Dictate specific grain moving volumes or fine the hell out of them. Find out if those were 125 CP locomotives BNSF leased!
Jail the SOB IF that is true. We all await a press release.
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 23:20
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Quote
"Provincial delegation to seek solutions for grain
backlog
Will be talking to both grain and rail companies
about financial penalties, hiring more workers
and more
Reported by Aaron Stuckel
First Posted: Feb 12, 2014 3:44pm | Last
Updated: Feb 12, 2014 3:46pm
Change text size: -
The continued stall in grain shipments has the
provincial government forming a delegation that
will meet with both grain and rail companies to
find a solution.
Premier Brad Wall has appointed three cabinet
ministers to head the delegation. Agriculture
Minister Lyle Stewart, Economy Minister Bill Boyd
and Highways and Infrastructure Minister Don
McMorris have all been named to the delegation
along with Legislative Secretary for the
Agriculture Minister and MLA Scott Moe.
Clearing up the backlog in grain is a top priority
for the provincial government as farmers in
Saskatchewan continue to lose money as each
shipment misses its deadline. But Wall said it
also needs to be a priority for the federal
government because the country’s inability to get
grain to port puts the country’s reputation on the
line.
“It’s a huge issue for the country,” he said. “In a
world where the fastest growing economies want
food security and energy security, that’s what
Canada does best, but only if we can move the
product.”
That’s why the province wants to sit down with all
the stakeholders and discuss potential solutions.
According to Ag Minister Lyle Stewart, they’ve
already spoken with the Vancouver Port
Authority, and now they’re hoping grain handlers
and rail companies will share their concerns.
The grain side
But it’s not all about listening. Wall said they will
be pushing grain companies to use new federal
legislation, if need be, that would see some sort
of financial penalty placed against rail companies
who are underperforming.
“We’re not saying go there today. We’re saying
we need to start talking about all of the options,”
he said.
The legislation, called the Federal Fair Rail
Freight Services Act which was enacted late in
2012, has yet to be tested. But Stewart said they
will offer up their help to grain handlers looking to
try it out.
“It’s only grain companies that can actually test
the legislation,” said Stewart. “We’re willing to go
through that process with the grain companies—
people from our Ministry that is—and just see
how time consuming, and difficult (it is) and what
ramifications there may at the end of that road
for them so we can make recommendations to
the federal government as to whether or not the
legislation—in particular the penalty legislation—
is adequate.”
The delegation will also be raising concerns from
farmers over the base price of grains.
The rail side
The delegation will also meet with rail companies
to discuss why the backlog is happening and
what they can do to correct it.
Wall said grain companies have blamed some of
the backlog on cold weather. But he says that’s
not an answer that will sit well with farmers in
Saskatchewan.
“I think a lot of farmers are out there thinking to
themselves and recounting many, many cold
winters in the past where we’ve had, maybe not
a record harvest, but a big one, and we certainly
haven’t seen this degree of backlogs,” he said.
“We also know that in the case of some of the
rail companies, they have, over the years, taken
some layoffs. We know that we need more
engineers, arguably is what we’ve heard. And we
know that there needs to be more locomotives to
move the cars. So we know a little bit of what the
challenges are… if there needs to be resources
by the railways deployed, then they need to be
deployed.”
Wall said they will also be asking rail companies
to consider long-term plans that would increase
surge capacity in the rail system.
In the end, Wall said he’s hoping that talking to
all the companies involved in grain transportation
will help them make better recommendations to
the federal government for a plan going forward.
“The grain handlers work hand-in-hand with the
rail companies. And if there’s going to be a case
made that some other steps needed, I think the
federal government would like to see all the
stakeholders involved in that,” he said.
Unquote
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agstar77 posted Feb 19, 2014 23:33
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Railcars were never the problem. Government cars sat for two years N of Winnipeg. There are still some there. It is a lack of will.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 0:10
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After reading some of Harrison's comments in the financial post today, (thanks Jeff), if they don't go after the railways for collusion, racketeering, or market manipulation there is no sense in talking with them.
Call in the police and file charges.
They can't fix the problem.The railways are so far behind they can't fix it. Mathematically impossible.
Bottom line probably a billion dollars lost in Saskatchewan alone.
Ritz will meet with them next week after the CP locomotives have been pulling american trains around for two weeks. Jesus, he is a ****ing moron!
Really who would ever let this become this bad of a crisis.
North Dakota pulled the railways in after being a couple weeks behind.
RITZ was praising the railways in November when the RRs were 15000 cars behind. What he didn't think farmers could read the stats eventually. Did I mention he was a ****ing moron, yet?
If Mr. Boyd would have asked a couple weeks ago, I think he made have had a pretty good case, but today is one bitch of a day in Saskatchewan. Doubt you could see a train today. But you can't on a clear day either. ( just crack myself up sometimes )
I emailed that spokesperson and told her to read agriville for some ideas, when the provincial announcement was made.
Why is up to the provincial authorities to do the heavy lifting on a federal issue?
Sure would like to know who is red faced in Ottawa, hey RITZ and RAITT??
The next place that BOYD should go is to the graincos and ask them a few questions as well. Like why they were not booking cars when they were hedging the contracts???
And maybe why the graincos didn't say a peep about the problems months ago???
And why they publish their basis as minus 2.40 when in fact it is minus 3.00 bucks a bushel in CDN funds.
I would have liked to sit in front of some of those arrogant ****ing railway board members and quizzed them up. But as all of you know my language is a bit of a barrier. And yes I talk the same way around my 80 year old mother. Believe it. 6 sons and 3 daughters, she has heard it all, and every excuse as well. and yet not a bad word leaves her lips. Go figure.
I wish Mr. BOYD well in his endeavors.
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 0:29
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Well said bucket, including the 4 letter emphasis. I have 4 letter emotion vents also. I emailed Karen Hill links to here also. Thanks.
MP's got the same as well as Wall.
Yup I'd say file charges and extract compensation for farmer's losses. And Harrison, make him an example for the rest of the millionaire CEO's, arrogant f*cking morons as well.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 0:49
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Look I read new ag talk as well. Don't post, wouldn't last long.
Guys in North dakota are booking grain for over 6 bucks USD a bushel for wheat. And are pretty happy.
Thats about 6.50 cdn.
They are are no closer to the PNW than we are.
Where have we had this conversation before???
That is not what our elected conservative MPs told us would happen, much the contrary.
Think I am a little pissed, you bet.
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ALLFARMER posted Feb 20, 2014 1:56
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Bill Boyd
Read CP's 2012 Annual Report.
- active cars online -20%
- 450 locomotives now stored, returned or
declared surplus
- return notification on approx 5400 rail
cars
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ALLFARMER posted Feb 20, 2014 2:06
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Another thing /
Last week Wednesday we were told we could
haul canola. Canola with a contract
delivery of over 2 months ago. With -40
weather and grain bags we got 3 loads in
Thursday and Friday. Thought we were
gunna go hard and loaded the truck early
tuesday morning.(family day holiday
monday) Truck is still fn loaded. No
rail cars arrived Saturday!!!!!
Its easier to predict the weather then
rail car arrival.
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oneoff posted Feb 20, 2014 8:59
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You tell me the where the parallels differ between an interstate highway and the way they are managed when traffic comes to a standstill.
My understanding is that the first tow truck company that gets there with the necessary equipment gets the job clearing that immobilized freight truck and the ensuing traffic jam.
If that comany can't get the work done in a timely manner then they get turfed; and somebody else moves in. And that decision isn't made by the towing companies; and there aren't a dozen bills to be paid to those who couldn't perform or who showed up late.
My point being that critical infrastructure; in the hands of a couple near monopolies; shouldn't be shutting out shortlines and new players (from the mainline tracks). Especially whe "CN and CP" can't keep up with traffic demands.
In this day and age there is no reason that the exact location of every piece of locomotive power can't be tracked and identified in all of Canada. And it isn't as though nationaling a couple rail companies wouldn't be in the national interest when their prioities have strayed to focusing on cutting service and costs to the bone.
There is no deep committment to moving grain. I can't remember when there that comittment last existed. Can anyone else?
Quit talking with those railways and threaten them. There was idle locomotive power; and engines that are being scrapped because some CP CEO thinks they are fuel inefficient. O maye its a little deeper and that CEO bean counter is smart enough to now how to break a revenue cap forever and lease those idle locootives for big money at the same time .
This is pure corporate planning for a tighter long term stranglehold. And what is the chance of some relatively puny provincial politician getting those companies attention. This is a core disconnect with farmer's (and the Canadian economy; and our reputaion as a reliable grain supplier).
This will prove to be darn costly to the farm community; and provincial economies and after we get over this hump we will just face bigger hurdles in the future untill we get some control of our destinies. Lots of luck eh!! Tough times coming .... crappy cash advances and contracts that will barely cover costs providing you even get that bumper crop that certainly shouldn't be depended upon.
Let the competition and those with ideas be given their chance to show what they can do.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 9:10
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Unfortunately, people like David Anderson and BRutter believe there are no service providers that will run the canadian rails if it was opened up. And the rest of the conservatives believe that as well.
See the problem and the interests people take care of???
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 9:49
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Thought of this last night, Bill you must have access to real time satellite imagery, go count the cars yourself. Even imagery a few weeks old should show the mess. Anyone else?
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cottonpicken posted Feb 20, 2014 12:44
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I'm thankful Mr.Boyd is working on this.
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carebear300 posted Feb 20, 2014 13:48
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Good luck Bill, but I can just about guarantee all that will happen is you will leave the meeting even more frustrated. The railways will come forth with their same old excuses and nothing will be any different. If today they actually wanted to turn things around it would take till the road bans come on this spring. Sorry for being so pessimistic.
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 16:30
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Emailing this summary too...
http://www.ipolitics.ca/2014/02/19/grain-jam-five-reasons-why-the-grain-crisis-matters-to-you/
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sumdumguy posted Feb 20, 2014 21:26
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With I phones it is so simple to take a picture,
identify the location and the line and fire it in.
This is an important matter. If no one jumps on
the opportunity, don't complain.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 23:41
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Mr. Boyd
Here are a few questions for the railways.
1. How long does it take to get a train to Vancouver?
2. How many trains arrive at Vancouver on a daily average?
3. How do the railways call themselves efficient stopping to let another train pass?
4. How long does it take to stop and let a train pass?
5. Why do elevators get 16 hours to load 112 cars and the railways get 2 weeks or more to pick up the loaded train???
6. What is the average speed of a grain train?
7. How far out is the rail space booked and do they need more track?
8. Why are they idling or leasing locomotives? Same with grain cars?
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 1:21
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Im guessing who controlled the agenda at those railway-government meetings today and tomorrow.
Cold winter don't you agree....We're doing our best in tough situations with all the traffic demands...And all that oil traffic that is moving well for you Sask fellows etc.etc.
When you get down to it; the railways were here before there was any other real infrastructure. The railways owned a big chunk of land on either side of the rail right of ways (24 miles as I remember); and have statutes on the books from the earliest days. They have their own police force; capital; and assets that was given or paid for in the last 125 years; and we have been accustomed to respect their 15 meter right of way; and their right to interrupt trafficof every kind on any other property.
Perhaps that has conditioned everyone to believe that railways have the right to get their way in any matter.
For instance you can get a private crossing only in one of two ways. Either "by right" or "by grace". By right will depend on the year in which your agricultural land was severed by the rail line and the railways will point blank tell you they will fight you every inch of the way and you will never get the crossing in the forseeable future. You try the "by grace" argument and the rail management will tell you they are interested in removing; not providing additional crossing. They consider extremely accommodating to be an annual fee of $300; named insurance in the amount of $5 Million and your personal acceptance for all liability associated with anyone who tresspasses and uses the crossing for anything other than agricultural access. And you pay theull cost of the installation of the crossing. (that hasn't quite been true in the past in all cases); but I am sure it will soon be completely true in the near future.
So why not treat the railways in the same way and make them provide liability insurance from some third party company to be used in the event they fail to provide adequate rail service.
Play hardball Bill et al.
Oh I forgot that nobody can stand up to the powerful railway companies who have deliberately chosen to handle only the freight they decide to move; at least until that nasty revenue cap is removed.
Then they will continue to move the fright categories they decide to move at that time. And at the price that they demand from their captive market.
There are no alternatives; outside pipelines and floating in water. Not many navigable water systems in Sask and pipelines are difficult to construct in terms of government approvals. And those pipeline companies have about the same negative attitudes as the rail network.
We need some attitude changes amongst those involved in this crisis.
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mbratrud posted Feb 21, 2014 1:32
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There was a 100 Car unit train that sat at Weyburn Inland Terminal I believe it was for 9 days. Finally lifted last weekend.
We need you guys to work hard on this.
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Rareearth posted Feb 21, 2014 8:26
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And if they mention arctic vortex, the appropriate
question or response could be :
How can, how does, air airline industry, the Air
Force, operate in these conditions every day of
the year, the wind chill alone? They have done
this for decades now.
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 8:50
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If Mr. Boyd comes out defeated there are two solutions.
1. Nationalize the railways.
2. Start building another one.
It is that simple.
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 9:08
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Like Phil Robertson might say: I think
it is about time some of these Yuppies
where taught a lesson. Make us all Happy
Happy Happy!!
Yuppies:
In Duck Dynasty, Phil Robertson uses the
term to describe one who had adapted to
the urban lifestyle, and could not hold
their own if they were to have to go
into survival mode.
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 9:13
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You naysayers about building a railway realize that they have some pretty nice equipment to build railbeds and lay track, right???
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 9:24
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Its all called essential infrastructure. Railways or rural internet......somebody (our elected representatives have got to exert themselves and do something) have had first crack at it for decades.
Failure to lead, follow...then at least get out of the way. But this is so large and necessary infrastructure that it would break the country to again use resources to redo what was done by Canadians in the last century.
Give the railways an ultimatum for one last chance....and mean it.
As for rural internet; except for the backbone of fibre optics to towns throughout Sask, rural internet could be handled by rural residents.
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Hopalong posted Feb 21, 2014 10:14
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Where are the other western provinces on this
issue?
Seems to me they could be doing more.
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wauchope posted Feb 21, 2014 10:28
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Politicians piss me off
Bill is a farmer but I think he no longer worries about the farm bottom line.
according to john de pape, until the cold weather hit in December, the RR were hauling a record tonnage of grain.
john never explained the part that when cold weather hits, RR now have to reduce the cars in half for safety because the air brakes will not work on longer trains ,this is a fact and I am not defending the RR ,they simply had no choice. that may be the reason why that long line of cars sat at weyburn for so long and once it warmed up it may not have been that easy to allocate engines to go pick up the cars in a timely matter.
a good question to be asked is why don't they put an engine in the middle and I can't answer that because I don't know how many engines it takes to move a specific number of loaded cars.
add more engines ,hire more people ,build another rail line ? not easy nor quick solutions, disregarding the extreme costs to do all or any .
they are moving oil and making big money so there are fewer engines to move grain cars.
how many recall that Evraz almost laid off 400 union people because they were not able to move their steel products to market? that seemed to get resolved just in time.
transportation is becoming a nightmare for all commodities ,you can guess why and who to thank.
If I know this, I sure as hell believe that both Bill Boyd and Gerry Ritz already know about these problems and if they don't then they should resign their cushy tax paid jobs
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 10:29
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Alberta gets the trains when the railways are behind because its a quick turnaround.
Manitoba is guaranteed cars because of the flooding that shows up every spring, just like winter for the railways!.
And Saskatchewan doesn't matter. Our federal MPs are mute on this - why?
Where is David Anderson and Gerry Ritz, shouldn't they be beside Bill Boyd?
Some good an MP is when the single biggest issue of the day in Saskatchewan and he is nowhere to be found. That is a vote getter, hey?
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 10:43
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What really pisses me off is the amount of traffic on the highways that should be on trains.
It is not good enough to just say its cold and we don't have power, the railways created a trucking industry because of their lack of vision.
Really does there need to be bison trucks hauling double vans back and forth from regina to calgary? Seems insane. And it should be on rails.
Factor all that in, and increases in oil, potash, coal and grain, the railways were not ready for **** all.
Now throw in the fact they are reducing rolling stock, and how can the railways say they give a shit, with a straight face?
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 19:29
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I don't buy the air brake argument for long trains in cold weather.
If correct; the split the train in half and put half the locomotives o the long train of each of the two halves.
Problem solved. Damn idiots.
if you don't like that idea then put a locomotive ob each end of the long train. Supposed air brake problem solved. Damn idiots again.
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 19:41
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Also I don't buy the argument of a hundred plus cars trying to be pulled as one unit. Sometimes you don't have enough traction for half that hauling capacity.
Would you believe such a train taking a full three minutes for a single locomotive (screaming and one god awful howling) to get across a single crossing. A railroad employee was upahead sweeping the frost off the rails and they already had the train split in two pieces to eventually get up the valley. Imagine the damages and cost of that fiasco. Wouldn't it be more efficient to know what can and can not be physically accomplished on a railroad. Maybe they need more practice or retraining or brains????
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 20:38
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Maybe the RR would get more compassion
if we hadn't had been jerked around so
much every year, all year long.
'Train will be here tomorrow' (didn't
show) No engine, No cars, No engineers
or what ever excuse.
Then you have X hrs to load or you
loose incentive but they don't show to
pull for days or weeks. Cars show up not
fit to load (bad orders).
More to it than they have been
approached with yet.
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farming101 posted Feb 21, 2014 22:11
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I wonder whether having the CEO of one of the largest grain handling companies sitting on the board at CPR for the last seven years helped move things along??
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sumdumguy posted Feb 21, 2014 22:26
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Wmoebis, you are dead on the money. That is
the story of rail service. You just forgot to
mention, when you phone in to see when your
train can be expected, you get an answering
machine, then your password is expired. You
then car control. Car control says phone service
rep. No answer for 2 weeks, then an e-mail says
service rep will call you. Another week until a call
that says sorry I was in Mexico, but your cars
may be here in the next 4-6 weeks. 24 hour load
even if cars are spotted on a Sunday, but then
they go right by them for weeks. What a system!
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 22:45
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Elevator personnel working OT to make
10-12 hr loads. Only on weekends/long
weekends at time and half. Or getting in
early for loading then train shows up 2-
3 hrs late forcing over time. Truck's
lined up for hauling, farmers cleaning
snow from bins and bags only to have
them canceled and have to re plow.
All these costs roll straight back to
producers in many ways.
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Government of Saskatchewan is going to be
meeting with officials from both CN and CP rail.
We have heard there are grain cars sitting idle
across the province.
We need your help!
Would you please take pictures of cars that are
sitting idle in your area.
Also add:
Location and train run number
Length of time cars have been there.
Any other information you feel would be relevant.
Please send ASAP as we are meeting with CN
tomorrow morning in Montreal at 11am Est. and
CP on Friday morning.
Please forward to Bill.Boyd@gov.sk.ca
Thank you for your help.
Bill Boyd
Minister of the Economy
Province of Saskatchewan
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 21:34
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Would be glad to help but we don't have a
railroad in my town, but there is one at
Langbank. Anyone farmer online from Langbank?
parsley
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 21:35
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Nothing like pictures to make a point!
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mcfarms posted Feb 19, 2014 22:11
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Mr. Boyd
I hope they get you lots of pictures in the morning, thanks on behalf of I know many frustrated Alberta Producers for your efforts on this matter I'd like it more if our Alberta Ag minister was there with you but no one is quite sure who the Ag. Minister is in Alberta. ( I think his name is Claude Raines)
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caseman posted Feb 19, 2014 22:33
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bill boyd sure.....
its nice to ask for help what 24 hours before a meeting???????? sounds like a joke to me........
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caseman posted Feb 19, 2014 22:36
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bucket, what u think???
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 22:56
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I posted it on twitter and on my FB page. The
address is real. And so is the Minister. He isn't
much of a jokster, but he's dead serious about
the RR situation. I think most farmers are. Pars
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oneoff posted Feb 19, 2014 23:02
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Nothing like getting prepared a few minutes beore an "important" meeting.
That incompetence is no better than the railways failure to provide adequate service.
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fjlip posted Feb 19, 2014 23:17
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Yes Bill, October-December would have been a much better time. The horses have left the barn, and it's burning down as we have meetings behind closed doors and twiddle our thumbs over drinks in expensive hotels.
Dictate specific grain moving volumes or fine the hell out of them. Find out if those were 125 CP locomotives BNSF leased!
Jail the SOB IF that is true. We all await a press release.
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parsley posted Feb 19, 2014 23:20
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote
"Provincial delegation to seek solutions for grain
backlog
Will be talking to both grain and rail companies
about financial penalties, hiring more workers
and more
Reported by Aaron Stuckel
First Posted: Feb 12, 2014 3:44pm | Last
Updated: Feb 12, 2014 3:46pm
Change text size: -
The continued stall in grain shipments has the
provincial government forming a delegation that
will meet with both grain and rail companies to
find a solution.
Premier Brad Wall has appointed three cabinet
ministers to head the delegation. Agriculture
Minister Lyle Stewart, Economy Minister Bill Boyd
and Highways and Infrastructure Minister Don
McMorris have all been named to the delegation
along with Legislative Secretary for the
Agriculture Minister and MLA Scott Moe.
Clearing up the backlog in grain is a top priority
for the provincial government as farmers in
Saskatchewan continue to lose money as each
shipment misses its deadline. But Wall said it
also needs to be a priority for the federal
government because the country’s inability to get
grain to port puts the country’s reputation on the
line.
“It’s a huge issue for the country,” he said. “In a
world where the fastest growing economies want
food security and energy security, that’s what
Canada does best, but only if we can move the
product.”
That’s why the province wants to sit down with all
the stakeholders and discuss potential solutions.
According to Ag Minister Lyle Stewart, they’ve
already spoken with the Vancouver Port
Authority, and now they’re hoping grain handlers
and rail companies will share their concerns.
The grain side
But it’s not all about listening. Wall said they will
be pushing grain companies to use new federal
legislation, if need be, that would see some sort
of financial penalty placed against rail companies
who are underperforming.
“We’re not saying go there today. We’re saying
we need to start talking about all of the options,”
he said.
The legislation, called the Federal Fair Rail
Freight Services Act which was enacted late in
2012, has yet to be tested. But Stewart said they
will offer up their help to grain handlers looking to
try it out.
“It’s only grain companies that can actually test
the legislation,” said Stewart. “We’re willing to go
through that process with the grain companies—
people from our Ministry that is—and just see
how time consuming, and difficult (it is) and what
ramifications there may at the end of that road
for them so we can make recommendations to
the federal government as to whether or not the
legislation—in particular the penalty legislation—
is adequate.”
The delegation will also be raising concerns from
farmers over the base price of grains.
The rail side
The delegation will also meet with rail companies
to discuss why the backlog is happening and
what they can do to correct it.
Wall said grain companies have blamed some of
the backlog on cold weather. But he says that’s
not an answer that will sit well with farmers in
Saskatchewan.
“I think a lot of farmers are out there thinking to
themselves and recounting many, many cold
winters in the past where we’ve had, maybe not
a record harvest, but a big one, and we certainly
haven’t seen this degree of backlogs,” he said.
“We also know that in the case of some of the
rail companies, they have, over the years, taken
some layoffs. We know that we need more
engineers, arguably is what we’ve heard. And we
know that there needs to be more locomotives to
move the cars. So we know a little bit of what the
challenges are… if there needs to be resources
by the railways deployed, then they need to be
deployed.”
Wall said they will also be asking rail companies
to consider long-term plans that would increase
surge capacity in the rail system.
In the end, Wall said he’s hoping that talking to
all the companies involved in grain transportation
will help them make better recommendations to
the federal government for a plan going forward.
“The grain handlers work hand-in-hand with the
rail companies. And if there’s going to be a case
made that some other steps needed, I think the
federal government would like to see all the
stakeholders involved in that,” he said.
Unquote
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agstar77 posted Feb 19, 2014 23:33
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Railcars were never the problem. Government cars sat for two years N of Winnipeg. There are still some there. It is a lack of will.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 0:10
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After reading some of Harrison's comments in the financial post today, (thanks Jeff), if they don't go after the railways for collusion, racketeering, or market manipulation there is no sense in talking with them.
Call in the police and file charges.
They can't fix the problem.The railways are so far behind they can't fix it. Mathematically impossible.
Bottom line probably a billion dollars lost in Saskatchewan alone.
Ritz will meet with them next week after the CP locomotives have been pulling american trains around for two weeks. Jesus, he is a ****ing moron!
Really who would ever let this become this bad of a crisis.
North Dakota pulled the railways in after being a couple weeks behind.
RITZ was praising the railways in November when the RRs were 15000 cars behind. What he didn't think farmers could read the stats eventually. Did I mention he was a ****ing moron, yet?
If Mr. Boyd would have asked a couple weeks ago, I think he made have had a pretty good case, but today is one bitch of a day in Saskatchewan. Doubt you could see a train today. But you can't on a clear day either. ( just crack myself up sometimes )
I emailed that spokesperson and told her to read agriville for some ideas, when the provincial announcement was made.
Why is up to the provincial authorities to do the heavy lifting on a federal issue?
Sure would like to know who is red faced in Ottawa, hey RITZ and RAITT??
The next place that BOYD should go is to the graincos and ask them a few questions as well. Like why they were not booking cars when they were hedging the contracts???
And maybe why the graincos didn't say a peep about the problems months ago???
And why they publish their basis as minus 2.40 when in fact it is minus 3.00 bucks a bushel in CDN funds.
I would have liked to sit in front of some of those arrogant ****ing railway board members and quizzed them up. But as all of you know my language is a bit of a barrier. And yes I talk the same way around my 80 year old mother. Believe it. 6 sons and 3 daughters, she has heard it all, and every excuse as well. and yet not a bad word leaves her lips. Go figure.
I wish Mr. BOYD well in his endeavors.
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 0:29
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Well said bucket, including the 4 letter emphasis. I have 4 letter emotion vents also. I emailed Karen Hill links to here also. Thanks.
MP's got the same as well as Wall.
Yup I'd say file charges and extract compensation for farmer's losses. And Harrison, make him an example for the rest of the millionaire CEO's, arrogant f*cking morons as well.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 0:49
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Look I read new ag talk as well. Don't post, wouldn't last long.
Guys in North dakota are booking grain for over 6 bucks USD a bushel for wheat. And are pretty happy.
Thats about 6.50 cdn.
They are are no closer to the PNW than we are.
Where have we had this conversation before???
That is not what our elected conservative MPs told us would happen, much the contrary.
Think I am a little pissed, you bet.
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ALLFARMER posted Feb 20, 2014 1:56
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Bill Boyd
Read CP's 2012 Annual Report.
- active cars online -20%
- 450 locomotives now stored, returned or
declared surplus
- return notification on approx 5400 rail
cars
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ALLFARMER posted Feb 20, 2014 2:06
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Another thing /
Last week Wednesday we were told we could
haul canola. Canola with a contract
delivery of over 2 months ago. With -40
weather and grain bags we got 3 loads in
Thursday and Friday. Thought we were
gunna go hard and loaded the truck early
tuesday morning.(family day holiday
monday) Truck is still fn loaded. No
rail cars arrived Saturday!!!!!
Its easier to predict the weather then
rail car arrival.
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oneoff posted Feb 20, 2014 8:59
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You tell me the where the parallels differ between an interstate highway and the way they are managed when traffic comes to a standstill.
My understanding is that the first tow truck company that gets there with the necessary equipment gets the job clearing that immobilized freight truck and the ensuing traffic jam.
If that comany can't get the work done in a timely manner then they get turfed; and somebody else moves in. And that decision isn't made by the towing companies; and there aren't a dozen bills to be paid to those who couldn't perform or who showed up late.
My point being that critical infrastructure; in the hands of a couple near monopolies; shouldn't be shutting out shortlines and new players (from the mainline tracks). Especially whe "CN and CP" can't keep up with traffic demands.
In this day and age there is no reason that the exact location of every piece of locomotive power can't be tracked and identified in all of Canada. And it isn't as though nationaling a couple rail companies wouldn't be in the national interest when their prioities have strayed to focusing on cutting service and costs to the bone.
There is no deep committment to moving grain. I can't remember when there that comittment last existed. Can anyone else?
Quit talking with those railways and threaten them. There was idle locomotive power; and engines that are being scrapped because some CP CEO thinks they are fuel inefficient. O maye its a little deeper and that CEO bean counter is smart enough to now how to break a revenue cap forever and lease those idle locootives for big money at the same time .
This is pure corporate planning for a tighter long term stranglehold. And what is the chance of some relatively puny provincial politician getting those companies attention. This is a core disconnect with farmer's (and the Canadian economy; and our reputaion as a reliable grain supplier).
This will prove to be darn costly to the farm community; and provincial economies and after we get over this hump we will just face bigger hurdles in the future untill we get some control of our destinies. Lots of luck eh!! Tough times coming .... crappy cash advances and contracts that will barely cover costs providing you even get that bumper crop that certainly shouldn't be depended upon.
Let the competition and those with ideas be given their chance to show what they can do.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 9:10
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Unfortunately, people like David Anderson and BRutter believe there are no service providers that will run the canadian rails if it was opened up. And the rest of the conservatives believe that as well.
See the problem and the interests people take care of???
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 9:49
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Thought of this last night, Bill you must have access to real time satellite imagery, go count the cars yourself. Even imagery a few weeks old should show the mess. Anyone else?
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cottonpicken posted Feb 20, 2014 12:44
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I'm thankful Mr.Boyd is working on this.
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carebear300 posted Feb 20, 2014 13:48
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Good luck Bill, but I can just about guarantee all that will happen is you will leave the meeting even more frustrated. The railways will come forth with their same old excuses and nothing will be any different. If today they actually wanted to turn things around it would take till the road bans come on this spring. Sorry for being so pessimistic.
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fjlip posted Feb 20, 2014 16:30
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Emailing this summary too...
http://www.ipolitics.ca/2014/02/19/grain-jam-five-reasons-why-the-grain-crisis-matters-to-you/
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sumdumguy posted Feb 20, 2014 21:26
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With I phones it is so simple to take a picture,
identify the location and the line and fire it in.
This is an important matter. If no one jumps on
the opportunity, don't complain.
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bucket posted Feb 20, 2014 23:41
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Mr. Boyd
Here are a few questions for the railways.
1. How long does it take to get a train to Vancouver?
2. How many trains arrive at Vancouver on a daily average?
3. How do the railways call themselves efficient stopping to let another train pass?
4. How long does it take to stop and let a train pass?
5. Why do elevators get 16 hours to load 112 cars and the railways get 2 weeks or more to pick up the loaded train???
6. What is the average speed of a grain train?
7. How far out is the rail space booked and do they need more track?
8. Why are they idling or leasing locomotives? Same with grain cars?
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 1:21
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Im guessing who controlled the agenda at those railway-government meetings today and tomorrow.
Cold winter don't you agree....We're doing our best in tough situations with all the traffic demands...And all that oil traffic that is moving well for you Sask fellows etc.etc.
When you get down to it; the railways were here before there was any other real infrastructure. The railways owned a big chunk of land on either side of the rail right of ways (24 miles as I remember); and have statutes on the books from the earliest days. They have their own police force; capital; and assets that was given or paid for in the last 125 years; and we have been accustomed to respect their 15 meter right of way; and their right to interrupt trafficof every kind on any other property.
Perhaps that has conditioned everyone to believe that railways have the right to get their way in any matter.
For instance you can get a private crossing only in one of two ways. Either "by right" or "by grace". By right will depend on the year in which your agricultural land was severed by the rail line and the railways will point blank tell you they will fight you every inch of the way and you will never get the crossing in the forseeable future. You try the "by grace" argument and the rail management will tell you they are interested in removing; not providing additional crossing. They consider extremely accommodating to be an annual fee of $300; named insurance in the amount of $5 Million and your personal acceptance for all liability associated with anyone who tresspasses and uses the crossing for anything other than agricultural access. And you pay theull cost of the installation of the crossing. (that hasn't quite been true in the past in all cases); but I am sure it will soon be completely true in the near future.
So why not treat the railways in the same way and make them provide liability insurance from some third party company to be used in the event they fail to provide adequate rail service.
Play hardball Bill et al.
Oh I forgot that nobody can stand up to the powerful railway companies who have deliberately chosen to handle only the freight they decide to move; at least until that nasty revenue cap is removed.
Then they will continue to move the fright categories they decide to move at that time. And at the price that they demand from their captive market.
There are no alternatives; outside pipelines and floating in water. Not many navigable water systems in Sask and pipelines are difficult to construct in terms of government approvals. And those pipeline companies have about the same negative attitudes as the rail network.
We need some attitude changes amongst those involved in this crisis.
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mbratrud posted Feb 21, 2014 1:32
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There was a 100 Car unit train that sat at Weyburn Inland Terminal I believe it was for 9 days. Finally lifted last weekend.
We need you guys to work hard on this.
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Rareearth posted Feb 21, 2014 8:26
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And if they mention arctic vortex, the appropriate
question or response could be :
How can, how does, air airline industry, the Air
Force, operate in these conditions every day of
the year, the wind chill alone? They have done
this for decades now.
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 8:50
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If Mr. Boyd comes out defeated there are two solutions.
1. Nationalize the railways.
2. Start building another one.
It is that simple.
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 9:08
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Like Phil Robertson might say: I think
it is about time some of these Yuppies
where taught a lesson. Make us all Happy
Happy Happy!!
Yuppies:
In Duck Dynasty, Phil Robertson uses the
term to describe one who had adapted to
the urban lifestyle, and could not hold
their own if they were to have to go
into survival mode.
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 9:13
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You naysayers about building a railway realize that they have some pretty nice equipment to build railbeds and lay track, right???
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 9:24
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Its all called essential infrastructure. Railways or rural internet......somebody (our elected representatives have got to exert themselves and do something) have had first crack at it for decades.
Failure to lead, follow...then at least get out of the way. But this is so large and necessary infrastructure that it would break the country to again use resources to redo what was done by Canadians in the last century.
Give the railways an ultimatum for one last chance....and mean it.
As for rural internet; except for the backbone of fibre optics to towns throughout Sask, rural internet could be handled by rural residents.
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Hopalong posted Feb 21, 2014 10:14
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Where are the other western provinces on this
issue?
Seems to me they could be doing more.
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wauchope posted Feb 21, 2014 10:28
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Politicians piss me off
Bill is a farmer but I think he no longer worries about the farm bottom line.
according to john de pape, until the cold weather hit in December, the RR were hauling a record tonnage of grain.
john never explained the part that when cold weather hits, RR now have to reduce the cars in half for safety because the air brakes will not work on longer trains ,this is a fact and I am not defending the RR ,they simply had no choice. that may be the reason why that long line of cars sat at weyburn for so long and once it warmed up it may not have been that easy to allocate engines to go pick up the cars in a timely matter.
a good question to be asked is why don't they put an engine in the middle and I can't answer that because I don't know how many engines it takes to move a specific number of loaded cars.
add more engines ,hire more people ,build another rail line ? not easy nor quick solutions, disregarding the extreme costs to do all or any .
they are moving oil and making big money so there are fewer engines to move grain cars.
how many recall that Evraz almost laid off 400 union people because they were not able to move their steel products to market? that seemed to get resolved just in time.
transportation is becoming a nightmare for all commodities ,you can guess why and who to thank.
If I know this, I sure as hell believe that both Bill Boyd and Gerry Ritz already know about these problems and if they don't then they should resign their cushy tax paid jobs
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 10:29
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Alberta gets the trains when the railways are behind because its a quick turnaround.
Manitoba is guaranteed cars because of the flooding that shows up every spring, just like winter for the railways!.
And Saskatchewan doesn't matter. Our federal MPs are mute on this - why?
Where is David Anderson and Gerry Ritz, shouldn't they be beside Bill Boyd?
Some good an MP is when the single biggest issue of the day in Saskatchewan and he is nowhere to be found. That is a vote getter, hey?
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bucket posted Feb 21, 2014 10:43
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What really pisses me off is the amount of traffic on the highways that should be on trains.
It is not good enough to just say its cold and we don't have power, the railways created a trucking industry because of their lack of vision.
Really does there need to be bison trucks hauling double vans back and forth from regina to calgary? Seems insane. And it should be on rails.
Factor all that in, and increases in oil, potash, coal and grain, the railways were not ready for **** all.
Now throw in the fact they are reducing rolling stock, and how can the railways say they give a shit, with a straight face?
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 19:29
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I don't buy the air brake argument for long trains in cold weather.
If correct; the split the train in half and put half the locomotives o the long train of each of the two halves.
Problem solved. Damn idiots.
if you don't like that idea then put a locomotive ob each end of the long train. Supposed air brake problem solved. Damn idiots again.
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oneoff posted Feb 21, 2014 19:41
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Also I don't buy the argument of a hundred plus cars trying to be pulled as one unit. Sometimes you don't have enough traction for half that hauling capacity.
Would you believe such a train taking a full three minutes for a single locomotive (screaming and one god awful howling) to get across a single crossing. A railroad employee was upahead sweeping the frost off the rails and they already had the train split in two pieces to eventually get up the valley. Imagine the damages and cost of that fiasco. Wouldn't it be more efficient to know what can and can not be physically accomplished on a railroad. Maybe they need more practice or retraining or brains????
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 20:38
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Maybe the RR would get more compassion
if we hadn't had been jerked around so
much every year, all year long.
'Train will be here tomorrow' (didn't
show) No engine, No cars, No engineers
or what ever excuse.
Then you have X hrs to load or you
loose incentive but they don't show to
pull for days or weeks. Cars show up not
fit to load (bad orders).
More to it than they have been
approached with yet.
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farming101 posted Feb 21, 2014 22:11
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I wonder whether having the CEO of one of the largest grain handling companies sitting on the board at CPR for the last seven years helped move things along??
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sumdumguy posted Feb 21, 2014 22:26
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Wmoebis, you are dead on the money. That is
the story of rail service. You just forgot to
mention, when you phone in to see when your
train can be expected, you get an answering
machine, then your password is expired. You
then car control. Car control says phone service
rep. No answer for 2 weeks, then an e-mail says
service rep will call you. Another week until a call
that says sorry I was in Mexico, but your cars
may be here in the next 4-6 weeks. 24 hour load
even if cars are spotted on a Sunday, but then
they go right by them for weeks. What a system!
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wmoebis posted Feb 21, 2014 22:45
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Elevator personnel working OT to make
10-12 hr loads. Only on weekends/long
weekends at time and half. Or getting in
early for loading then train shows up 2-
3 hrs late forcing over time. Truck's
lined up for hauling, farmers cleaning
snow from bins and bags only to have
them canceled and have to re plow.
All these costs roll straight back to
producers in many ways.
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