I could support a Carbon tax if it were for all the right reasons.

[samhill]

If it's any consolation, remember in our world, our planet, matter is neither created nor destroyed, merely changed to a different form or composition. Still available when someone discovers how to access and use it.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

BigLentil, that chart, showing exponential growth is exactly what fossil fuels have allowed. But if you extrapolate any exponential function very far, you will find that exponential growth is always impossible for very long in a finite environment. Look at a chart of energy consumption, it looks just like that one, and is just as unsustainable, in fact I am quite certain that the population chart will exactly follow the energy growth chart, on the way up and down(inevitably) If we keep on the path we are on, both charts are going to have a precipitous fall, with a little conservation a bit sooner, maybe they could both level off a bit instead.

Called the most important video you'll ever see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZA9Hnp3aV4 about exponential growth.

I am very optimistic about humans ability to innovate our way out of the next energy crisis. But that innovation is going to require a lot of energy in itself, not to mention peace, and order and resources. If we all keep burning hydrocarbons like there is no tomorrow, when the next energy crisis comes( and it is probably 20 or more years away yet, as commodity cycles go) there might not be enough energy, peace or order to make the transition. And I'm not sure that I trust the general population or government to have enough foresight to allocate remaining supplies to farmers if push comes to shove. When we see our clueless current leader pull a stunt like this, it gives me even less hope that they would do the right thing in a real crisis.

[oneoff]

Power of doubling. Needs to be brought up to at same exponential rapidity; just to keep newcomers aware.

[grassfarmer]

Absolutely AF5, I have said many times that irregardless of the causes of climate change the solutions put forward involving reducing fossil fuel use are needed for sustainability anyway. It should be obvious to anybody with a brain that we can't continue to burn through finite resources at the rate we are. We live in a wasteful world - how many resources does it take to support the Kardashian family who appear to contribute nothing of value to society? Extreme examples apart we are not immune to waste in agriculture. The North American food system from field to plate including processing, transportation etc is said to use 13.3 calories of energy (mostly fossil fuel) for each calorie going into the consumers mouth. An old fashioned agriculture using mostly human and animal energy as still happens in many parts of the world would typically return 3-6 calories of food for every calorie expended.

[biglentil]

And your solution grassfarmer return us to the stone age? Do your part 1st grassfarmer tear down all your barbwire fences, sell the herd, let the bison roam free and move into teepee. Taxing us so JT can provide a full handout to another 50000 immigrants will hardly solve the problem.

[Hopalong]

Some good points and interesting discussion.
Takes me back to time of national energy policy of elder Trudeau.
Point was often made that fossil fuel resources are finite and that we should save them for benefit of future generations. Do not remember climate change and green house gasses being much of an issue.
Since that time, technology has made world running out of oil much less of an issue, also advances in alternative energy.
Think we give too much attention to fearmongers and not enough to our ability to develope new technology.

[foragefarmer]

Albertafarmer

You obviously put some thought into your post, compared to so many other posters that have ranted on and on about how bad the Carbon Tax will be, and running down anybody not agreeing with them. There are so many details that haven't been released, so I'm not sure how any opinions can be formed at this point.

The consumption of oil can not continue on the pace it is, as it will eventually run out, efforts have to be made to find some type of alternative energy sources, and let's have some faith in human innovation to come up with them. When our forefathers were farming with horses I'm sure with the arrival of the first steam powered farm equipment they were skeptical. Fuel consumption has to be curbed somehow, when driving in the cities or on major highways you see far to many single person vehicles on the road, car pooling or public transit is being less and less.

If the tax is funneled to research and development to increase fuel efficacy within Canada, or for new technology which could in itself become an major industry adding jobs within the country which could be sold or exported to other countries, I'm for it.


Yes, I know as farmers we have no alternative at this point to put and take off our crops with what we have, and will continue to use the current technology, but we don't even know how this tax will effect us at this point.

[furrowtickler]

this whole global warming thing reminds me of the false WMD the Iraq never had . It won't be till 15-20 years from now they will admit this was just a scam to pull money from one sector to anouther.
This is simply wealth transfer under a clown mask.
This will have zero effect on how much carbon dioxide is being emitted

[nicolaas]

is this carbon tax to be levied against industry as well? Or is it just for the public? The one in BC is essentially revenue neutral I hear. I am curious to see how it will affect ag.

[bucket]

K+S potash signed an agreement with nature conservancy of Canada to offset their emissions. ..that's where the transfer happens.



Neighbors sell their land to NCC then rent it back.... then the NCC peddles this land as a carbon sink for big money....but no government will direct pay to farmers the same fees.