Taxes on gasoline average 38% of the cost across Canada

[saskcanfarmer]

Chuck - That's the whole issue. If a carbon tax is implemented to reduce consumption then the price of carbon would have to be set to astronomical levels. That's why a 20$-50$/mt is just a cash grab or wealth distribution hurting wealth creators as well as the rural population.

[chuckChuck]

Instead of speculating on what impact the carbon tax will have visit the following website which explains how it will work.
https://www.alberta.ca/climate-carbon-pricing.aspx#p184s3

Some highlights:
Farm fuel is exempt, 60% of Alberta households will get a rebate, rebates will be tied to income, this will still provide Albertans a financial incentive to reduce emissions.

Six of 10 Alberta households will receive a rebate that covers the average cost of the carbon levy.

The indirect costs of the carbon levy are estimated to range between:

$50 to $70 per household in 2017
$70 to $105 per household in 2018

Indirect costs of the carbon levy on Alberta households were calculated using a detailed Alberta Input-Output model, which is based on Statistics Canada data and reflects inter-industry as well as cross-border trade flows that occur while producing a specific good or service consumed by Alberta households. To develop the ranges, it is assumed that businesses subject to the levy pass through 50% to 75% of the related costs to consumers.

Small business tax cut

To help businesses adjust to the carbon levy, Alberta’s small business corporate income tax rate was reduced by one third, from 3% to 2% effective Jan 1, 2017. The reduction is projected to save small business owners $185 million in 2017-18.

With the tax relief, Alberta is now tied with Saskatchewan for the second-lowest provincial small business tax rate. While Manitoba has a lower rate, Alberta small business owners pay lower taxes when they take money out of their business for personal use. Alberta maintains the lowest overall tax regime in Canada, with no provincial sales tax, health premium or payroll tax.

[westernvicki]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenue_as_percentage_of_ GDP

Canada has a relatively high rate of tax to GDP the question is Chuckchuck: how high can it go before it impedes growth and that is the question? And that is the one that counts.

[westernvicki]

And if you take time to check and compare, we are quite high, and a spending spree without an increased GDP, may not be that kind to the future economic balance.

It's that straw; camel.

[furrowtickler]

Exactly Vickie - there is a breaking point to everything

[Hamloc]

The carbon tax is not insignificant and I hope my explanation makes sense. Had my fertilizer delivered yesterday and when I signed for it there was the number of kilometres traveled to my farm from the plant written on it. I asked why. Turns out as a truck that was used for hauling fertilizer back to Alberta from out of province this truck was registered under IFTA. Each month the company tracks how many kilometres this truck travels in which provinces and where fuel is purchased. Then if fuel was all purchased in Alberta the road tax for the number of kilometres in Saskatchewan must be submitted to Saskatchewan. Now if they purchase fuel in Saskatchewan but travel less kilometres in Saskatchewan than road tax payed they then apply monthly to have this rebated. Since the imposition of the Alberta carbon tax it now pays to fuel the IFTA registered trucks up in Saskatchewan. It used to be cheaper to fuel in Alberta and submit the road tax to Saskatchewan, since the imposition of the carbon tax the opposite is true. So yeah Chuck2, it is only 5 percent but it is significant!!!!

[chuckChuck]

When it comes to debt to GDP ratios, Canada is in the middle of the pack when looking at developed countries.

The USA is worse off. Interestingly most of northern Europe and Scandinavia are in much better shape. They have higher tax rates, lower debt and stronger spending on social programs along with strong economies.

So many of the arguments about overspending on social programs don't always result in higher levels of debt or weaker economies.

[bgmb]

Check out Petro Canada's breakdown of gas taxes in Canada.
http://retail.petro-canada.ca/en/fuelsavings/gas-taxes-canada.aspx

Alberta: 70.7¢ Base Price, Federal Excise 10.0¢, GST 5%, Carbon Tax 4.49¢/litre, Provincial Gas tax 13.0¢/litre

BC: 70.7¢ Base Price, Federal Excise 10.0¢, GST 5%, Carbon Tax 6.67¢/litre, Provincial Gas Tax 14.5¢/litre

So the question is since carbon taxes are such small amount of the price of gasoline how could they have such a negative economic impact as some people are claiming?

Any equal to the carbon tax market price rise in the price of gasoline should have the same impact correct?

Check out historical gas prices in Ontario. In early 2014, gas in Ontario was a 1.40 per litre
http://www.ontariogasprices.com/retail_price_chart.aspx

At a 1.40 per litre the impact should have been substantially more than any current or proposed carbon tax.

Why is there, or why was there such a muted response to market increases in gas prices and existing gas taxes, but extreme outrage by a few to a much smaller carbon tax?

I can explain it. Pure politics! Plain and simple!

#1 carbon tax isn't just on fuel.

#2 why use carbon as a way to tax? Are we going to tax ppl for breathing or volcanoes for erupting? Lots of ppl see taxing am inert gas as a am attack on wealth creation.

[chuckChuck]

Carbon taxes are a method to reduce fossil energy use and carbon emissions. If they cause higher prices then businesses and consumers will use less fossil energy and get more efficient. The taxes collected will be redistributed in the economy by tax cuts, investments in other forms of energy, and rebates to name a few.

If your argument is higher energy prices including taxes are an attack on wealth creation then the same should be said for higher energy prices based on normal market changes.

When oil is a $100 per barrel there is a tremendous transfer of wealth from consumers to oil producing regions around the world.

This causes consumers to spend more on energy and less on other things. Which in effect is an attack on consumers disposable income and their ability to create wealth ( savings and investments).

[blackpowder]

'canada first energy plan'

[Oliver88]

'canada first energy plan'

This is a great idea for several reasons.
Banning OPEC/Islamic Terrorist funding oil from being imported into Canada would reduce funding for terrorists and oppressive regimes and dictators.
A second reason is it would be nice to see how long eastern Canada could last without OPEC oil and maybe they would demand an oil pipeline to satisfy their oil needs for their homes and vehicles.

[Hamloc]

When it comes to debt to GDP ratios, Canada is in the middle of the pack when looking at developed countries.

The USA is worse off. Interestingly most of northern Europe and Scandinavia are in much better shape. They have higher tax rates, lower debt and stronger spending on social programs along with strong economies.

So many of the arguments about overspending on social programs don't always result in higher levels of debt or weaker economies.

Chuck2, our debt to GDP stood at 91.5% at the end of 2015. Very few if any of our provincial governments have balanced budgets and the Liberals are adding far more debt than they initially projected. Between Trudeau, Notley and Wynnochio we will soon surpass 100% and you are advocating for more taxes and more spending. Hard to believe.

[vvalk]

Instead of speculating on what impact the carbon tax will have visit the following website which explains how it will work.
https://www.alberta.ca/climate-carbon-pricing.aspx#p184s3

Some highlights:
Farm fuel is exempt, 60% of Alberta households will get a rebate, rebates will be tied to income, this will still provide Albertans a financial incentive to reduce emissions.

Six of 10 Alberta households will receive a rebate that covers the average cost of the carbon levy.

The indirect costs of the carbon levy are estimated to range between:

$50 to $70 per household in 2017
$70 to $105 per household in 2018

Indirect costs of the carbon levy on Alberta households were calculated using a detailed Alberta Input-Output model, which is based on Statistics Canada data and reflects inter-industry as well as cross-border trade flows that occur while producing a specific good or service consumed by Alberta households. To develop the ranges, it is assumed that businesses subject to the levy pass through 50% to 75% of the related costs to consumers.

Small business tax cut

To help businesses adjust to the carbon levy, Alberta’s small business corporate income tax rate was reduced by one third, from 3% to 2% effective Jan 1, 2017. The reduction is projected to save small business owners $185 million in 2017-18.

With the tax relief, Alberta is now tied with Saskatchewan for the second-lowest provincial small business tax rate. While Manitoba has a lower rate, Alberta small business owners pay lower taxes when they take money out of their business for personal use. Alberta maintains the lowest overall tax regime in Canada, with no provincial sales tax, health premium or payroll tax.

Must be true hey Chuck. Got it off the website. Ever seen how they get 6/10 people get rebates back? They calculate that families use about $3-4000 a year on food. Bunch of other numbers that don't make sense. A family spending $10-15 a day on food? The way I see it chuck is your one of those people who likes other people paying all the taxes. You get your rebate and pay your 25% income tax while everyone else foots the bill to really pay for all your ideological programs. On a side note did you hear the union ad on the radio about the city of Calgary cutting jobs to save money? Whining and complaining. Imagine all the ads if everyone did that. Private sector job cuts ok. Bloated public sector jog cuts forget about it!

[vvalk]

That ad was stating that there was no good reason for the cuts. That saving $11M a year was the only reason. Sums up left wing mentality pretty nicely that saving money or spending equal or less then you make isn't a good enough reason. The unions are completely out of control when you hear an ad like that

[oneoff]

Do you seriously think the carbon tax is only going to apply to fuel we purchase?
It will be charged on everything - even after your dead - remember the cremation carbon tax ? You have just commented on it

Furrow....you're talking to one of those who only listens to that which confirms what he already knows.

At the local Coop retail gas sign the price increased by 18 cents a liter since Christmas day. Yes it did drop 6 cents maybe a week ago. Why I wouldn't know.



In the USA at both a little town and a larger city it went up 10 cents (US) per US gallon.

It did go up in Canada because somebody put it up. And not because of significant foreign exchange differences; and not because of world price of oil in US and Canada; but lets just attribute it to lame excuses and even carbon tax issues that Federated coops took advantage off.

And even cremation services might have gone up a thousand bucks; but I bet no funeral home will ever make that stupid mistake of trying to collect a $10.00 or 100.00 tax when there are so much better ways to bill and collect multiple times larger amounts without a whimper.